Abhay IFV from India

Originally posted by mirza2003

armour Kanchan [similar to arjun ]

kanchan is not good armour.

Arjun's Kachan armor protection is similar to the Type-79 with ERA, which is basically a modified T-55. I don't get the big deal about the Kachan.

Originally posted by W4rl0rD
Arjun's Kachan armor protection is similar to the Type-79 with ERA, which is basically a modified T-55. I don't get the big deal about the Kachan.

nearly every 3rd generation tank uses compostie armour. i dont get whats all the fuss. the T-64 used it in the 60s

When and where did your guys get your PhD's in material sciences ??

Nothing really is known about the Kanchan, but the DRDO advertises it as a major feature of the Arjun and claims that it ranks amongst the best. Some forums speculate that it is a development of the Chobam-2 armour, but there is no conformation on that.

And Warlord, why on earth have you signed up on PDF. That place is an load of jehadi mullahs doing their usual collaborative fiction.They say crap like Pakistan will get the Rafale and the Eurofighter ! And they go on to assert that Pakistan is responsible for the design and development of the FC-1 !! and that pakistan has lent its "expertise" to China after china requested it for its XXJ and space launcher programmes!!!

I almost die laughing every time i pay a visit there.

Originally posted by Stealth Spy
When and where did your guys get your PhD's in material sciences ??

Nothing really is known about the Kanchan, but the DRDO advertises it as a major feature of the Arjun and claims that it ranks amongst the best. Some forums speculate that it is a development of the Chobam-2 armour, but there is no conformation on that.

it has about the same armour as a M1A1 according to this site.
members.tripod.com...

but its still ranks about the same as a T-59D upraded.

and a lot less than a T-98 and a lot lot less than a T-98G

Originally posted by Stealth Spy
And Warlord, why on earth have you signed up on PDF. That place is an load of jehadi mullahs doing their usual collaborative fiction.They say crap like Pakistan will get the Rafale and the Eurofighter ! And they go on to assert that Pakistan is responsible for the design and development of the FC-1 !! and that pakistan has lent its "expertise" to China after china requested it for its XXJ and space launcher programmes!!!

To keep up with news which I haven't quite gotten involving China,India and Pakistan. I assume you signed up on Bharat Rahshak(sp) too, and the situation there is as pro-India as PDF is pro-Pakistan. I might sign up on BR soon anyway.

I dont how much to believe a triopd homepage for military intelligence details. I have'nt seen any details/specs of the Arjun's armour anywhere so far. Besides, a thinner armour may be more effective too.


Here's what i could find on the Kanchan armour :

All round protection from anti-tank ammunition is achieved by the newly developed KANCHAN armour to a degree much higher than available in present generation tanks. The high degree of immunity is also achieved by a fabricated turret housing lightweight compact KANCHAN armour

link

Production Arjun MBTs will also have a new composite laminate armour called Kanchan. This will be produced by Mishra Dhatu Nigam Limited (MDNL).

link

The Kanchan armour provides protection against both chemical attack (HEAT, HESH) and kinetic attack projectiles (APFSDS) at appropriate ranges under service conditions.

link

All round protection from anti-tank ammunition is achieved by the newly developed Kanchan armour to a degree much higher than available in present generation tanks

link


The Kanchan is also very lightweight.

The developers claim that the "Kanchan" composite Armour on the tank provides a degree of protection far higher than available on other contemporary tanks. From personal observation, the build does appear to be much stronger than that of the T-72 or T-90S.

link

To ensure crew survivability, production versions will have the indigenously-researched and developed ‘Kanchan’ composite armor, an automatic fire detection and suppression system, and an NBC protection system designed and built by the Bhabha Atomic Research Center. The chassis is fabricated from rolled homogenous armour plate using advanced welding technique. Frontal armour is of Kanchan composite sandwitched between armour plates.

link

And when the Arjun had problems a few years back, the hawk like Indian media critisized everything but still had some good things to say about the Kanchan armour

Specially developed 'Kanchan' armour for high levels of protection.

link

The Army has not found Arjun Tank up to the mark due to defects in engine and sight etc. though it is a good gun with strong ‘Kanchan’ armour for protection.

link

Arjun's armour, called Kanchan, is indigenously designed and produced. It is made of composite steel, titanium and ceramic embedded together.

Arjun encompasses the most beautiful technologies including the best in armour

Its armour is unbeatable. A tank is determined by its mobility, fire-power and protection. Arjun is unbeatable in all the three.

link

I seriously doubt the Kachan armor is any better than any other modern composite armor. Arjun has many other problems, its engine, fire control etc didn't work in the desert, where any land based conflict with Pakistan will take place. Its gun is nothing too new, no DU rounds and firing tungsten rounds just like the T-72 and T-90. Just because the armor is indigeniously developed and composite doesn't make it better than any other composite armor. As for it being based on Chobham 2, I have to say that is just pure BS.

Again this site doesn't mention anything about what type of pertection it has.

stealth look at his sources. it might be tripod but he gets the information and then puts it on his site.

also your sites doesn't quote any test the arjun has been under. and also they might be comparing the arjun to the M1A1 which has about the same armour.

China white you are dumbest person ever i meet with just ignoring all the point
made by stealth spy and warlord you are no exception

For Kanchan Armour it protection level is top secret and on official details ever release other than that it can with stand all avilable shells & missiles.

You TWO just running your imagination in fifth gear.

Give me any site/document where you can prove that Kanchan is hype nothing else.
Or stop spaming hear!





[edit on 9-7-2005 by mirza2003]

Originally posted by chinawhite
stealth look at his sources. it might be tripod but he gets the information and then puts it on his site.

First of all its a tripod homepage of a guy with pics of his baby, vacations, etc

Next it says : TANK PROTECTION LEVELS- A feature to help wargamers interested in the relative armour protection of modern tanks

And then he says he picked up these figures that are unavailable anywhere on how much a bullet will pierce a tank from a discussion forum.

How can anyone get these figures ? No govt will give out such numbers. Or maybe someone in that obscure forum bought all the tanks listed and hit them all with bullets and measured how long it penitrated

And moreover those are penitration figures. Those are his imaginary figures of how much a bullet will pentirate into a tank's body. So the lesser the penitration, the better. That way the Arjun and M1 have some of the best armour's.

But going by such crap is very unwise.

Originally posted by mirza2003
For Kanchan Armour it protection level is top secret and on official details ever release other than that it can with stand all avilable shells & missiles.

You TWO just running your imagination in fifth gear.

Give me any site/document where you can prove that Kanchan is hype nothing else.
Or stop spaming hear!

Why don't you give me any site/document where YOU can prove that Kanchan is up to all that hype? Oh, so now going by what you say, any government project which is top secret can withstand all avilable shells & missiles and is the best thing ever made?

Your imagination is running too much. There is nothing known about the Kanchan armor except that it is a composite made up of titanium,ceramic and steel (there again nothing new, Cheftains have this tech), and you talk about it like something you guys got from the Aliens.

Originally posted by mirza2003
China white you are dumbest person ever i meet with just ignoring all the point
made by stealth spy and warlord you are no exception

For Kanchan Armour it protection level is top secret and on official details ever release other than that it can with stand all avilable shells & missiles.

You TWO just running your imagination in fifth gear.

Give me any site/document where you can prove that Kanchan is hype nothing else.
Or stop spaming hear!

[edit on 9-7-2005 by mirza2003]

are you kidding me there were no points made in stealthspys links only that it could withstand unknown projectiles.

a hellfire 2 has a 1600mm peneration that is means it can destroy a M1A2 and have enough power left to destroy a T-72. it weighs 70tons and has DU armour. one of the most heaviest elements on earth.

i posted one article its not spamming stealth posted a lot of BS from indian sites thats spamming

Originally posted by Stealth Spy

Originally posted by chinawhite
stealth look at his sources. it might be tripod but he gets the information and then puts it on his site.

First of all its a tripod homepage of a guy with pics of his baby, vacations, etc

Next it says : TANK PROTECTION LEVELS- A feature to help wargamers interested in the relative armour protection of modern tanks

And then he says he picked up these figures that are unavailable anywhere on how much a bullet will pierce a tank from a discussion forum.

How can anyone get these figures ? No govt will give out such numbers. Or maybe someone in that obscure forum bought all the tanks listed and hit them all with bullets and measured how long it penitrated

But going by such crap is very unwise.

his sources.
Sources: Mainly from posts on Tanknet the premier source of tank discussion online. Also from Stephen Zaloga's various works on Russian MBTs, Hilmes' books, Janes IDR and the NII Stali website.

you can even figure it out how the arjun is less protected than other tanks. its weight is lower than a abram and it has a greater surface area to protect and it is not sloped

And moreover those are penitration figures. Those are his imaginary figures of how much a bullet will pentirate into a tank's body. So the lesser the penitration, the better. That way the Arjun and M1 have some of the best armour's.

i dont get what your trying to say

There is absolutely no information out there to prove that Arjun's armor is significantly better than any other modern tank platform's armor. If you can't find a link to show that Arjun's armor performs better than the T-90's armor, feel free to post it, not what some journalists think. And, just because a project is top secret, does not make it so much better than any existing armor like your imagination tends to tell you.

Originally posted by Stealth Spy
The Kanchan armour provides protection against both chemical attack (HEAT, HESH) and kinetic attack projectiles (APFSDS) at appropriate ranges under service conditions.

what are the appropriate ranges?

All round protection from anti-tank ammunition is achieved by the newly developed Kanchan armour to a degree much higher than available in present generation tanks

are they comparing this to a russian tank. because most of these articles are deciding if india should buy T-90s or arjun

The developers claim that the "Kanchan" composite Armour on the tank provides a degree of protection far higher than available on other contemporary tanks. From personal observation, the build does appear to be much stronger than that of the T-72 or T-90S.

He said it looks more sturdy than a T-72 but not better protected

And when the Arjun had problems a few years back, the hawk like Indian media critisized everything but still had some good things to say about the Kanchan armour

Specially developed 'Kanchan' armour for high levels of protection.

this article is prasing the arjun

The Army has not found Arjun Tank up to the mark due to defects in engine and sight etc. though it is a good gun with strong ‘Kanchan’ armour for protection.

it says good not best. or better than

Its armour is unbeatable. A tank is determined by its mobility, fire-power and protection. Arjun is unbeatable in all the three.

link


this article is a load of garbage. nearly every article prasing the arjun and mocking the arjun says it has bad mobility. and the gun is most diffenertly inferiour to the abram gun

this is about the indian IFV and comparing to other IFV. dont turn this into T-98 vs Arjun or any other thread.

mirza seriously get over it. if i wanted to i could reply to all your post and prove you wrong everytime. dont try to flame this thread.

Originally posted by chinawhite
his sources.
Sources: Mainly from posts on Tanknet the premier source of tank discussion online.

This a discussion forum.

Also from Stephen Zaloga's various works on Russian MBTs, Hilmes' books, Janes IDR and the NII Stali website.

and like these will give you the Arjun's armour details. If so please post them from these sources.

And moreover those are penitration figures. Those are his imaginary figures of how much a bullet will pentirate into a tank's body. So the lesser the penitration, the better. That way the Arjun and M1 have some of the best armour's.
i dont get what your trying to say

Think about it and u'll get it.

Originally posted by Stealth Spy

This a discussion forum.

have you ever been to tanknet.com the site is full of tankers and engineers. this is for people that have to much time on their hands

and like these will give you the Arjun's armour details. If so please post them from these sources.

go read some of those books. very informative

Think about it and u'll get it.

yeah as much as what DRDO publishs

Originally posted by chinawhite
what are the appropriate ranges?

The range at which it will hit a normal tank.

are they comparing this to a russian tank.

and how can you decide that ?

The developers claim that the "Kanchan" composite Armour on the tank provides a degree of protection far higher than available on other contemporary tanks. From personal observation, the build does appear to be much stronger than that of the T-72 or T-90S.

He said it looks more sturdy than a T-72 but not better protected

first of all its the T-90S and T-72; and he meant the protection. He referred to the other 2 tanks because this international journalist : Harry B saw the Arjun along side the T-72 and T-90S at an expo. So in his view too its got better protection thanother contemporary tanks.

this article is a load of garbage. nearly every article prasing the arjun and mocking the arjun says it has bad mobility. and the gun is most diffenertly inferiour to the abram gun

Its the armour that it talks of not the gun or the mobility.
And it every article that says unplesant things about the mobility speak highly of the armour.

Instead of blatantly concluding that the Kanchan is not a good armour, why dont you provide a few non-homepage links to back your claims. Clearly if the Kanchan was so bad, then there would be hundreds of non-homepage articles like the ones you found saying unplesant things on the arjun.