Faith alone and Once Saved Always Saved deflect the fear of the Lord.

To preface this post, I would like to say that I believed in unconditional eternal security aka "once-saved-always-saved" for over 20 years. While I did pour many hours into studying the Bible (often delving into Hebrew and Greek), I always did so through my pastor's lens, and looking back, I took so much out of context. The Holy Spirit warned me about my error many times, and for the most part I completely ignored the conviction, and just doubled down on my pastor's teachings that much more intensely. Thankfully, our Father in heaven is longsuffering, and rather than destroy me, he consistently and firmly chastened me with gradually increasing intensity until I finally realized my error and repented. Ever since then, everything has changed from the inside, out. My hope is to correct the errors that I have so often repeated in the past on this forum. Between the bad soteriology, the false prophecies, and the crazy conspiracy theories I cranked out over the years, the least that I can do is apologize to anyone I may have misled and/or offended and share the valuable lessons I have learned.

We are not justified by faith alone, but we are justified apart from the works of the Law of Moses. Read Romans 3 & 4 together, then read James 2. When Paul said that Abraham was justified apart from works, he clearly meant, apart from the works of the Law of Moses. The context demands this understanding. Paul said this to point out to the Jews that their father, Abraham, did not receive the Law when he believed; nevertheless, he was not without works.

[Rom 3:28 NASB20] 28 For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from works of the Law.

[Rom 4:2-5 NASB20] 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about; but not before God. 3 For what does the Scripture say? "ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS." 4 Now to the one who works, the wages are not credited as a favor, but as what is due. 5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness,

We are indeed justified by faith and works together.

[Jas 2:21-23 NASB20] 21 Was our father Abraham not justified by works when he offered up his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that faith was working with his works, and as a result of the works, faith was perfected; 23 and the Scripture was fulfilled which says, "AND ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS," and he was called a friend of God. [Jas 2:24 NASB20] 24 You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.

Works do not come from our faith, but keep our faith alive, just as the spirit sustains the body.

[Jas 2:26 NASB20] 26 For just as the body without [the] spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.

If you're going to reach for Ephesians 2:8 & 9, then grab verse 10 while you're at it.

[Eph 2:8-10 NASB20] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this [is] not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God; 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

Even Jesus said that the one who does not remain in him will be broken off and thrown into the fire. You have to first be in Christ before you can be broken off.

[Jhn 15:6 NASB20] 6 "If anyone does not remain in Me, he is thrown away like a branch and dries up; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.

If one insists on distorting scripture to uphold the false doctrine that is Once Saved Always Saved, then I don't see how you could possibly fear the Lord or work out your salvation with fear and trembling.

[Mat 10:28 NASB20] 28 "And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
... While I did pour many hours into studying the Bible (often delving into Hebrew and Greek), I always did so through my pastor's lens, and looking back, I took so much out of context. The Holy Spirit warned me about my error many times, and for the most part I completely ignored the conviction, and just doubled down on my pastor's teachings that much more intensely. ...

What happened here is in accordance with the prophecy at 2 Tim 4:3,4:

“For there will be a period of time when they will not put up with the wholesome* [Or “healthful; beneficial.”] teaching, but according to their own desires, they will surround themselves with teachers to have their ears tickled.* [Or “to tell them what they want to hear.”] They will turn away from listening to the truth and give attention to false stories.” (2 Timothy 4:3,4)

Your teachers probably never told you that often the Hebrew and Greek terms that have been translated to "believe" can express different shades of meaning, depending on context and grammatical constructions. So that it can also be translated as "exercise faith". For example, regarding John 3:16, The New World Translation (Study Edition) says:

exercising faith in him: Lit., “believing into him.” The Greek verb pi·steuʹo (related to the noun piʹstis, generally rendered “faith”) has the basic meaning “to believe; to have faith,” but it can express different shades of meaning, depending on context and grammatical constructions. The meaning of this term often goes beyond mere belief or recognition that someone exists. (Jas 2:19) It includes the idea of faith and trust that lead to obedient action. At Joh 3:16, the Greek verb pi·steuʹo is used together with the preposition eis, “into.” Regarding this Greek phrase, one scholar noted: “Faith is thought of as an activity, as something men do, i.e. putting faith into someone.” (An Introductory Grammar of New Testament Greek, Paul L. Kaufman, 1982, p. 46) Jesus obviously refers to a life characterized by faith, not just a single act of faith. At Joh 3:36, the similar expression “the one who exercises faith in the Son” is contrasted with “the one who disobeys the Son.” Therefore, in that context, “to exercise faith” includes the idea of demonstrating one’s strong beliefs or faith through obedience.

Which refers to works of obedience, as James explains. Works that are in accordance with that faith.

Source: John Study Notes—Chapter 3; New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures (Study Edition)

If one insists on distorting scripture to uphold the false doctrine that is Once Saved Always Saved, then I don't see how you could possibly fear the Lord or work out your salvation with fear and trembling.

Next up, the "false doctrine" of the Trinity? Or is that too big a step? How about these myths/false stories (Greek: myʹthos; the same word used at 2 Tim 4:4):

One Myth Leads to Another

“LOOK out,” wrote the apostle Paul to Christians living in the latter half of the first century C.E. What was he warning against? “Perhaps there may be someone who will carry you off as his prey through the philosophy and empty deception according to the tradition of men.”​—Colossians 2:8.

Despite Paul’s warning, from the middle of the second century C.E., some Christians began using concepts borrowed from ancient philosophers in order to explain their beliefs. Why? They wanted to be accepted by the educated people of the Roman Empire and thus make more converts.

Justin Martyr, one of the most famous of these Christians, believed that God’s Spokesman had manifested himself to Greek philosophers long before the arrival of Jesus. According to Justin and like-minded teachers, the contribution of philosophy and mythology to Christianity made this form of religion truly universal.

Justin Martyr’s form of Christianity became very successful in gaining converts. However, the adoption of one myth led to the creation of others and produced what is now commonly believed to be Christian doctrine. To expose these myths, compare what the following reference works say with what the Bible actually teaches.

Myth 1: The Soul Is Immortal
Myth 2: The Wicked Suffer in Hell
Myth 3: All Good People Go to Heaven
Myth 4: God Is a Trinity
Myth 5: Mary Is the Mother of God
Myth 6: God Approves of the Use of Images and Icons in Worship

And that's just a small sample of the myths/false stories taught in Christendom. This book corrects quite a few more:

What Does the Bible Really Teach? (complete book online, no costs, no subscriptions)

"If only" the people taught by the Churches(denominations) of Christendom would listen... (to what God is saying, i.e. in his word, the Bible)

Proverbs 1:20-33:

20 True wisdom cries aloud in the street.

It keeps raising its voice in the public squares.

21 At the corner* of the busy streets it calls out. [Lit., “head.”]

At the entrances of the city gates it says:

22 “How long will you inexperienced ones love inexperience?

How long will you ridiculers take pleasure in ridicule?

And how long will you foolish ones hate knowledge?

23 Respond to my reproof.* [Or “Turn back when I reprove.”]

Then I will pour out my spirit for you;

I will make my words known to you.

24 Because I called out, but you kept refusing,

I stretched out my hand, but no one was paying attention,

25 You kept neglecting all my advice

And rejecting my reproof,

26 I also will laugh when disaster strikes you;

I will mock when what you dread comes,

27 When what you dread comes like a storm,

And your disaster arrives like a storm wind,

When distress and trouble come upon you.

28 At that time they will keep calling me, but I will not answer;

They will eagerly look for me, but they will not find me,

29 Because they hated knowledge,

And they did not choose to fear Jehovah.

30 They refused my advice;

They disrespected all my reproof.

31 So they will bear the consequences* of their way, [Lit., “eat from the fruit.”]

And they will be glutted with their own counsel.* [Or “schemes; plans.”]

32 For the waywardness of the inexperienced will kill them,

And the complacency of fools will destroy them.

33 But the one listening to me will dwell in security

And be undisturbed by the dread of calamity.”

Isaiah 48:17,18:

17 This is what Jehovah says, your Repurchaser, the Holy One of Israel:

“I, Jehovah, am your God,

The One teaching you to benefit yourself,* [Or “for your own good.”]

The One guiding you in the way you should walk.

18 If only you would pay attention to my commandments!

Then your peace would become just like a river

And your righteousness like the waves of the sea.

[paying attention to commandments requires obedience, works of obedience, such as the commandment at Matthew 28:19,20 to “Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded you.””]

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

I don't think that will apply when one renounces and rejects God and Christ for the new religion of the world. Also, it is pretty clear that if you willingly accept the mark of the beast that you are damned.

a reply to: whereislogic

Yeah, my teacher had a PhD. He studied Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic, but reformed theology contaminated his vision. Not that I embrace catholicism or orthodoxy.

I dabbled in unitarianism for a while and returned to trinitarianism. I don't know how one can read the bible and not see that YHWH is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. It's all over the NT.

In fact, I'm not sure one can be justified if they don't accept that Jesus is YHWH.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: whereislogic
I don't know how one can read the bible and not see that YHWH is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. It's all over the NT.

And yet, trinitarian scholars and theologians themselves will freely admit what The Illustrated Bible Dictionary also admits. Speaking of the Trinity, this publication by Trinitarian scholars admits: “It is not a biblical doctrine in the sense that any formulation of it can be found in the Bible.” Because the Trinity is “not a biblical doctrine,” Trinitarians have been desperately looking for Bible texts​—even twisting them—​to find support for their teaching.

Context (playlist, beginning with the first video that discusses the Trinity, the video above is the 13th):

Isaac Newton's science/scientia/knowledge about reality

These ones are the most informative:

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Surely if we consider them works then we are owed for our works, God owes us?
Think the Greek word also meant "deeds"
greekwordstudies.blogspot.com...
Deeds do not require payment (God is not in our debt) opposed to recompense for works as expected

The fruit of the Spirit is our deeds
James was talking faith and deeds, not sure works is "accurate" in context
Saved by grace and not works as Christ accomplished everything required on the cross (or poll, who cares)
Our deeds are an indication of the fruit, The Holy Spirit within

a reply to: whereislogic

And JW,org protects pedophile's and you are happy to accept and submit to that authority
Not much different to catholicism is it really

The works of JW,org are not the fruit of the Spirit, not good deeds, pedo protecting cult

a reply to: Raggedyman

The works we do are in the Holy Spirit, according to the terms of the New Covenant. They are God's own works that we elect to carry out with our free will. God can't owe us for his own works. The words works and deeds are differing translations of the same Greek ergon. The distinction is inconsequential.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Raggedyman

The works we do are in the Holy Spirit, according to the terms of the New Covenant. They are God's own works that we elect to carry out with our free will. God can't owe us for his own works. The words works and deeds are differing translations of the same Greek ergon. The distinction is inconsequential.

I dont think they are inconsequential in context, while yes, our works are carried out by God and in our free will
I think it can be confusing in relation to grace

Martin Luther wrote the epistle of James off as "The book of straw" because of the "works doctrine" he said it taught.
I am not reformed, Calvinist or anything like that, just think in context, deeds makes more sense
Work implies debt to some, thats just my opinion

Like the JW who comments above, he has to comment as works are demanded by JW,org for them to be saved or whatever they believe. Commenting is part of the service to be a good JW, as is door knocking
Their cult demands it, no grace required when you work

a reply to: Raggedyman

[Rev 2:26 KJV] 26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth my works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:

[Eph 2:10] 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus upon good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

If you really think about it, the works we carry out in the Holy Spirit are Jesus' own works, upon which our new nature is created. As the body of Christ, we are co-identified with Christ.

So, the blessings that we inherit by walking in the Spirit are in fact payment from the Father to the Son, since they are Christ's works in the Holy Spirit.

Only a trinitarian can understand this. Do you see what I mean? We are part of Christ's house - the sanctuary - everything we do is to be in his name. Nothing we do in the flesh will survive the fire.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Raggedyman

If you really think about it, the works we carry out in the Holy Spirit are Jesus' own works, upon which our new nature is created. As the body of Christ, we are co-identified with Christ.

No argument, not denying the Trinity
Just think the word "works" can easily be misunderstood

1 Corinthians 3:16 - Do you not know that you are a temple of God and that the Spirit of God dwells in you?

2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.

Colossians 3:3
For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God.

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Aye. Same. Some mortal dude's so called wisdom versus GOD hahahahaha
And I have tried to get away from Christianity due to, haha, other people's behavior.

My covenant is with God, no one else. I'm not worried about the afterlife.
Christ proves even death may die. (Note the REEEE in the air lol) Poof.

#UnplugAndCastOutDevils

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
To preface this post, I would like to say that I believed in unconditional eternal security aka "once-saved-always-saved" for over 20 years. While I did pour many hours into studying the Bible (often delving into Hebrew and Greek), I always did so through my pastor's lens, and looking back, I took so much out of context. The Holy Spirit warned me about my error many times, and for the most part I completely ignored the conviction, and just doubled down on my pastor's teachings that much more intensely. Thankfully, our Father in heaven is longsuffering, and rather than destroy me, he consistently and firmly chastened me with gradually increasing intensity until I finally realized my error and repented. Ever since then, everything has changed from the inside, out. My hope is to correct the errors that I have so often repeated in the past on this forum. Between the bad soteriology, the false prophecies, and the crazy conspiracy theories I cranked out over the years, the least that I can do is apologize to anyone I may have misled and/or offended and share the valuable lessons I have learned.

We are not justified by faith alone, but we are justified apart from the works of the Law of Moses. Read Romans 3 & 4 together, then read James 2. When Paul said that Abraham was justified apart from works, he clearly meant, apart from the works of the Law of Moses. The context demands this understanding. Paul said this to point out to the Jews that their father, Abraham, did not receive the Law when he believed; nevertheless, he was not without works.

[Rom 3:28 NASB20] 28 For we maintain that a person is justified by faith apart from works of the Law.

[Rom 4:2-5 NASB20] 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about; but not before God. 3 For what does the Scripture say? "ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS." 4 Now to the one who works, the wages are not credited as a favor, but as what is due. 5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness,

We are indeed justified by faith and works together.

[Jas 2:21-23 NASB20] 21 Was our father Abraham not justified by works when he offered up his son Isaac on the altar? 22 You see that faith was working with his works, and as a result of the works, faith was perfected; 23 and the Scripture was fulfilled which says, "AND ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS," and he was called a friend of God. [Jas 2:24 NASB20] 24 You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.

Works do not come from our faith, but keep our faith alive, just as the spirit sustains the body.

[Jas 2:26 NASB20] 26 For just as the body without [the] spirit is dead, so also faith without works is dead.

If you're going to reach for Ephesians 2:8 & 9, then grab verse 10 while you're at it.

[Eph 2:8-10 NASB20] 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and this [is] not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God; 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

Even Jesus said that the one who does not remain in him will be broken off and thrown into the fire. You have to first be in Christ before you can be broken off.

[Jhn 15:6 NASB20] 6 "If anyone does not remain in Me, he is thrown away like a branch and dries up; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned.

If one insists on distorting scripture to uphold the false doctrine that is Once Saved Always Saved, then I don't see how you could possibly fear the Lord or work out your salvation with fear and trembling.

[Mat 10:28 NASB20] 28 "And do not be afraid of those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Paul’s whole gospel is in opposition to what Christ taught .

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Surely if we consider them works then we are owed for our works, God owes us?
Think the Greek word also meant "deeds"
greekwordstudies.blogspot.com...
Deeds do not require payment (God is not in our debt) opposed to recompense for works as expected

The fruit of the Spirit is our deeds
James was talking faith and deeds, not sure works is "accurate" in context
Saved by grace and not works as Christ accomplished everything required on the cross (or poll, who cares)
Our deeds are an indication of the fruit, The Holy Spirit within

Faith gets you to the hardware store & it is the tools you buy there that will determine your work .
There is no hell or heaven , only darkness or light .
We all need to build an internal temple out of works in faith . It is our work that turns faith into confidence.

originally posted by: Whiskermegistus

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Surely if we consider them works then we are owed for our works, God owes us?
Think the Greek word also meant "deeds"
greekwordstudies.blogspot.com...
Deeds do not require payment (God is not in our debt) opposed to recompense for works as expected

The fruit of the Spirit is our deeds
James was talking faith and deeds, not sure works is "accurate" in context
Saved by grace and not works as Christ accomplished everything required on the cross (or poll, who cares)
Our deeds are an indication of the fruit, The Holy Spirit within

Faith gets you to the hardware store & it is the tools you buy there that will determine your work .
There is no hell or heaven , only darkness or light .
We all need to build an internal temple out of works in faith . It is our work that turns faith into confidence.

So, your faith is in your works, fine
Mine is in Jesus and what He accomplished
My confidence is in Jesus, not myself or my works
I am not asking you to believe what I believe

Heaven is to be with God, Hell is to be away from Him

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: Whiskermegistus

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Surely if we consider them works then we are owed for our works, God owes us?
Think the Greek word also meant "deeds"
greekwordstudies.blogspot.com...
Deeds do not require payment (God is not in our debt) opposed to recompense for works as expected

The fruit of the Spirit is our deeds
James was talking faith and deeds, not sure works is "accurate" in context
Saved by grace and not works as Christ accomplished everything required on the cross (or poll, who cares)
Our deeds are an indication of the fruit, The Holy Spirit within

Faith gets you to the hardware store & it is the tools you buy there that will determine your work .
There is no hell or heaven , only darkness or light .
We all need to build an internal temple out of works in faith . It is our work that turns faith into confidence.

So, your faith is in your works, fine
Mine is in Jesus and what He accomplished
My confidence is in Jesus, not myself or my works
I am not asking you to believe what I believe

Heaven is to be with God, Hell is to be away from Him

Christ taught a way that requires tremendous work .

a reply to: Whiskermegistus

No, it's just that Paul is easily misunderstood, because his doctrine touches upon mysteries hidden in the Old Testament. Paul did not teach faith alone. That was Martin Luther's nonsense.

a reply to: Whiskermegistus

Jesus' commands are not burdensome, and Jesus clearly taught about the kingdom of heaven, the abyss, and Gehenna.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Whiskermegistus

No, it's just that Paul is easily misunderstood, because his doctrine touches upon mysteries hidden in the Old Testament. Paul did not teach faith alone. That was Martin Luther's nonsense.

Paul was called in twice for teaching the wrong stuff . Jesus wanted to change the Jewish ways & was not concerned about gentiles .

originally posted by: Whiskermegistus

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: Whiskermegistus

originally posted by: Raggedyman
a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Surely if we consider them works then we are owed for our works, God owes us?
Think the Greek word also meant "deeds"
greekwordstudies.blogspot.com...
Deeds do not require payment (God is not in our debt) opposed to recompense for works as expected

The fruit of the Spirit is our deeds
James was talking faith and deeds, not sure works is "accurate" in context
Saved by grace and not works as Christ accomplished everything required on the cross (or poll, who cares)
Our deeds are an indication of the fruit, The Holy Spirit within

Faith gets you to the hardware store & it is the tools you buy there that will determine your work .
There is no hell or heaven , only darkness or light .
We all need to build an internal temple out of works in faith . It is our work that turns faith into confidence.

So, your faith is in your works, fine
Mine is in Jesus and what He accomplished
My confidence is in Jesus, not myself or my works
I am not asking you to believe what I believe

Heaven is to be with God, Hell is to be away from Him

Christ taught a way that requires tremendous work .

Yes, christianity is a hard walk, no question.
But it’s not a work to be Christian, it’s an act of love to be christian