Why does Most of the Arab World Deny Jews/Israel Belong in the MIddle East.

Originally posted by Souljah
...and it is OKEY to say "god forsaken a** hole of a country"

Actually Souljah, the term I used was" S*** hole."

I just don't want you to get a warning for missquoting me.

[edit on 9-12-2005 by American Mad Man]

My main thoughts on this are that most of the Arab world is not just anti Zionist and anti Israel but really it all just boils down to racism. Yes there is racism on both sides it just looks more systematic on the Arab/Muslim side.

The demonization of of Jews as animals and subhuman in a substantial part of the Arab media it the clincher for me. I know the Arab world has the complex of being beat by Israel multiple times in armed conflict. That still doesn't make it right for them to describe all Jewish people with such derogotory terms. The schooling of their youths in this matter is what is truly disturbing.

I tend to agree with some of the posters here....neither side wants or is capable of living in peace with each other anymore. There will be no last side standing either, in the end both will lose.

Originally posted by pavil
My main thoughts on this are that most of the Arab world is not just anti Zionist and anti Israel but really it all just boils down to racism. Yes there is racism on both sides it just looks more systematic on the Arab/Muslim side.

The demonization of of Jews as animals and subhuman in a substantial part of the Arab media it the clincher for me. I know the Arab world has the complex of being beat by Israel multiple times in armed conflict. That still doesn't make it right for them to describe all Jewish people with such derogotory terms. The schooling of their youths in this matter is what is truly disturbing.

I tend to agree with some of the posters here....neither side wants or is capable of living in peace with each other anymore. There will be no last side standing either, in the end both will lose.

Isn't it the Jews who say that all Gentiles are basically animals? Or was that beneath animals?

Originally posted by truthseeka
Isn't it the Jews who say that all Gentiles are basically animals? Or was that beneath animals?

Please show me where that is taught in Jewish schools and printed in mainstream Jewish Newspapers or in their other media? I am pretty sure it is easily proved that a good portion of the Arab media and education systems more often than not portray Jewish people in general, not just Israel and or Zionism, in a very negative light.

When palestine was taken by muslims, Israeili Jews were forced to flee or convert and stay.

Before Jews of European nationals started fleeing to Palestine in vast numbers just after the fall of Ottoman empire, Palestinian jews and muslims were living together.

Prophet Muhammed (Peace be upon him) formed an alliance with a Jewish tribe, the Qurayza. In the heat of battle, they betrayed Muhammad's(PBUH) army and allied with the Meccans (As it seemed the latter was winning the war). When the Muslims overcame the Meccan army, and they surrendered. There was the issue of dealing with those who committed treason, the specific Jewish tribe in question. The Qurayza came out of their fort and surrendered.

After that the Jewish were considered traitors, dishonourable and not to be trusted, a rough version of that story is what I got to learn after asking why the Muslims dislike the Jews so much.

Originally posted by pavil

Originally posted by truthseeka
Isn't it the Jews who say that all Gentiles are basically animals? Or was that beneath animals?

Please show me where that is taught in Jewish schools and printed in mainstream Jewish Newspapers or in their other media?

If a Jew is tempted to do evil he should go to a city where he is not known and do the evil there. Hitting a Jew is the same as hitting God - Sanhedrin 58b

If a heathen (gentile) hits a Jew, the gentile must be killed. O.K. to Cheat Non-Jews - Sanhedrin 57a

A Jew need not pay a gentile ("Cuthean") the wages owed him for work. Jews Have Superior Legal Status - Baba Kamma 37b.

"If an ox of an Israelite gores an ox of a Canaanite there is no liability; but if an ox of a Canaanite gores an ox of an Israelite...the payment is to be in full." Jews May Steal from Non-Jews - Baba Mezia 24a

If a Jew finds an object lost by a gentile ("heathen") it does not have to be returned. (Affirmed also in Baba Kamma 113b) - Sanhedrin 76a

God will not spare a Jew who "marries his daughter to an old man or takes a wife for his infant son or returns a lost article to a Cuthean..."

Jews May Rob and Kill Non-Jews - Sanhedrin 57a

When a Jew murders a gentile ("Cuthean"), there will be no death penalty. What a Jew steals from a gentile he may keep - Baba Kamma 37b

The gentiles are outside the protection of the law and God has "exposed their money to Israel." Jews May Lie to Non-Jews - Baba Kamma 113a

Jews may use lies ("subterfuges") to circumvent a Gentile. Non-Jewish Children are Sub-Human - Yebamoth 98a

These quotes were taken from a question given to a rabbi at jewish.com site.

The reply given to the question begins thusly -

The Talmud is a collection of discussions on various topics of Jewish law, but not all of the material in every discussion:

1) represents the majority view;
2) applies today;
3) was meant to be taken seriously.

I suppose that, as with most religious teachings, people will take the bits they 'like' and ignore the bits they don't. It is interesting to note, however, that there doesn't seem to be a denial regarding the existence of such teachings that could be seen as derogatory towards Gentiles.

Perhaps the existence of such passages is one reason why Arabs may be hostile towards the Jews...

Then again, it could simple be

Originally posted by American Mad Man
because the whole area is hell forsaken # hole, and anger, hatred, and war are so embedded n their culture that the only way they know how to react is with extremism.

In the Arab non-Jewish community, as well as the rest of the Israel-hating international community, people have forgotten the fact that if there has been an injustice served to the "Palestinians" (I do not refer to them as "Palestinians" as if they are distinguishable from any other Arab or that they have any claim to the land of Israel), it has been served to them by their fellow Arab. If there is any one country that should embrace these people, bring them it sbussom and alleviate any suffering experienced by them. it is the Syrian government. These people are, after all, part of Greater Syria.

The "Palestinians" are nothing more than political pawns, caused to suffer by their Arab brethren so that they might be able to point a lying finger at Israel, follow their typical strategy of rewriting history and calling Israel the Great Evil in their midst.


The Palestinian Arab nationalism is something that came around back during the post-WWI timeframe, and didn't become a significant political movement until after Israel took the West Bank after during the 1967 6-Day War. As a reminder,. the "capture" of the West Bank was really a retaking of its land that had been taken a few years before hand. While I'm at it, the proper names for that area are Judea and Samaria; just in case there are people here who are lacking in historical knowledge of the region.
Lack of knowledge is what allows lies to grow into beliefs.

As far as the name-calling of the whole area, Israel is a paradise that was built by the Jewish people from a wasteland that was a mixture of arid dry land and stagnate swampland. The Jews built a productive land out of that mess, and now, of course, others want to scream that the land is not rightfully belonging to the Jews.

[edit on 10-12-2005 by Thomas Crowne]

So if I march into your house, kick you out at gunpoint, because my grandparents lived there decades ago, that's justified as long as I do a nice job redecorating the place?

Like I said, Israel exists now, people live there, and there is no more justification for kicking the Israelis out now than there was for kicking the Palestinians out then. But to pretend the people who were displaced by the creation of Israel have no right to be angry about it takes more self-delusion than I can muster...

Originally posted by xmotex
So if I march into your house, kick you out at gunpoint, because my grandparents lived there decades ago, that's justified as long as I do a nice job redecorating the place?

Like I said, Israel exists now, people live there, and there is no more justification for kicking the Israelis out now than there was for kicking the Palestinians out then. But to pretend the people who were displaced by the creation of Israel have no right to be angry about it takes more self-delusion than I can muster...

I guess anyone can claim "the right to be angry". I just think it is unjustified, because if only the arabs agreed to live in peace side by side with Israel at it's inception, they could've stayed right were the were.
They chose war instead, and many of them fled themselves and weren't expelled at all:

An arab Jaffa paper excoriated Arab villagers near Tel Aviv for "bringing down disgrace on us all by 'abandoning the villages.'" - As Sarih, (March 30, 1948).

A leader of the Arab National Committee in Haifa, Hajj Nimer el-Khatib, said Arab soldiers in Jaffa were mistreating the residents. "They robbed individuals and homes. Life was of little value, and the honor of women was defiled. This state of affairs led many [Arab] residents to leave the city under the protection of British tanks." - Avneri, p. 270.

John Bagot Glubb, the commander of Jordan's Arab Legion, said: "Villages were frequently abandoned even before they were threatened by the progress of war." - London Daily Mail, (August 12, 1948).

[edit on 10-12-2005 by Parmenides]

Originally posted by shire19
Prophet Muhammed (Peace be upon him) formed an alliance with a Jewish tribe, the Qurayza. In the heat of battle, they betrayed Muhammad's(PBUH) army and allied with the Meccans (As it seemed the latter was winning the war). When the Muslims overcame the Meccan army, and they surrendered. There was the issue of dealing with those who committed treason, the specific Jewish tribe in question. The Qurayza came out of their fort and surrendered.

After that the Jewish were considered traitors, dishonourable and not to be trusted, a rough version of that story is what I got to learn after asking why the Muslims dislike the Jews so much.

Thank you posting that, that is something I had never heard before.

It's kinda scary that beliefs on both sides from over a thousand years ago still hold enough sway to keep both sides from trying to live side by side. They don't have to be good buddy buddy neighbors, just be like the guy down the block you wave at but don't know their name.

Let me also remind people that theArabs were perfectly welcome in Israel as equal citizens; they left their homes either to willingly fight against the Jews, or out of fear that they would be killed by fellow invading Arabs.

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
Let me also remind people that theArabs were perfectly welcome in Israel as equal citizens; they left their homes either to willingly fight against the Jews, or out of fear that they would be killed by fellow invading Arabs.

Have you ever heard of the Right of Return?

If they are perfectly welcome why won't Israel allow those that fled to return to their homes?

Why did Israel sieze their property?

Why are only Jews allowed to immigrate?

Why are non-Jews that leave the country usually not allowed to return?

The facts seem at odds with everything you said here.

[edit on 10-12-2005 by ArchAngel]

The facts seem odd? Here's an idea, look back at how they have been treated by their Arab neighbor since they have had the their country back. How soon after the birth of Israel was she attacked?
How many times has she been attacked?
How many times would you hold out the olive branch?
How many times have you yelled, "Right of Return!" throughout history?

As I said and will say again, the "Palestinians" have received their worst treatment by those who are to be considered their brothers. Look at teh size of the Arab states, look at their oil-based wealth and look at how much ability they have, and look at how much help they have not given.

No, paying the families of "Palestinian" homicide bombers doesn't count as aide.

As I said and will say again, the "Palestinians" have received their worst treatment by those who are to be considered their brothers. Look at teh size of the Arab states, look at their oil-based wealth and look at how much ability they have, and look at how much help they have not given.

The Palestinians have received their worst treatment from the Israeli STATE.

The Arab governments are not stealing their land, bulldozing their homes, and maintaining a hostile military occupation in their lands.

Point the finger on the ones that are responsible.

This was the result of the Israeli 1967 Sneak Attack, and failure to withdraw according to US Resolutions.

I am pointing the fingers at the ones responsible.

Homes of the murderers are bulldozed, keep that in context.

Oh, excuse me, that isn't quite true, is it. Israeli citizens are being run off the land that belongs to them so that it can be given to the "Palestinian". Land that was originally Israeli land that was taken at her birth, even though the vast majority of the region was cordoned off for the Arab.

This is typical of the attitude that as long as their is a Jew living on the land and not swimming across the sea, there'll be no peace in that area. It isn't the Jews' fault.

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
It isn't the Jews' fault.

So the Entire Burden is on the Palestinian Shoulders?

It is THEIR Fault that there is an Endless Conflict in Isreal?

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
I am pointing the fingers at the ones responsible.

No, you are not.

The ones doing it are responsible, and that is the Israelies.

Homes of the murderers are bulldozed, keep that in context.

Oh, excuse me, that isn't quite true, is it. Israeli citizens are being run off the land that belongs to them so that it can be given to the "Palestinian".

Illegal Israeli settlers were removed from the land Israel stole in the 1967 sneak attack.

The ones in the West Bank, and Golon should be too.

Land that was originally Israeli land that was taken at her birth,

Here is the fault in your understanding.

Gaza was not given to Israel.

It was stolen in the 1967 Israeli Sneak Attack.

even though the vast majority of the region was cordoned off for the Arab.

Sour Grapes?

Not enough so they MUST Steal more?

This is typical of the attitude that as long as their is a Jew living on the land and not swimming across the sea, there'll be no peace in that area. It isn't the Jews' fault.

Typical extremist denialism.

Between driving the Jews into the sea, and driving the Palestinians across the Jordan there are many alternatives.

I support Israel behind the green line with Equal rights, and the occupied terroritories liberated.

I only ask that Israel give back what they stole, and allow freedom for all.

[edit on 10-12-2005 by ArchAngel]

Had you read, you would have seen that the "Palestinians" have been nothing more than a tool used by the rest of the Arab world to force Israel out of existence.

There is no other country or group that has offered peace more than the Israelis; let's see some action from the other sides, other than attack, murder and lie.

As I said, knowing the truth keeps one from falling for lies.

Originally posted by ArchAngel

Why are only Jews allowed to immigrate?

Israel's Nationality Law relates to anyone wishing to settle in Israel, as well as those already residing or born there, regardless of race, religion, creed, sex or political beliefs.

Citizenship may be acquired by:

Birth

The Law of Return

Residence

Naturalization

Originally posted by ArchAngel

Why are non-Jews that leave the country usually not allowed to return?

What?

Every Israeli citizen is allowed to leave Israel and to return back to Israel. Nobody looses his citizenship.

There is only one thing a citizen can not do when you leave the country for a longer time: You cannot vote in the elections. Israeli law does not provide for absentee ballots, and voting takes place only on Israeli soil. The sole exceptions are Israeli citizens serving on Israeli ships and in Israeli embassies/ consulates/ intelligence abroad.