NEWS: International Poll Reveals: World favors China over USA

2ndHand:

Ofcourse we are. Everyone is. If you have a government then you have someone who is trying to control you. I have no illusions that my government is any better or worse than yours, we just don't have the funds or might to act liek jerks on the international scene. Our politicians are forced to act like jerks to us! The gun registery, the GST, the Sponserhip scandle, I can go on and on for coruption in Canadain politics. For control, we have the CRTC who gleefully makes sure that everything we are allowed to see passes by them first, not to mention a public news channel(the CBC) that at times sounds like it comes from Russia in the 80's!.

Once again I am under no illusions that there is any "good" or "Bad" governments. IMO they are all instruments of control, which may or may not had a reason to exist when they were set up, but running a government in 2005 the same way, more or less, as it was run in the 1800's makes aas much sense as running a business the same way. The difference is that a business will fail, the government has an endless supply of tax revenue to keep it aflout while sinking the average citizen.

So why do I harp on the States? Is it because I "Hate" American? Not at all. I have been throughout the states on various tourniments and have been treated great by everyone. I can honestly say I have had the most rocking parties in RI I have ever had before. THAT IS WHY I CARE!! What is happening in the States is a crime, and one that shouldn't be allowed to happen. Unfortunatly there is nothing I can do, but there is something Americans can do.

ALso, while the worst case scenerio for Canada going off the deep is probably means...nothing. America going off the deep means world choas, instability and leads possibly to the imputus for the next major world war. Remember, with great power comes great responsiblity(DO I owe marvel copyright for that? LOL), America wanted the power, and up until recently welding that power responsibliy, more or less. Surely you can see the same can not be said for it recently.

I hope that clears it up, I mean no offense to the AMericans but it is up to you to stop it, no one else can. To see a great country being ripped apart, and the best many AMericans can muster is irate apathy, doesn't sit well with many, so with that, understand the poker in the but is ment as good friendly third person perspective. Issued from someone who admires many traits about the American way of life, and is hoping I am not watching the last embers of it.



[edit on 27-6-2005 by Passer By]

Originally posted by Corinthas
The funniest thing about the american attitude is that they STILL CANT UNDERSTAND why no one likes them.


Its like the school bully who cant get a date for ther prom.

What the heck?....

Statements such as the above are ridiculous....to say the least...

BTW, the majority of the people in Iraq do like us, you know, the majority that the media does not talk about?.....

One more thing, we are still getting a lot of immigration from countries such as Cuba, Mexico, and China...wonder why all those people who are being oppressed want to come to the US if they don't like us...wonder why so many people in the middle east are calling for freedom and democracy in their own countries.....

As a matter of fact, it seems as if the only people who don't like us very much are a portion of the people that are living in their own cozy couch, eating meals everyday and enjoying freedom..............

Originally posted by Muaddib
BTW, the majority of the people in Iraq do like us, you know, the majority that the media does not talk about?.....

A majority?
Really?
Where did you hear that?

A poll by the US military says that 71% of the Iraqis they polled were opposed to the presence of the coalition in Iraq.


Provided to the author by American military sources. Face to face interviews with 4,340 Iraqis. Margin of error is +/-3%.
Iraq Index (page31)

Originally posted by AceOfBase
A majority?
Really?
Where did you hear that?

A poll by the US military says that 71% of the Iraqis they polled were opposed to the presence of the coalition in Iraq.
.....

Do tell me, from which part of Iraq where those interviews of Iraqis done?...

If they were all interviewed in Baghdag, that does not constittute the majority of the people in Iraq....

Let's actually see some of the things happening in northern Iraq...

First published on October 20, 2004, 13:26. Last updated on October 28, 2004, 09:22.

We did buy clean water when we had a new baby. It was an embarrassment to offer bad water to our visitors, yet we had no other choice,” said Saud.

"The water was...full of dirt and impurities including sand, clay, worms etc and it was of very bad smell and taste."

Almost 3,000 people live in the village where World Vision worked with the community to rehabilitate the water treatment facilities. This was one of 23 villages in the north of the country for which the rehabilitation of water treatment facilities was undertaken using funding from the Office for Disaster Assistance. To undertake this program World Vision engaged 11 local contractors.

Water station operator, Sfoog told World Vision the station was in very bad condition.

“No maintenance has been done for more than 15 years. Some pumps stopped running and the filters were full of clay and impurities. It was a filtering unit only in name. Water had been pumped from the river to the pipes of the village supplying the village with dirty water,” said Sfoog.

Excerpted from.
meero.worldvision.org...

Humm....what do you think those people, who numbered almost 3,000 in one village to the north of Iraq think of the US and coalition? Note the article says they were able to do the same to 23 other villages.

World Vision was able to provide these services because of the coalition ousting Saddam and his regime....and of course SAddam was trying to get rid of these people, this is the reason why there was a no-fly zone declared in Iraq and both the UK and the US were enforcing it, so Saddam wouldn't continue killing these people anymore....

What do you think they would say about the US ousting Saddam and making their life better and easier because of the coalition?.....

For 15 years Saddam did not do anything for these people, except trying to exterminate them, they were drinking water full of worms, probably disease-ridden....

Do you know from which sections of Iraq the majority of Iraqis live?....
the north and the south....but you don't hear much of that on the news do you?...



[edit on 27-6-2005 by Muaddib]

Originally posted by Muaddib
Do tell me, from which part of Iraq where those interviews of Iraqis done?...

If they were all interviewed in Baghdag, that does not constittute the majority of the people in Iraq....

Let's actually see some of the things happening in northern Iraq...

They were mostly from Baghdad but that was not the only poll of that nature that was conducted.

A positive poll from the International Republican Institute in March of 2005 showed that only 37.4% feel that life was better before the war but they excluded Anbar and Mosul from that poll for security reasons.

I wont make this thread too much about Iraq but since you mentioned clean water, here's a recent link on that:
Stifling Baghdad despairs as water cut adds to misery (June 25 2005)

[edit on 27-6-2005 by AceOfBase]

International Poll Reveals: World favors China over USA

Did we realy need a poll for that ?
It's pretty obvious isn't it ? Some of you seem shocked by this ...?

When the so called "elected" president of your country condems anyone by default who wants to stay neutral in this bogus "war on terrorism" (never forget who trained and funded the "terrorists") then reactions won't be favorable..pretty understandable to me realy.1+1=2 simple as that.the way America si acting thesedays WILL UNFORTNUNATLY ONLY CREATE MORE TERRORISTS, heck even people who want to be neutral here are labbeled as such, ...

Originally posted by Seekerof

as posted by mythatsabigprobe
Think it doesn't affect you? We have a huge budget deficit, coupled with a growing trade deficit and that's VERY serious. There's a new way of life coming soon, enjoy the old way while it lasts.

The personal predicitions forum is located here.
Please knock yourself out with those 'mother of all predicitions' you seem to make quite frequently.

Btw, how about start a running thread on this so-called "coming soon" change you so fondly speak of. I will gladly update it each and every day.

Again, please explain why a insignificant poll concerning this matter mean so much to so few?

seekerof

I'm sorry if you don't see any connection between falling exports and falling world opinion, but I can see by your reply that you don't care much for other people's opinions anyway.

Originally posted by 2nd Hand Thoughts
Budget deficit and trade deficit don't have anything to do with popularity polls. I'm no economist, but have you drawn any correlations between previous popularity contests and our trade deficit and our budget? Seems our deficits have been growing for a long time and when they do it's the fault of our own government.

The budget problem results from domestic policy and foreign policy due to our leaders' being lap dogs for corporations. We import way more than we export don't we? I'm not sure, but isn't that what the trade deficit boils down to.

I'm sorry for you also, I thought most people would understand that events and circumstances can be 'coupled' together by a simple coincidence of timing. There are direct correlations between these two circumstances of course, again I thought most people would understand that the trade deficit affects the national debt, which in turn affects the budget deficit. Then again, I'm no economist either, so I was only referring to the fact that we have both a high trading deficit and a high budget deficit existing at the same time.

I have zero fear that anyone is going to stop buying products based on their current feelings. Is Canada going to stop buying pharmaceuticals from american companies? Is India going to stop using Windoze? Is Japan going to stop sucking up our typically pathetic pop culture offerings? Are chinese students going to stop coming to our universities and often staying for good? Are those who wear sneakers in London going to give them up because the companies are american? Are countries going to refuse products made with US crops (corn, soybeans, etc). Are Camel and Marlboro smokers going to give up smoking? Is Jack Daniels going to go out of business? Maybe. All at once or enough for long enough to signicantly change anything? I don't think so.

Well yes.. There's evidence that's exactly what's happening. Our annual trade deficit was standing at 650 billion in 2004, up from 470 billion in 2002. If it continues growing at this rate it will exceed 1 trillion dollars by the end of next year.

tse.export.gov...

Our national debt is now standing at 7.8 trillion dollars.

www.brillig.com...

Our budget deficit this year is over 400 billion dollars.

www.msnbc.msn.com...

International Tourism figures are UP 12%!! But in real terms, 5 million more tourists visited America in 2000 than in 2004 and with our dollar at record low exchange rates, tourism should be at record high levels...

tinet.ita.doc.gov...

International Student Enrollment is at it's lowest growth in 5 years. 13 of the top 20 nations sending students to the US sent 10-14% fewer students. Again at a time when the low exchange rate makes education and living costs lower and more attractive for foreign students.

opendoors.iienetwork.org...

Of course, none of this has anything to do with the world's opinion of America and has no effect on our economy. :shk:

Originally posted by mythatsabigprobe
International Student Enrollment is at it's lowest growth in 5 years. 13 of the top 20 nations sending students to the US sent 10-14% fewer students. Again at a time when the low exchange rate makes education and living costs lower and more attractive for foreign students.

opendoors.iienetwork.org...

I went to the website after looking at that data and they actually show a drop in 2003/2004 that seems to be the first drop in international enrollment since 1954 or earlier.
opendoors.iienetwork.org...

In 2003/2004, enrollment from China (-4.6%), Japan -11.2%), Taiwan (-6.6%), Hong Kong (-9.0%), Germany (-6.0%), France (-5.6%) and others are down. The country with the largest increase in enrollment was India with a 6.9% increase over 2002/2003.

Interestingly, India was one of the few countries who looked favourably towards the US and was the only country that voted it as the best place to live in that poll. But polls are supposedly meaningless right?

opendoors.iienetwork.org...

Thanks, I didn't see the most recent figures but it's not surprising there's a real drop now. You could see it coming in 2003's figures.

There are some interesting graphs on the TradeStats website, showing which countries we actually have a trade surplus with. The Netherlands and Australia are the top two, both with populations around the size of Florida.. Other notables are Ethiopia, Haiti, The Vatican City, and the Western Sahara.

Relax... everythings ok.

Yeah of course, World opinion obviously has no bearing on the United States. Thanks for the examples Wecomeinpeace, top work, as usual.

Muaddib not even the jaws of life could separate criticism of Bush from being anti-American in your mind. Im anti-American according to you because I dont like one American.

You dont like Osama Bin Laden, does that mean youre anti-Saudi? You dont like Saddam Hussein, are you anti-Iraqi? You dont like Wen Jiabao, are you anti-Chinese? You dont like Bashar al-Assad, are you anti-Syrian? You dont like Ayatollah Khomeini, are you anti-Iranian?

When will you grasp the BASIC PREMISE that our criticism of George W. Bush (one man) is NOT ANTI-AMERICAN! You cannot be that dense, you are purposely trying to deflect ANY criticism of Bush by deliberately labelling it as anti-American. You are a liar and a manipulator.

That will do. This is the News Forum, not Slugfest.

Why is that this puedo-libertarian Anti-American European bastion turns up every time some thread negative about America does the rounds?...They call us aggressive!
It maybe true that people support China more, because all china is doing in this war against terrorism is making sure the terrorists too have a $50 DVD player too- Made in China, at that!. So all the armchair politicians can generate and propagate their "neutral" campaign!
How can anybody be neutral against Terrorism? What does neutral mean? Its like saying - I'm going to stand and watch this person on the street die, why? I'm a neutral! It's my right!. Makes no sense whatso ever ! Neutral??
If all the worlds problems were solved "neutrally" I wonder who would do anything "positively" ! By neutral, do they claim to sit and watch terrorism unfold or let it happen in their region and hinder efforts to stop it or just shout about your right to "nonchalance" !
A survey done by the PRC show the following:

IF the WEST finds us to be HONEST, NON-VIOLENT, INVENTIVE and HARDWORKING, how do they find our Effort for Security as overly offenesive, aggressive and nefarious! Is it that these champions of neutrality believe that Americans have split personalities ?
Also about our contribution in WW2, it is Europe that frequently beats its chest about its sacrifice against facist powers, while we were dragged into it. Ironic it is to call the US as grandiose when it was Europe that continually extol the war.

So the European Nations did nothing? America only joined in World War two to save us? Is it this arguement again?

Also if you look at that, it shows you as immoral and greedy. Maybe that's why? Also could I have a link to that survay? The source of it?

Originally posted by Odium
Also could I have a link to that survay? The source of it?

The chart is from the survey referenced in the initial post of this thread.
pewglobal.org...

I sat down and promised myself that I'd only stay online 1/2 an hour. I had already been on 1/2 hour before I checked ATS. I will reply to at least the current posts directed to me some time this evening. For now:

Here's what I tried to get across in my last post:

Under 16,000 is a little less than over 6,100,000,000. Fact.
16 countries is a little fewer than over 195 countries. Fact.
(I still don't understand why Mexico wasn't included.)

In the reality of the poll, China was "favored" over the US. Fact.
In the reality of the poll, the same countries wanted to see another military super-power in the world. Fact.
In the reality of the poll, the same countries did not want this to be China. Fact.

Now, am I the only one on-the-fence, to the east of-the-fence, or the west of-the-fence who acknowledges that this poll is silly in purporting to encompass "the world"? And how silly it is to discuss a country's feelings or personal feelings by then saying "the world" feels the same as well? Do I doubt that the 16 countries where 1,000 people and less were polled are upset? Not a bit.

HOWEVER, if you truly believe "the world" is favorable or unfavorable in one way or the other, I ask: Based on what? Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan? Smiling kids or severed heads? Your gut feeling? CNN, BBC, or MTV? I acknowledge love and hate and everything in-between. I want to find out where it comes from and how it is nurtured.

Someone might be screaming "The war you idiot. The war!"

That is a crap situation no matter how you slice it. I'm interested in how everyone's opinion is supported or questioned by all forms of media, because not many of us have ever been to Iraq or gitmo or auschwitz or wherever. Where do the spins come from and where does one go to get less spin?

I'm going to come back this evening and discuss the previous posts and I like the in-depth trade post with all the links. I'm going to check them out.

So, if it seems or is true that opinion and trade go hand in hand, my question is still valid. Where are the opinions coming from?

[spelling edit]


[edit on 27-6-2005 by 2nd Hand Thoughts]

Originally posted by Muaddib
BTW, the majority of the people in Iraq do like us, you know, the majority that the media does not talk about?.....

Originally posted by AceOfBase

A poll by the US military says that 71% of the Iraqis they polled were opposed to the presence of the coalition in Iraq.


On this question, I agree with Muaddib. The poll AceOfBase refers to really concerned a different question. Namely the presence of coallition forces inside Iraq. That question is entirely different from "Do you like Americans?." On the one hand the underlying question asked is whether they like the idea of foreign military forces in their country and on the other hand the underlying question is whether they appreciated and liked those same foreign military forces for freeing them. Naturally you're going to get two different responses.

Boy, I obviously don't know how to quote properly.
Somebody tell me how to fix this.




[edit on 27-6-2005 by Astronomer68]

[edit on 27-6-2005 by Astronomer68]

[edit on 27-6-2005 by Astronomer68]

[edit on 27-6-2005 by Astronomer68]

There you go, proves Seekerof's point again that polls are crap. That poll says Canadians are the most violent and rude?

Well, on the ice, it's probably right. Take hockey out of it and it doesn't hold water.

Like you said intrepid, only on the ice.

The graphic shows how each of the countries listed view the US.

I am so very glad people are actually taking the time to go through the report. It makes me feel warm and fuzzy to know that I didn't provide the link in vain.

Originally posted by intrepid
There you go, proves Seekerof's point again that polls are crap. That poll says Canadians are the most violent and rude?

No, that particular chart says Canadians think Americans are violent and rude.
It was about other countries perceptions of Americans.