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Islam is the Problem

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posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 04:55 PM
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This is no doubt a provocative article, but I think it seems more and more true as events unfold:



It is way past time to give it up people. We have tried to target various vile terrorists, while at the same time pumping up Islam, but its just not working. As we fight terrorists, we have been unable to face the stark reality that Islam, and the example of their revered prophet, are the chief motivation behind various terrorist foot-soldiers. It’s not a ‘culture’, it’s not a few deviants, it’s not a government or nation, it’s the religion. As we look first one way, and then the other, in-you-face Muslim leaders and lay continue their Jihad against us, pushing their young men to commit acts of inhumane brutality in the name of their hateful god Allah. Previously unthinkable news and images invades our living rooms on a daily basis. Only the dead and dumb can continue to hide from the facts surrounding a philosophy calling itself a religion, hell-bent on murdering or enslaving the rest of humanity. For those able to think, here is a news flash: The 9/11 hijackers, the London Bombers, the Beslan child-killers, the Chechen terrorists, the Palestinian terrorists, the Madrid terrorists, the Darfur killers, the Iraqi murderers, The Bali bombers, and innumerable acts of murder and carnage, are all linked. The common linkage, is that the victimizers are all devout Muslims! Yes, that wonderful ‘religion of peace’ we have been so careful to respect. And while the foot-soldiers act to weaken Western influence and institutions, ‘moderate Islam’ continues to do what it does best, hide militants living amongst them and silently cheer from the sidelines. The common denominator in this equation of violence is ISLAM. The common script for all these violent plays is the Qur’an, the Sira, and the Hadith collection. The identical characters for all these ugly occurrences are devout Muslims well steeped in Islamic verse and prose.

Full Article: FaithFreedom.org


Can you all really debunk this?




posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:05 PM
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Check out this thread, I think your question will be answered.





[edit on 053131p://07075 by MERC]



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:08 PM
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Originally posted by djohnsto77
Can you all really debunk this?

Sure.

Muslims= Humans

And humans do whatever they want. Therefore, muslims do whatever they want. A population of muslims within a larger diverse community is not a sufficient cause to have islamic terrorism.

IOW, not all muslims are terrorists, and just because there are muslims does not mean that there will be terrorists.



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:09 PM
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Originally posted by MERC
Check out this thread, I think your question will be answered.


I'm quite familiar with that thread, and while it's true there have been plenty examples of non-Islamic terrorism in the past, nothing has ever risen to the level of suicide bombings carried out by Islamofascist terrorists in recent years.



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:19 PM
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I referred to that thread not only because it shows that not all terrorists are Muslims, that wasn't my main point. My main point was that you can't generalise all Muslims into the category of Extremist Terrorists. Your question was "can you all debunk this", and I believe many people in the thread I linked have done just that.



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:21 PM
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The last line in the article is hilarious!


If you are not Islamophobic yet, then you are either already dead, or stupid. Becoming Islamophobic is the graduation certificate you get upon moving from delusion and ignorance, to full-awareness. When you have arrived, wear it with pride.


Deutschland! Deutschland!

What's next to debunk? Blacks are animals? The holocoust didn't happen? If people want to hate, logic and reason isn't going to have any affect on them.

Yes, yes, djohnsto77. Islam is evil. Get the ovens warmed up. Anybody else you want to throw in there? No reason to make two trips.



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:22 PM
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While it's certainly true that not all Muslims are terrorists, it's a sad fact that almost all terrorists are Muslims. Therefore there must be some cause-effect relationship between being an adherant to the Islamic faith and the probability of becoming a terrorist.



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:25 PM
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Originally posted by djohnsto77
Can you all really debunk this?


debunk a anti-Muslim hate site? Can't a web site be used that isn't biased against Muslims?

All I ever see are links to FaithFreedom.org and apostatesofislam.com. The two leading anti-Muslim web sites on the net.

I'm sure I wouldn't be able to hold an anti-semitic argument by quoting David Duke.
Can I bash the bible using quotes from exchristian.net?

I don't see how these anti-Muslim sites are given as sources of "Evil Muslim' Truths.

WE scoff at people who use Rense.com as a ligit source yet FaithFreedom.org and apostatesofislam.com are supposed to be the authority in Islam?



The common linkage, is that the victimizers are all devout Muslims!


So now 1 billion people are to be condemned for these attacks? That is straight up prejudice.



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:26 PM
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Let the bias begin...before you blame Islam, blame poverty. Have you heard of the countless lives that our government has taken? among others. Trade embargos that starve innocent people? Yah...islam is to blame(sarcasm).



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:27 PM
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All terrorists are muslims?

That's funny, because of the 500 some-odd acts of domestic terror in the US last year, not a single perpetrator was devoted to Islam.

Funny that.

You know what I think?

[edit: it's not worth it.]

[edit on 25-7-2005 by WyrdeOne]



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:39 PM
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Djohnsto77,

Waging a war against Islam should be the last thing any human being on this planet should want after what happened during WW2. There is a reason we study the Holocaust, and it isn't so we know how to better execute an entire people. It would just be sick to go around killing civilians simply because of their religion, which I might add is the second most populated religion on Earth, with 1.1 billion people. You did pick up during High School that Holocaust = bad, right?



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:40 PM
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We need to be careful when using the word "all". I don't believe that you can find a single category where there are no exceptions to the rule. Islam is not the problem. Extreme Islamics are only a symptom of the problem. Islam is just the latest tool used in an attempt to enslave and control minds. If I'm not mistaken, Christianity was once used to this end. Thankfully that's gone for the most part. Mostly due to the fact that Christianity doesn't control many governments any longer.

A good analogy would be someone stating that the reason someone was in the hospital was because he had a broken arm. Yes, they have a broken arm, but the real cause would actually be when he decided to jump out of the tallest tree in the neighborhood.


[edit on 25-7-2005 by dbates]



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:41 PM
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I would not debunk it at all.

I would say fundamentalist religions on the whole are the problem.

Stupid is as stupid does.



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:41 PM
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Propaganda for a religious war.

I'll skip it, thanks. I feel no more inclined to go murder people to defend Christendom from the Islamic infidels than I do to murder them to defend Islam from the Christian infidels.

People have been selling this crap for the last 5,000 years.
It's about time people stopped buying it.



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:43 PM
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Originally posted by djohnsto77


I'm quite familiar with that thread, and while it's true there have been plenty examples of non-Islamic terrorism in the past, nothing has ever risen to the level of suicide bombings carried out by Islamofascist terrorists in recent years.


Not true.
Terror acts commited by people with muslim name for very different causes and reasons are dwarfed by state sponsored slaughter, commited by men in uniform on offical orders of the goverments all over the world, usualy supported or ignored by the people of that country.
Genocide in Bosnia commited by official serbian christian army (200,000 dead), the slaughter in Checnya, very difficult to keep count of massacred civilians there, since it is russian army who is doing it and they have nukes, so you cant really say they are commiting mass murder; then various killings in african states(death toll goes into millions), the slaughter of Iraqi civilians in the past 20 years by various armies; Palestine, South America, East Timor... all that dwarfs 9/11.

Every death of innocent civilians is tragic, but islamic terrorists are not even near to state sponsored terrorism when it comes to body count.



Oh yeah, and that article is uhmmm well, nonsense.
First, just by observation of reality you can debunk many of his claims.
MOST muslims on this planet are very well versed in Quran, so if Quran was the problem, then MOST muslims would be terrorists, killing in the name of God only.
If you observe reality, you will see a MINORITY doing the killings mostly for POLITICAL reasons, either to gain control somewhere, or to fight a political ideology they do not agree with or to fight for teritory, or to retaliate as a revenge for something. VERY FEW kill purely in the name of God and no other reason whatsoever.
So the basic premise of the article is crap.
Ergo, conclusions based on a false premise will also be false.

He also calls them "devout" believers, the correct term would be BLIND believers. Blind faith in anything leads to violence and murder. Blind faith in leaders (a trademark of communism and dictatorships), blind faith in money (corporate crimes and organised crime), blind faith in christianity ( bosnian genocide, abortion clinic bombers), blind faith in ideology of Al-qaeda ( 9/11), all that has one thing in common, an absurdity sold as truth and blind devotion to ideology sold as bravery and righteous way.

As Voltaire said "anyone who has the power to make you believe absurdities also has the power to make you commit atrocities".



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:47 PM
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Originally posted by MaskedAvatar
I would say fundamentalist religions on the whole are the problem.

Stupid is as stupid does.



Hit The Spot!



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 05:59 PM
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Paperclip,

I could not agree with you more, and i also haveto say that i think POVERTY is one of our greatest enemies...it makes people do terrible things. Most of us imo in america have hope...but what about these poor souls around the world who have nothing? no hope for their future, no sunny days to come. A strict religious regeme behind them. These things trouble me as i dont see the walls coming down anytime soon. WHATS wrong with our heads????



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 06:22 PM
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I'll skip all of the talk here, and answer the title with a link to a discussion I started some time ago here at ATS when I was just a member...

www.abovetopsecret.com...


Deny Ignorance



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 06:28 PM
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UM_Gazz maybe that thread could use a sticky, and all threads about Islam can move from WoT to Conspiracies in Religions.



posted on Jul, 25 2005 @ 07:00 PM
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Nothing terrorises me more than all the new laws, taxes and counter terrorism plans and actions of the "democratic" nations. Soon our only 'freedoms' will be to fear, fight or lie down and die.




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