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UFO's. Yeah right!

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posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 09:00 PM
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I have just finishes a series of documentaries about UFO's and the presidents that dealt with the sibjects. I do not care to talk about all the mystic around who saw what and who believes what. This is such a fantastical subject, such a complete "way-of-life" changing subject, yet it is dealt with like children. I have a few questons I would like the ATS woeld to answer (because I know there are UFO buffs here).

1). Why keep it secret? (Presedents like Reagan had a fantasy that the proof would unite the world)
2). Why do we have absolutely no difinitieve proof? I mean we can catch a murder on tape but no UFO's?
3). What could Elitists or whoever have to benifit from keeping it a secret?
4). If it exists, why wouldn't NASA have a better direction in their space plans?
5). If you beleieve, what do you believe? What makes any sense?

I do not disprove anything, I just can't see any reasons for being fanatical about the subject. UFO's have no purpose, or yet I haven't seen one... Maybe you guys have...

[edit on 2-10-2005 by AnAbsoluteCreation]




posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 10:15 PM
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Originally posted by AnAbsoluteCreation
I have just finishes a series of documentaries about UFO's and the presidents that dealt with the sibjects. I do not care to talk about all the mystic around who saw what and who believes what. This is such a fantastical subject, such a complete "way-of-life" changing subject, yet it is dealt with like children. I have a few questons I would like the ATS woeld to answer (because I know there are UFO buffs here).

1). Why keep it secret? (Presedents like Reagan had a fantasy that the proof would unite the world)

It can also cause fear, chaos, confusion, and the fall of religions and governments, etc. Just because he fantasizes about a "unification" of the world does not mean that is what will happen. But that's beside the point - why do our governments keep anything secret? The answer is very simple - because this way they have the control, they benefit from it, and we remain ignorant and as thus, slaves.



2). Why do we have absolutely no difinitieve proof? I mean we can catch a murder on tape but no UFO's?

There are many UFO videos, they are just easier to fake than someone committing a murder. Although with modern technology, a murder tape can also be faked. There is no "absolute proof" for anything, just evidence and probability of it being true or false.



3). What could Elitists or whoever have to benifit from keeping it a secret?

Perhaps the aliens control the world and feed on our emotional energy, and so the "elite" know it and also realise how "upset" (being a huge understatement) the world would be to find something like this out? Either way, the more ignorant the human race is, the easier it is to control - that has always been true. And in that respect, if we are to suddenly establish contact with aliens openly, we might learn many things and our elite may no longer be "elite"? Maybe the human race is a grand experiment overseen by certain non-human hosts, and the elite are aware of this, and again it's another one of those things that might "upset" the world to discover? Could be many possibilities!



I do not disprove anything, I just can't see any reasons for being fanatical about the subject. UFO's have no purpose, or yet I haven't seen one... Maybe you guys have...

I think their purpose might be similar to cars, only slightly more.. advanced...



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 10:20 PM
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I agree. While I am not trying to discredit anyone who does believe, it is my personal view that they do not exist. Although I must admit I grew up believing but it was more out of want instead of proof. As I have grown older I have found no convincing proof nor have I personally met anyone who has ever come in contact. After reading the Demon haunted world by Carl Sagen I was introduced to the proofs of science explained by someone educated in the field who made it very easy to form my own opinions of the evidence of UFOs. Also lets not forget the money generated by books and televison. That is reason enough alone to fuel the business machine this phenomonon has produced. And like an absolutecreation stated, there would be video obtained by this point in time that would prove or disprove. I also belive we as humans find the idea of being alone in this universe scary. I believe we need to find our inner Neitzche and face our fears of fact. After all we have just as much proof of ufos as we have of God. none.



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 10:20 PM
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lilblam,

I agree that your suggestion about them using us for unknown reasons is a possibility. But why wouldn't an administration rebel? Perhaps say, screw you!



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 10:22 PM
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kleversdad, I must say that was a brilliant response. Do happen to know a man name j-rock-double-faulk-dog? I see a resembance n brilliance!



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 10:44 PM
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There are UFOs. They are fallen angels taking the form of "grays" and flying saucers. The secret military is controlled by the Illuminati, devil worshippers, and they are breeding demons to people, and will present some kind of hybrid or hybrids at the time of their choosing (I think really soon) and tell everyone these are aliens from outer space here to help us have world peace.

Read these links if you want to know more. Be careful though. If you think you may have been subjected to mind control and are a multiple personality (like Roseanne Barr) reading these articles could trigger one of your personalities to suicide as per the command it was given under hypnosis. The extent that this is going on is mind-blowing.

Refuse the mark and prepare. The Great Tribulation spoken of in Scripture could begin as soon as the next "natural" disaser.

educate-yourself.org...

The Illuminati Formula Used to Create an Undetectable Total Mind Controlled Slave
educate-yourself.org...

Deeper Insights into the Illuminati Formula
www.whale.to...

Monarch Mind Control Programming: What It Is
mindcontrolforums.com...

And my personal favorite, David Icke:
www.davidicke.com...



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 10:52 PM
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resistance,

Are you serious? Where is your real prrof of this belief? Those are bold statements and those websites give nothing for legitimacy. You obviously believe deeply...WHY?



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 11:05 PM
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Anabsolute...have you looked into the disclosureproject video www.netro.ca... ?

It answers many questions that you are asking such as why would the elite keep it secret.



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 11:07 PM
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Originally posted by AnAbsoluteCreation
.....
1). Why keep it secret? (Presedents like Reagan had a fantasy that the proof would unite the world)
......
3). What could Elitists or whoever have to benifit from keeping it a secret?


Check out this link: Global Implications of UFO Reality

A 1960 report by the Brookings Institute, "Proposed Studies on the Implications of Peaceful Space Activities for Human Affairs", was presented to the 82nd Congress on April 18, 1961. The report concluded that profound social consequences would result if ET contact were confirmed. In part, it concluded:

...snip...

Likewise, an internal RAND document from 1968 predicted similar results. Worldwide panic was at the top of both of their lists. With this, it would seem that the powers-that-be had their answer and no further confirmation was necessary. Their "deny and ridicule" policy remained in place.


Technically it's government policy to not tell us...for our own protection of course. The response to Orson Welles' War of the Worlds didn't help much either.


en.wikipedia.org...(radio)
Public reaction
Many people missed or ignored the opening credits of the program, and in the atmosphere of growing tension and anxiety in the days leading up to World War II, took it to be an actual news broadcast. Panic ensued, with people fleeing the area, and others thinking they could smell the poison gas or could see the flashes of the fighting in the distance.


They had a real life scenario to test the what-if hypothesis and we didn't do well. Of course these guys were attacking and not landing on the White House lawn carrying flowers.

You could make the argument that "they" don't want to create a public panic, so have opted for a slow trickle of information instead of full disclosure.

Also what if "they" do know but have made no "official" contact with E.T.? Do you expect our government(or any other) to say "yeah they're here invading our airspace at will and unimpeded, and we can't do a thing about it good luck"....i doubt it.

I for one do not believe we have been visited by aliens, but if we had i can definately see why the goverment(s) is/are apprehensive to release that info to the "average joe's" of the world.



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 11:09 PM
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Originally posted by AnAbsoluteCreation
resistance,

Are you serious? Where is your real prrof of this belief? Those are bold statements and those websites give nothing for legitimacy. You obviously believe deeply...WHY?


Not so on the legitimacy score. They are whistleblowers. They are not saying anything many others aren't saying as well. You can check out anything they say for yourself. They give documentation for everything they say.

These aren't the only ones saying it. For example, there's stuff in there abouat Walt Disney and how he's part of the Illuminati, or he was. But his work goes on. Satan took Jesus up on the hill and said, kneel and bow to me and I'll give you all of this. Well, facat of the matter is most of the highly successful people in this world HAVE bowed their knee to Satan.

Better to find out now than later. You've not heard about the CFR, Trilateral Commission? You didn't know the UN is for world government? It never dawned on you that world government is the ultimate goal of an awful lot of people pushing really, really hard? You think all the warnings and prophecies in Scripture are for some far distant day for some other poor unfortunates?

The NWO is likely one "natural" disaster away when FEMA declares marshal law. Plus, these people are now able to control the weather using technology.

William Cooper is another whistleblower. He was murdered. But he was in Naval Intelligence, had his own radio show for a few years. His website is still up with a lot of this information on it.

If it were just one or maybe two people saying these things maybe you could say it's just a hoax. But it's a lot of people saying it. And then the things they're saying can be verified by checking out other sources, books on Billy Graham for example.

There's another website you can check out, CuttingEdge -- these guys aren't whistleblowers, just researchers, but read what they have to say. They've kind of put it all together in one package.



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 11:16 PM
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Isn't it a little arrogant to think that our of seven continents, over 200 countries, yet we are the ones with the secret. Why doesn't the secret spread to Russia, China, Ireland? Why does on;y the illuminati know about it? And if they made a deal, why? For what? And if there is a emotional control issue, don't any of you believe in our natural purpose to the universe? Not just a sheep to higher powers. I personally believe that there is a more positive answer. Now is all this metaphorical to evil powers that be from other planes of existance? Now you might have my attention there. But to say that other world are in control of my destiny, hogwash!



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 11:21 PM
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Originally posted by kyateLaBoca
Anabsolute...have you looked into the disclosureproject video www.netro.ca... ?

It answers many questions that you are asking such as why would the elite keep it secret.


I watched the three introductory tapes to the "Disclosure Project" last week out of curiosity. The statements made by the people (mostly ex military and Air Traffic Controllers - both military and civilian) are indeed compelling. Some of it is over the top. One guy claims that we have (or had) living aliens in custody. But most of it contains stories of contacts followed by threats from special govt. response teams and military personnel regarding what bad things would happen if they spoke about their experiences with anyone. A significant number of the events appear to be corroborated as well.

It makes you wonder. But, as in the John Titor story of time travel, what difference does it make one way or another to us? I particulary enjoyed the story of the nuclear warhead that was sent up in the '50's or '60's that was melted by laser fire from a ship that out manuevered the missile itself.



posted on Oct, 2 2005 @ 11:35 PM
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Originally posted by AnAbsoluteCreation
Isn't it a little arrogant to think that our of seven continents, over 200 countries, yet we are the ones with the secret. Why doesn't the secret spread to Russia, China, Ireland?


Who says it's not? The Illuminati goes back to the Garden of Eden when Satan said, You shall be as gods. This "fruit" will make you wise. Satan's secret to becoming wise? Human torture and sacrifice, fear, control, blackmail, black magic, whatever evil can be conceived, the wickeder the better.



Why does on;y the illuminati know about it? And if they made a deal, why? For what?


If the people knew they would not stand for it. That's why these secret societies are secret. But obviously an organization called "Skull and Bones" can't be about planting flowers or helping old ladies across the street. The deal is, you do what we want and we will make you rich and famous. Unfortunately there are some people who want fame and money and power and control over others so much that they are willing to sell their soul literally to get these things. Then they do the bidding of their masters.



And if there is a emotional control issue, don't any of you believe in our natural purpose to the universe? Not just a sheep to higher powers. I personally believe that there is a more positive answer.



Yeah, there is. God. Greater is he that is in me than he that is in the world. But Scripture says that Satan will come down to earth in a rage, and wage war against the saints and prevail in the last days. There will be a great deception and people will think they are in utopia but it will be the worst hellhole ever devised, something to make Nazi Germany look like a pleasant day at the park.


Now is all this metaphorical to evil powers that be from other planes of existance? Now you might have my attention there. But to say that other world are in control of my destiny, hogwash!


Good point. As long as you don't take the mark and you cling to your faith, you will wake up in the right place. But you're going to have to go through it -- and your friends and family too. So get ready.



posted on Oct, 3 2005 @ 12:34 AM
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There are many reasons for the secrecy as already mentioned.

The problem with UFOs is that no one can explain them away. You can pretend the phenomena doesn't exist and yet people still continue to see and report UFOs. The Air Force concluded very early on that the phenomena was not caused by hallucinations , Hoaxes, or reported by the mentally un-stable , but rather real objects often reported by qualified observers that seemed to defy explanation. The early Air Force opinion was that these objects were Soviet Technology, but that was not the case.

Evidence is anything that helps you to draw a conclusion. When you look at,

1) RADAR/ Visual cases

2)the similarity of many UFO sightings to each other even when witnesses don't know each other and their reports are completely independent of one another.

3)well documented events such as the Battle of L.A. '42 that match closely to other UFO sightings .

4) the fact that UFO sightings are reported Globally and have been for thousands of years beginning with Alexander the Great.

5)the fact that UFOs similar to what are currently being reported appear in several renaissance artworks such as "The Annunciation" (1486) and "The Madonna with Saint Giovannino" ( 15th Century).

6) The fact that people to this day still report similar objects Globally.


When you look at that evidence I think that it suggests that there are physical objects being reported that remain unknown to science. Having had a very good sighting of a UFO myself , I am very sure of my opinion.



posted on Oct, 3 2005 @ 01:27 AM
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Originally posted by lost_shaman
There are many reasons for the secrecy as already mentioned.

The problem with UFOs is that no one can explain them away. You can pretend the phenomena doesn't exist and yet people still continue to see and report UFOs. The Air Force concluded very early on that the phenomena was not caused by hallucinations , Hoaxes, or reported by the mentally un-stable , but rather real objects often reported by qualified observers that seemed to defy explanation. The early Air Force opinion was that these objects were Soviet Technology, but that was not the case.

Evidence is anything that helps you to draw a conclusion. When you look at,

1) RADAR/ Visual cases

2)the similarity of many UFO sightings to each other even when witnesses don't know each other and their reports are completely independent of one another.

3)well documented events such as the Battle of L.A. '42 that match closely to other UFO sightings .

4) the fact that UFO sightings are reported Globally and have been for thousands of years beginning with Alexander the Great.

5)the fact that UFOs similar to what are currently being reported appear in several renaissance artworks such as "The Annunciation" (1486) and "The Madonna with Saint Giovannino" ( 15th Century).

6) The fact that people to this day still report similar objects Globally.


When you look at that evidence I think that it suggests that there are physical objects being reported that remain unknown to science. Having had a very good sighting of a UFO myself , I am very sure of my opinion.


I don't think people were seeing grays in the 18th century. If anything they'd see gargoyles and monsterous apparitions, such as we see depicted in carvings on their buildings. The grays and flying saucers are recent. But they're all from the same source -- spirit beings known as fallen angels. These creatures CAN materialize, and CAN mate with humans. (man is made in the image of God, and the angels were referred to as "sons of God" in Scripture.

So the UFOs are not hallucination. They are real. The military knows what they are. The military is controlled by the Illuminati -- devil worshippers. The military is the biggest practicer of mind control of anyone. I'm talking the high up ones, and especially CIA, NASA, FEMA. Also the Mafia, KKK are satanists. They all work together. Freemasons are devil worshippers. It's all the same.

But the UFO stuff, that's coming from the military. Walter Cooper, former Naval Intelligence, whistleblower, who had a radio show Hour of the Time, now deceased (murdered) called the ones working, collaborating with the reptilian demons "UFOologists."

Hollywood and the media is controlled by the Illuminati also. That's why you get the Star Treks and Star Wars. The people doing these shows are under the control of the Illuminati. Same with Disneyland -- full of occult, and up with animals, down with people message. The Illuminati plans to kill 90 percent of the world population and rewild the planet, give it to the animals. They are definitely Satan's henchmen -- for he too comes, Scripture says, only to lie, kill and destroy.



posted on Oct, 3 2005 @ 01:38 AM
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I agree that some UFOs are real physical objects that the Military knows about , but I don't agree that these represent Spiritual Demons thrown down to Earth from Hell.

I think it is much more likely Earth simply is not the only Planet in the Milky Way that has developed intelligent Civilizations. And there is plenty of evidence that Earth has been and still is being observed by another intelligent Civilization.



posted on Oct, 3 2005 @ 01:43 AM
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Originally posted by lost_shaman
I agree that some UFOs are real physical objects that the Military knows about , but I don't agree that these represent Spiritual Demons thrown down to Earth from Hell.

I think it is much more likely Earth simply is not the only Planet in the Milky Way that has developed intelligent Civilizations. And there is plenty of evidence that Earth has been and still is being observed by another intelligent Civilization.


UFOs -- unidentified flying objects. These aren't needed. They are just materialized as a front to confuse people, make them think we're being visited from outer space. (people have an easier time thinking creatures can travel faster than the speed of light than they do in believing there are invisible beings around us that can materialize -- fallen angels as described in Scripture.

Scripture says these creatures can take any form they choose. The apparitions of Mary are also of these fallen angels/demons.



posted on Oct, 3 2005 @ 01:55 AM
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resistance,

You obviously believe that UFO sightings are somehow similar to "apparitions of Mary " , I do not think these two things are related at all. I have seen a UFO and am able to draw on that experience to make my determination.

That is why my opinion is different than yours. You use your religious beliefs to rule out possibilities before you even look at the evidence , I do not.

Edit: I'm not trying to be mean or denounce anyone's religion , but I tend to keep spirituality separate from my understanding of the physical reality of Nature.




[edit on 3-10-2005 by lost_shaman]



posted on Oct, 3 2005 @ 02:02 AM
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lost_shaman,

Since you have seen one, what since have you made from it. What does your mind explain it as?



posted on Oct, 3 2005 @ 02:06 AM
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Originally posted by AnAbsoluteCreation
lilblam,

I agree that your suggestion about them using us for unknown reasons is a possibility. But why wouldn't an administration rebel? Perhaps say, screw you!


Perhaps the same reasons chickens in a coop don't rebel as long as they are fed? And those that would, are "removed" in one way or another. In the case of chickens, it is just death. In the case of humans, there are alternative ways, but killing is always an option as well, though some ways work much better than killing. For example, when a "whistleblower" rebels, much disinformation is often released to make them look like a liar or just insane or any number of other things and tactics are used. Killing them would often create the impression that someone wanted to shut them up, which would only serve as evidence to many that he was telling the truth after all and so often killing someone (especially who is known) is the last resort, and even THEN it's always an "accident" or a disease or a heart-attack or stroke or suicide or any number of innocent-looking things. But releasing info that supposedly disproves his claims, or associating him with a cult or with a mental illness etc, can work much better to dissuade anyone from paying any attention to him and his claims.

So going back to the "elite" in question, the reward for going along with what those aliens may want can be very tempting, and also the reward for keeping the status quo on the planet as it currently is, without alarming our entire civilization and causing all sorts of chaos that can end up in a lot of pain for the elite. However, if you rebel, there will always be others who will gladly take your spot, so you're just "taken out" or removed from power one way or another, and replaced with a psychopath that's happy to play along in your place. As a result the government leaders have a lot of motivation to maintain the status quo, and even those who want to rebel may be pressured by circumstance to maintain position, as there is very little they can do anyway and will only end up hurting themselves and accomplish very little.

The interesting thing is, "they" can use our own human nature against us. We are selfish by nature, and as thus, susceptible to temptations of reward and threats of punishment. Why do you think so many people follow religion? How many of them would still be there if they were never promised Heaven or threatened with Hell? Similarly, those in power tend to do anything to remain in power because that is what tempts them the most, and since they are already in power, they are not the type to "rebel" against control considering that if they DO NOT rebel they gain even more power at the cost of being someone else's pawn. And in a hierarchy of control, there is ALWAYS someone above you no matter who you are, so you either get used to it and play along or spend your entire existance "rebelling" while still trying to retain power without any success because there will always be someone more powerful than you. The only way to prevent being in this situation is to not BE in the hierarchy at all (by not wanting any power over anyone), but for this you need to become service to others instead of service to self, and that is something very far from the minds of those in power, since they represent the most selfish and corrupt members of humanity by the nature of their position and how they acquired it and why.

Now assuming the aliens are NOT in control of the planet, then the government simply benefits from maintaining the status quo as it is - if the money is good, terrorism is working out as a great tactic, and the people simply accept things due to fear and wishful thinking, why risk a huge earth-shattering change and risk losing it all? Instead you can keep them guessing but at least you and your friends will still be in control, and that's all taht matters.

However, the government has no power or say over what the aliens can and cannot do, and they realise this and that is one of the things that terrifies them beyond belief. The very prospect that at any time aliens can choose to simply "mass land" or pretty much do anything they wish is scary to them (to say the least), because this is the only wild card that the government simply has no control over or knowledge of that can pretty much change everything in a flash.

And here's the kicker! The self-serving aliens, if they are in contact with this world, it will always be in a manner of them being "in charge", to get what they want with little resistance, as it is in their nature just like it is in the nature of humans to control one another in constant hierarchies, going to our known governments, our corporations, and pretty much any endeavor we do on the planet, a hierarchy of control is present. Don't forget how we treat the animals of this world.

And the aliens that serve others would not interfere with the human race and only discreetly contact those who actively seek contact for purposes of learning and gaining knowledge and advancing, but never provide absolute proof of their existance out of respect of our free will - since proof takes free will away from us. If they prove to us that they exist without us figuring it out ourselves in one way or another, we won't be able to choose to believe that they don't exist, and so they effectively force us into a perspective that we may not have wished to have. And of course those aliens would not contact our "governments" or make deals with them. And self-serving aliens also won't make deals with the government, except to trick them to get what the aliens want out of them - for example tempt with with promises to ellicit obedience, etc.

It's kinda like how we treat animals here. We don't exactly negotiate with them, we simply take what we want, whether it is mowing down forests for paper or honey from bees or skin from other animals or meat or anything else. However, we also have chicken and cow and other farms and keep them in herds and under the illusion that they are free, when in reality they are just our property and we systematically kill them when we need the meat or a specific resource - and they don't even know they are being herded and used, they don't even know we're a threat! But we keep them happy by providing them with food and other necessities, just as humans are provided with "entertainment" and "money" and basically "toys" to keep us busy in our daily lives and focused on either acquiring money and buying things, or in constant fear of things like terrorism, accidents, etc. That and constantly seeking sex and relationships, since that is a mechanical/instinctual drive that dominates our lives as much, if not more than money does. Either way, we're kept busy.

So all I am saying is, it's not as simple as just "rebelling". We can't exactly call the police or complain, or run, or hide or fight back - we're on our own here on this planet at complete mercy of any race that finds us and wants to use us for any purpose they wish, and the elite realise this, they don't really have a choice. They want power and control, and playing along with the system, maintaining the lies, keeping people ignorant and misinformed, allows you to have that power and control.




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