The Conspiracy of Religious Disinformation

Originally posted by madmanacrosswater

shaunybaby, it looks like a prime example for what you just said is built in to the very post you were replying to !!

Yes and no my friend. I suppose you have a complete and clear understanding of something that is so far above what man can even begin to comprehend? Or are you one who wishes to deny your existence?

yes and no?...you can't even give a straight answer there, what is it? is he and i right in what we said or wrong? or as clear as i can put it...we are right, yet its o.k for you not to understand or be able to say what the 'trinity' is because its really complicated.

even if something is above man, you should still be able to describe it. nothings too far above man that we cannot understand it, or put it in to words. most of the things that darwin, newton, einstein thought of, at the time many people couldnt comprehend, yet they could still explain them. the bottom line is that you dont know how to put in words what the trinity is. hence you dont 'really' know what the trinity is, yet you haven't thought to ask anyone.

im going to throw you all in a boat and say that is what most christians are like. its so naive way to do anything. i wouldnt believe in evolution if i didnt understand it or couldnt put in to words my belief. saying that your belief is so far above man to comprehend is not an excuse. sounds like you cant be bothered to really try and really think about it.

dup post. My bad.

[edit on 20-6-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by Mahree
Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit, not Mary.

I think I'm getting tangled up in the definitions. I'm thinking of conceive as in, Mary became pregnant by the Holy Spirit as in Matthew 1:18...using this definition -

Main Entry: con·ceive
1 a : to become pregnant with (young)


Were you saying Jesus was conceived as in this one?

Main Entry: con·ceive
b : to cause to begin : ORIGINATE

Remind me to write to Merriam Webster for clarification.

Still wondering what about this miracle makes madman unsure but the other ones are certain....


[edit on 20-6-2005 by saint4God]

even if something is above man, you should still be able to describe it. nothings too far above man that we cannot understand it, or put it in to words.

Obviously you have not encountered what I have or the statement above would not be there.

Describe? Pure white light or energy, peaceful, serenity. KNOWING we are all interconnected as everything on this planet, in this solar system , and throughout the universe. That all this is really an illusion kept running by the power of GOD.

Einstein-a theory on relativity and definitely on the right track. A great physicist however pales in comparison to the greatest physicist of all who put all this together. However, Einstein's theories can not be proven until man loosens the choke collar we put around us.

The trinity? Which would you like? Their are thousands of them. Take your pick. All interrelated.

You are definitely under the influence of man. Loosen your collar, and open your mind. There is a lot out there that you are missing. Right under your nose.

Organized religion-Ha. The thing that my son and his fiance were fighting over until ole dad had to intervene. She is jewish, he is Christian. Fighting over what the kids would be. Finally I had to intervene and smack them awake. The child would be a child of GOD. Nothing more, and nothing less.

One seems to like absolutes. There is only one. I am very much at peace with myself. Can one say the same?

Namaste' and GOD bless

well you still haven't explained what the holy trinity is, you've just said what it 'could be' and you're too vague. if i were a christian i'd make damn sure i could give an answer to anyone who wanted to know something about my religion. youre an ambassador for your religion, when people talk to you or see you, they see christianity. right now, im seeing you and your religions inabilities to explain or describe one of the, what i thought, main doctrines.

by the by, my mind is open, my collar is loose. i could say the same to you about opening your mind to evolution of which can be explained far better than your explanation of the trinity. it is true than many of einsteins theories are not yet proven because we are yet to catch up with such a genius mind.

i like the fact that you woke up your son n fiance, yet you still say the child is a child of god. so obviously youre saying the child 'should' believe in god and be brought up in a religious home. this is the difference between religious people and athiests. no two athiest parents go out to bring their kids up as athiests, they dont take them to athiest conventions or force science books on them.

well you still haven't explained what the holy trinity is, you've just said what it 'could be' and you're too vague. if i were a christian i'd make damn sure i could give an answer to anyone who wanted to know something about my religion. youre an ambassador for your religion, when people talk to you or see you, they see christianity. right now, im seeing you and your religions inabilities to explain or describe one of the, what i thought, main doctrines.

by the by, my mind is open, my collar is loose. i could say the same to you about opening your mind to evolution of which can be explained far better than your explanation of the trinity. it is true than many of einsteins theories are not yet proven because we are yet to catch up with such a genius mind.

i like the fact that you woke up your son n fiance, yet you still say the child is a child of god. so obviously youre saying the child 'should' believe in god and be brought up in a religious home. this is the difference between religious people and athiests. no two athiest parents go out to bring their kids up as athiests, they dont take them to athiest conventions or force science books on them.

Apparently Shaun one needs to go back to all I have written about the subjects above. I am a member of ALL religions for in each religion some of what they teach is right, and some is misguided by the writings and teachings of man.

Here is a trinity for you. Body, mind, spirit. YOU explain that one to me.

Originally posted by madmanacrosswater
Yes and no my friend. I suppose you have a complete and clear understanding of something that is so far above what man can even begin to comprehend? Or are you one who wishes to deny your existence?

I have the understanding of an intelligent human who was raised for 14+ years in the Chrsitian dogma. Not just church, but that plus school plus home bible studies plus only allowed Chrsitian friends (makes it all easier to shut out the rest of the world) and still deal with it on a regular basis with family visits. I am quiet knowledgeable and very aware not only in my thought process of the Christian doctrine, but of the doctrine and teachings itself (which I find blatantly ignored across the land and this site when a christian tells eveyone else they are wrong of their own lifes ways, may as well burn that bible as to do such).

Perhaps it would do you well to look into another persons posts or simply ask them of their background before implying that one is not of your same level of knowledge.

Misfit

Originally posted by madmanacrosswater
Here is a trinity for you. Body, mind, spirit. YOU explain that one to me.

body - something physical, emotions that are expressed, something you can touch and feel, nice if you have someone elses to touch and feel You're body keeps you alive, it digests your food, makes you stronger, makes you feel tired and so on.

mind - your conscious, or your unconscious. you could say your mind is your brain. the way you think, the way you feel. 'speak you mind', hence speak what you think, believe, feel...i.e your opinion.

spirit - a very vague word. spirit could mean ghost. it could mean your soul, of which is another vague word. you can be a very 'spritual' person, hence believe in magic, ghost, talking to the dead, aliens, fortune telling and so on. perhaps you could be in 'high' spirits. however, if i were talking about someone's spirit, i would say the way they think with their heart. although usually the spirit is thought of something that you cant see or touch, so it isnt physical, yet you can feel it.

anygood?

[edit on 20-6-2005 by shaunybaby]

.
Actually Body, Mind & Spirit is a pretty concise stratification of the aspects of our living biology.

Body - mass of structured organic chemistry.
Mind - internal aspect(s) that the structures of the body allow/create
Spirit - active interface between Mind, Body and the larger reality
.

Originally posted by madmanacrosswater

for were I to believe that Jesus was the light, I would not be bowing to anyone else's inner light.

It is all one in the same my friend. The same Holy Spirit that is Christ. Father, son, and Holy Spirit. The trinity. All one in the same. We are different yet we are all the same. The light that runs through all. Oh, by the way-no bowing. GOD does not wish to be bowed to-just respected and loved.

Evident inyour response is that there is pretense behind your salutation, for the head bow is made coincidental with the uttering of the word; "namaste." It would be akin to a Buddhist, or Hindi uttering salaam or shalom at the end of every statement to another person. It might appear to be some spiritual accord to the utterer, but it comes across as insincere and pretentious, as though such utterances sound so much more god-loving when invoked in a foreign language.


As for the trinity, you have your hands full already when it comes to satisfactorily answering Shaun's question, so suffice it to say that were there a trinity, and were to in fact be present in all of us, the fervent preaching of Christianity's sin and save tactic would be a redundant and unnecessary exercise.

As for the trinity, you have your hands full already when it comes to satisfactorily answering Shaun's question, so suffice it to say that were there a trinity, and were to in fact be present in all of us, the fervent preaching of Christianity's sin and save tactic would be a redundant and unnecessary exercise.

Ah, my friend somewhere, now we are getting "somewhere".

I have heard this Trinity in Christianity since small. I always figured it to be father(GOD), son(Jesus), and the Holy "Ghost". However, these days many churches teach different.

I have trouble with the Trinity I will admit, and also with Christianity's "sin" factor. Perhps I phrased wrongly when I said I was a member of "all" religions. Actually, an active member in NONE!!!

Never would I tell anyone that my knowledge of things is superior to another. What I "witnessed"( I hate the word for it's "Christian" connotations these days) one July eve a couple years back did give me insight into certain things. If I had the "knowledge" to put it all together than I would probably not be active in a "physical" sense on this planet. I also know it took care of a life, and family that was in complete disarray. That much I know as fact-no denying.

I've had the dogma slammed down me throughout life also. My wife's mom a former teacher at a Presbyterian school, etc. My wife once she heard me speak accused me of "weird" religious beliefs. However, once she I got her to sit down and listen to me she began to understand where I was coming from.

Just remember this. I always stop and help turtles cross the road. 4 this year. Remember to always place them on the side of the road they are headed however or they will just turn right around and try to cross again.

Body - mass of structured organic chemistry.
Mind - internal aspect(s) that the structures of the body allow/create
Spirit - active interface between Mind, Body and the larger reality

Zer Goot Herr Slank. However, sometimes the spirit will not interface for it has had it's say, and will let the mind and body "slug" it out. The spirit knows it is leaving sooner or later know matter what happens to the other two.

so weve come to the conclusion that nobody actually can explain the 'holy trinity' or tell us what it is, apart from telling us its 'the father, the son, and the holy spirit/ghost...

Originally posted by madmanacrosswaterI have trouble with the Trinity I will admit, and also with Christianity's "sin" factor. Perhps I phrased wrongly when I said I was a member of "all" religions. Actually, an active member in NONE!!!

Your all religious embracement reminds me of a joke I once about Sammy davis Jr. Sammy loved to sport a rather large Mogan David on his chest, but once when confronted by a frightening experience, to the bewilderment of those with him, he made the sign of the cross. When asked why as jew he would cross himself, he replied: "to save time, it would take too long to do the Star of David." Nothing like keeping all option open and having a backup plan, is there?

Just remember this. I always stop and help turtles cross the road. 4 this year. Remember to always place them on the side of the road they are headed however or they will just turn right around and try to cross again.

I promise to remember your kindness to turtles for as long as I write this particular response. Never before did I realise that kindness to animals was limited to Christians.

promise to remember your kindness to turtles for as long as I write this particular response. Never before did I realise that kindness to animals was limited to Christians.

There ya go again puttin' words on my pad. Acts of kindness to animals are a worldly idea which many times these days gets a good ole fashion stomping. Mostly I have encountered that ones who are of a more spiritual nature generally take a "kinder" approach to nature. I have heard "Christians" say, "What's a few elk." about the new pipeline in Alaska.



[edit on 20-6-2005 by madmanacrosswater]

Originally posted by shaunybaby
so weve come to the conclusion that nobody actually can explain the 'holy trinity' or tell us what it is, apart from telling us its 'the father, the son, and the holy spirit/ghost...

First I'm told the concept is too complex. Now it's too simple? Maybe a re-phrasing of the question. What would you like to know about the trinity?

Originally posted by saint4God

Originally posted by shaunybaby
so weve come to the conclusion that nobody actually can explain the 'holy trinity' or tell us what it is, apart from telling us its 'the father, the son, and the holy spirit/ghost...

First I'm told the concept is too complex. Now it's too simple? Maybe a re-phrasing of the question. What would you like to know about the trinity?

im not saying its complex, im also not saying its too simple. it would be nice for someone to elaborate further on this, what i thought, was a major doctrine of the christian faith, yet no one seems to understand it or be able to say what it is.

Originally posted by madmanacrosswaterThere ya go again puttin' words on my pad. Acts of kindness to animals are a worldly idea which many times these days gets a good ole fashion stomping.

What words exactly did I put on "your pad?" You told me to remember your kindness to turtles, so are you now taking me to task for doing so? Perhaps taking me to task for the Christian inference? The trinity after all, is a Christian concept. And who is stomping on you for same and for what reason did you bring up acts of kindness to God's most innocent little creatures, unless it was for some sort of self-aggrandizement.

In the last two months, I rescued 1 dove, 1 sparrow; stopped traffic on a very busy street to allow Canada geese to cross the road on two separate occassions; slammed on the brakes at least 4 times to avoid dive-bombing birds; stopped to allow a bunny to cross; stopped to allow squirrels on numerous occassions to cross; stopped to allow a racoon to lumber across the street and climb a tree as it tried to steer away from a stalking cat, and chased the cat away from the inevitable peril of said racoon's razor sharp claws when it, the cat, decided that it was in its best interest to pursue the racoon as it fled up a tree. I have no turtles however to report saving, for same are not prevalent in my suburban neighbourhood. I don't go about for no reason speaking to what I do for other living things, and I can assure you that I am in no way a believer in your trinity. So if you think I 'put words on your pad, ' then don't open yourself up to deserving ridicule especially by taking some detour which you obviously think is placed there for you alone.

slammed on the brakes at least 4 times to avoid dive-bombing birds

Those dive bombing birds are heck ain't they? Yes, I'll admit I was referring to your "Christian" reference in my post. You continue to put me under one umbrella. That is okay as long as it is the umbrella of GOD which we are all under or shall I say a part of.

We are not here to judge and condemn. One can't see in another's heart.

Namaste' and GOD bless

[edit on 21-6-2005 by madmanacrosswater]

Originally posted by shaunybaby
im not saying its complex, im also not saying its too simple. it would be nice for someone to elaborate further on this, what i thought, was a major doctrine of the christian faith, yet no one seems to understand it or be able to say what it is.

Trinity means 3. This is not to be mistaken that there are 3 gods, but rather one God made up of different parts that perform different roles. Jesus makes comparisons such as the body containing many parts but are 1 body. Each part of the body works together and in accordance. In drawing on the mind, body, and spirit analogy we've started - God, the Father, the mind if you will, has the plan, makes the rules, and has final say what ultimately happens. Jesus, the body, sacrificed his life here on earth as a physical redemptive presence we desperately needed. The Holy Spirit, the spirit, force that drives actions. Some recall the 'speaking in tongues' event of the apostles, where when they spoke and everyone understood the gospel in the presence of many people of many different languages.

In summation, God is made up of different 'parts'. We know of three forces of different roles which act together as He requires. The hard part isn't explaining it, it's adequately understanding it...because o/~"we're living in a material world and I am a material girl" o/~. Does this help?


[edit on 21-6-2005 by saint4God]