I'd actually love to create another Sons of Liberty league. Breaking the arms of rickety politicians in dingy alleyways. Sam Adams was in this group, wasnt he?

from the "True Sons link;

"Though their ranks did not include Samuel and John Adams, the fact may have been a result of a mutually beneficial agreement. The Adams' and other radical members of the legislature were daily in the public eye; they could not afford to be too closely associated with violence, neither could the secretive Sons of Liberty afford much public exposure."


So the anwser is open to interpretation.

i've heard of this, never really studied it, but i agree with the principle and it really is a good idea and something to look at. i like this idea better than a full blown revoluition, and will definatly be looking into it. i'll talk to the right people about this. thanks advisor

Are you anarchists? You want to create a state where we are free to act, believe, and express ourselves in whatever way we want and upon whatever whimsical fantasy comes to mind?

And I don't suppose that while you are frolicking in the savanna of personal satisfaction, endlessly looking for new ways to pleasure yourselves, you'll kill two birds with one stone by solving the problems of the world and unite us under a single goal to...pursue whatever goal we want?

This is just based on what you said and what I could decifer from the links. If I'm wrong just give me a holler. Looking forward to your reply.

xeu

Is only bad for those who would no longer be able to consider themselves above the rest of the common folk,the gov of the US are the ones feeling "terrorized",they fear our freedom,so they are making it go away.

All they now possess is liberty,
what they before enjoyed is sacrificed to its service,
and having nothing more to lose,
they disdain submission.

Thomas Paine
Common Sense (1776)

Originally posted by xeu
Are you anarchists? You want to create a state where we are free to act, believe, and express ourselves in whatever way we want and upon whatever whimsical fantasy comes to mind?

And I don't suppose that while you are frolicking in the savanna of personal satisfaction, endlessly looking for new ways to pleasure yourselves, you'll kill two birds with one stone by solving the problems of the world and unite us under a single goal to...pursue whatever goal we want?

This is just based on what you said and what I could decifer from the links. If I'm wrong just give me a holler. Looking forward to your reply.

xeu

If you don't mind, may I know where you got you idea of anarchy from? And I don't see where anyone mentioned "frolicking in the savanna".. ..nope can't find it.
OH


There it is, right next to your post...sorry I guess I didn't read all of your post and missed it...


Not trying to be insulting, but I am wondering what kind of thought pattern you have.


[Edited on 11-8-2003 by ADVISOR]

Or am I just posting "historical" E-text in vain?!


I would not have posted this if I thought it would have recieved this kind of non-attention...shall I just deleted it?

Who among you have time to use the computer but find it too diffucult or inconvienient to read something that is apart of history. Is that alone not worth dedicateing a few minutes a day towards? Seven "7" pages come on...

Yeah I thought so....so much for saveing the "ME" generation. Save your self, because in the end, no one else is going to.


[Edited on 25-9-2003 by ADVISOR]

i dont see how uniting the world will end hunger, and not all people have the same goal.

A world gov wont end hunger.

Obviously, many of you are completely oblivious as to the point. If you don't like to read, why surf the net...

ADVISOR, I am glad you brought this thread back up. Although I knew about the Sons of Liberty, I was not familiar with Paine's work. I will be reading this tomorrow, and I thank you for providing these links.

You are very much welcome. If only every one contained your desire to learn from history, and deny their own ignorance. I appreciate your open mindedness.
Thank you, for careing.

As I typed in my first post of this thread;

Let it be known, those who knew, tried.



Truth, against the world.

Originally posted by ADVISOR
Obviously, many of you are completely oblivious as to the point. If you don't like to read, why surf the net...

Do you have one with pictures?


In all seriousness though, I did read it, and if the language were updated and it were presented to somebody who had not previously read it, they would readily believe that it were written with specific regard to our present government! Quite disturbing.

or when we suffer, or are exposed to the same miseries by a government, which we might expect in a country without government, our calamities is heightened by reflecting that we furnish the means by which we suffer!

Just to vent on one of my current outrages, does anybody else read the above quote and think immediately of the recent expansion of eminent domain to private interests?

just began reading the links....there have been some that connected the 'sons of liberty' to bush, due to the speach with the 'artistic rendition' of the 9 striped flags...........i highly doubt bush will be following the mission statement in the opening post.

the dismeberment of a govt has nothing to do with anarchy.....i thinbk they got that from the opening page on the first link ..."Society is produced by our wants, and government by our wickedness; the former promotes our happiness Positively by uniting our affections, the latter negatively by restraining our vices."......and then stopped reading...............igh>

i wonder if there is a 'new' sons of liberty forming..............................................

we can only hope..............

You will note that several of True Sons of Liberty were publishers and printers.

In todays world, the pen is indeed mightier than the sword.

There are still True Sons within our government, but they need the support of the people
and OUR pens must be raised in support.

It has taken continued pressure from the public to open the Rove case and to investigate
the Downing Street Memo's.

This is just the beginning.

Be involved.

"I draw my idea of the form of government from a principle in nature, which no art can overturn, viz. that the more simple any thing is, the less liable it is to be disordered, and the easier repaired when disordered; and with this maxim in view, I offer a few remarks on the so much boasted constitution of England. That it was noble for the dark and slavish times in which it was erected is granted. When the world was overrun with tyranny the least therefrom was a glorious rescue. But that it is imperfect, subject to convulsions, and incapable of producing what it seems to promise, is easily demonstrated."

the more simple any thing is, the less liable it is to be disordered. (how long would it take to sit down and read every single law in every lawbook in america, today? OUCH! that's one badly messed up gadget. it will be very difficult to fix)
that's not anarchy... it's common sense.

this is a great thread, advisor. this canadian agrees with these types of americans(ie. conscious americans with a conscience).
men of principle are the only men who can be trusted.

the idea of society and government being polar opposites is a new and useful meme for me. i mean, i can SEE that it is that way now, but i never assumed it is ALWAYS this way. it's seems it's just common sense.

men co-operate for survival. societies spring up from these co-ops. as more people join the society, the common will to do common good is faded. so, governments are formed to keep predators of society at bay. inevitably, the government becomes the predator. it seems like a natural cycle, albeit it a tragic one.

Originally posted by FallenFromTheTree
You will note that several of True Sons of Liberty were publishers and printers.

There are still True Sons within our government, but they need the support of the people
and OUR pens must be raised in support.

It has taken continued pressure from the public to open the Rove case and to investigate
the Downing Street Memo's.

In my humble opinion, to focus on a particular misdeed is almost to entirely miss the point.
Waging a grossly unpopular war is but a single manifestation of what is wrong with our system, under a single administration from the vast pool of elitists who consider themselves privlidged or perhaps even entitled to be the ruling class.

Shall we rid ourselves of Bush and replace him with some other party-backed elitist and congratulate ourselves on being like the Sons of Liberty? Certainly not. If partisan attacks are what you call "it has begun" then I'll have no part in whatever "it" is.
My dream, if I were a great enough man with great enough support to accomplish it, would be to see the parties fall. My dream would be to build a constitutional government that rules according to the will of the people and can never again presume to drag the American people kicking and screaming into grotesquely unpopular actions of whatever kind, military or otherwise. My movement, if indeed I had the power to move a nation, would be not to topple Bush but to topple the whole ruling class which dares to act as if we could not be trusted with power over our own futures. Above all, I wish for a government that would no longer view the common man as if he were merely an assett for the all important processes of production and consumption.

I'd like to know the names of your "true sons" because IF they are wealthy partisan hacks with no aspiration to a constitutional revolution then they are true bastards in my book.

Edit to add that very important IF. I meant to put it in their originally but messed up.

[edit on 12-7-2005 by The Vagabond]

It's going to take a few generations to clean up this bog of stench we've gotten ourselves into,
but meanwhile those who honestly care about this country need to speak out and be heard.

Nothing will change until a few True Sons of Liberty show the masses that they CAN
change the system.

The one thing these elitist politicians didn't count on was the speed at which information flows
now over the internet. Cameras and scanners are everywhere and instant processing allows "unfavorable"
images to reveal all sides of the story worldwide in a manner of seconds.

If it were not for the internet,
most of us probably would have never known the gruesome reality of this war or
heard of the Downing Street Memos or Carl Rove.

The True Sons of Liberty are as close as your keyboard.

Send letters to the editor, print flyers, post blogs and talk to your friends and family.
Send requests for more information and coverage to the media.
Write your congressmen and your local elected officials.

All while downloading your favorite new iTunes

The Peasants ARE revolting!

You're right- most of the peasants are incredibly revolting.
They're just buying into empty partisan crap. Most of them will cool their jets once the Republicans are out of power. They'll continue to embrace unconstitutional government, as long as it favors them.
A tyrant is a tyrant- even if he does favors for you. Both parties need to go. The peasants would be far less revolting if they really understood this.

Originally posted by The Vagabond
Do you have one with pictures?

Of course I have one with pictures. A nice 20 by 18 HP monitor, or some where near those measurements.

Hmm, it took almost two years for this thread to pick up, well in 14 days at least it will have been. My friends always tell me I get ahead of myself some times, I guess they were right.