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Chinese Weapons Designer: “Magic Weapons” To Prevent Taiwan Independence

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posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 06:49 PM
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The HUMVEE that the chinese built is a copy. I have read reports and seen photos of a long assembly line of chinese copies of HUMVESS. AM General has denied ever giving them permission to build the vehicles. You see? COPY. Also Chinese was first exposed to an advanced missile heat seeking system when an AIM-9 fired from a Taiwan F-86 hit a Chinese Mig but did not go off. The missile stuck in place and they took it home. After the missile was capted you see a big change in design in Russian air to air missiles. The Chinese got all their knowledge of missiles from the Russians. The new AWAKS was developed using a Russian platform and an Israeli designed radar. The J-10 based in the Israeli Lavi fight which was based on the F-16. China also got an F-16 from a Pakistani pilow who defected. Almost every vehicle in their army can be traced back to a Russian design. I give them credit on their new naval designs. They are impressive but most of the systems are based off Russian designs, as are missiles and guns.




posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 06:51 PM
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Obviously you cant read, I said I don't see any other military having an all purpose vehicle that looks similar in design to the Humvee, I know that other military's have their own G.P.V.'s.

And the Humvee may be more expensive but the new improved versions will keep you A safe from just about anything, those bad boys can go overland mines and through road side bombs ad you will still walk away form the wreckage.



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 06:58 PM
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Here is a photo of the copy of the US Avenger system:




posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 07:10 PM
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Originally posted by jetsetter
The HUMVEE that the chinese built is a copy. I have read reports and seen photos of a long assembly line of chinese copies of HUMVESS. AM General has denied ever giving them permission to build the vehicles.


Wrong...

www.sinodefence.com...


During the 1988 Beijing Defence Exhibition, AM General demonstrated an example of its M998 4x4 high-mobility multirole wheeled vehicle (HMMWV) to the PLA. The vehicle was reportedly left in China after the exhibition closed for further test and evaluation. Since the early 1990s the Chinese petroleum industry and police departments have purchased a small number of civilian HMMWVs through commercial sources


Basically... GM say's "go ahead and build them... we will sell you the parts"


You see? COPY. Also Chinese was first exposed to an advanced missile heat seeking system when an AIM-9 fired from a Taiwan F-86 hit a Chinese Mig but did not go off. The missile stuck in place and they took it home. After the missile was capted you see a big change in design in Russian air to air missiles.


Can I have a source for this?... never heard of such and incident


The Chinese got all their knowledge of missiles from the Russians.


A good chunk yes... as does india and many many countries


The new AWAKS was developed using a Russian platform and an Israeli designed radar.


Just the airframe is russian... saved the chinese spending years developing their own (they have the capability easily)...
The radar is chinese as the Isreali's refused to sell them the phalcon


The J-10 based in the Israeli Lavi fight which was based on the F-16. China also got an F-16 from a Pakistani pilow who defected.


Yup... China combined many technologies... again saving years R+D. however it's not a blatant copy, sharing NONE of the airframe of either jet you mentioned. It simply is an advancement using indiginous and foreign technology to produce something unique.


Almost every vehicle in their army can be traced back to a Russian design. I give them credit on their new naval designs. They are impressive but most of the systems are based off Russian designs, as are missiles and guns.


Guns no... missiles, some... the gun launched anti-tank missile being one, however much of China's missile technology is indiginious after russia stopped tech transfer some 50 years ago... only restarting again fairly recently

Look at it this way... china's millitary is a hotch potch of foreign and domestic, like many millitaries out there...

China's new destroyers use french guns and russian designed AA missiles... but the whole system is essentially chinese...





[edit on 26-3-2005 by Lucretius]



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 07:14 PM
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From your link:


Some of these vehicles are believed to have been used for reverse engineering purpose



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 07:18 PM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23
Obviously you cant read, I said I don't see any other military having an all purpose vehicle that looks similar in design to the Humvee, I know that other military's have their own G.P.V.'s.


Maybe that say's something abou the HMMWV no?



And the Humvee may be more expensive but the new improved versions will keep you A safe from just about anything, those bad boys can go overland mines and through road side bombs ad you will still walk away form the wreckage.


They were never designed for this purpose though... the US army misuses them by sending them into urban environments like that... it was designed for scout and behing the lines ferry missions... not urban combat.

This is a far better vehicle



[edit on 26-3-2005 by Lucretius]



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 07:18 PM
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Originally posted by jetsetter
From your link:


Some of these vehicles are believed to have been used for reverse engineering purpose


yes... I already stated the design was taken and modified... GM is supplying the parts under license however



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 07:39 PM
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As for the Chinese AWACS,

One was designed with Israeli help on a Russian airframe,

And i think the other might've got Swedish help.

Of course, none of those countries would admit it.



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 07:43 PM
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heh... the Isreali radar deal was cancelled after American preasure.

The Airframe sat for 3 years while China developed it's own system and imported the airframe just recently along with 2 others for testing of the prototype.

Nobody knows the capabilities of the Chinese system other than it features 3 phased array radars in a triangular configuration for full 360 degree coverage.

Apparently one radar in a rotating dome like the US system is inneficiant and causes problems with aerodynamics



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 07:58 PM
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Lucretius you sound like the Chinese Minister or Propaganda , or better yet you sound like the former Iraqi minister of information, man I loved that guy his stories always made be bust out laughing.
And china only makes the easiest things on the systems but they copy the rest from other countries.



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 08:02 PM
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again where is your evidence young one?

I could say the same about you and your beloved US... so I guess the feeling is mutual hmm?


At least I have the courtesy to back my claims up with links



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 08:04 PM
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Originally posted by LucretiusThey were never designed for this purpose though... the US army misuses them by sending them into urban environments like that... it was designed for scout and behing the lines ferry missions... not urban combat.


it was designed for multi purpose frontline infantry support, it replaced the jeep, M718A1 ambulance, half-ton Mule, 1.25-ton Gamma Goat, and M792 ambulance.



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 08:07 PM
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Originally posted by WestPoint23
Lucretius you sound like the Chinese Minister or Propaganda , or better yet you sound like the former Iraqi minister of information, man I loved that guy his stories always made be bust out laughing.
And china only makes the easiest things on the systems but they copy the rest from other countries.

Mabye he sounds a bit like the UK's MI6 director or the CIA director of intel before 01/02/04....



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 08:15 PM
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Our "Hummer" is built under license. Perfectly legal.

The embargo is nothing but a piece of paper. EU sells us basically everything anyways. The embargo only prevents the sale of complete weapons such as completed tanks, airplanes or destroyers, Technology is not prohibited so thats why we almost got ourselves some phalcon AWACS and some of the stuff that we have now.



posted on Mar, 26 2005 @ 11:14 PM
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posted on Mar, 27 2005 @ 04:36 AM
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The Avenger ADS is just a HMMWV with 8 stinger missiles and a .50cal gun with a high rate of fire, it's nothing new or improved, just the same Stinger as the MANPAD AFAIK, but ofcourse with some better electronics.

Back to topic, Magic Weapons huh? must be the same type of magical weapons as the Phillipenos so "spirits" can't attack them or what not...



posted on Mar, 27 2005 @ 07:04 AM
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Originally posted by Stealth Spy

It may cause China’s economy to fall back by 20 years


This wasn't a well thought out statement was it?

China has the strongest growing economy in the world. Military Conflict won't destablize this.

Secondly, war has an effect of rallying the nation and increasing production and GDP which in turn would boost the currency and economy.

Tell me if you still think you are correct on this statement.



posted on Mar, 27 2005 @ 07:24 AM
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Originally posted by 00PS

Originally posted by Stealth Spy

It may cause China’s economy to fall back by 20 years


This wasn't a well thought out statement was it?

China has the strongest growing economy in the world. Military Conflict won't destablize this.

Secondly, war has an effect of rallying the nation and increasing production and GDP which in turn would boost the currency and economy.

Tell me if you still think you are correct on this statement.


China's growth is primarily export led growth. Possible sanctions and even embargoes will have a substantial effect. The twenty year figure may be a bit overboard but it isn’t as rosey as you suggest.

On your second point it could have the absolute negative effect - China may fall into civil war. Its hard to speculate what will happen in the unlikely event of a Tiawan conflict. It will only come about if the Chinese cant take the hit to their pride of an "Independent" Taiwan. The boat set sail a long time ago and Tiawan are a seperate nation.

Its going to be interesting to see what China is going to do with all this military they are building - claiming they are a peaceful nation stating their vast heritage of peace. History has taught us to be prudent and has punished us when we have showed a weak hand - *the Japanese peace talks with America a few days before Pearl Harbour*

China is being watched carefully.



posted on Mar, 27 2005 @ 07:38 AM
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Uncle sam can sit on his finger and twirl. The boat left a long time ago? What are you talking about? Taiwan is a province of China. There has been a long history of colonialism but China has just and legitimate right to claim it as its own.

JiangGaiShi led his people to failure in a civil war. They have no rights to claim land and annex it from the soverign nation of China. I know that sounds like I'm following the party line but I take my lesson from Jackson. When the south lost they did not get to annex the south. They could have only done that if they won. Jiang fled the mainland and sought refuge. It's also like the Dalai Lama from Tibet claiming Dharmsala should be Tibetan land not Indian...it's illogical by nature.

Lastly, the export trade of China could be stiffled by sanctions imposed by the US but the majority of China's export partners are allies with China before America. I'm counting all the developing nations of the Asian region, Africa and South Africa that rely heavily on Chinese exports. USA could only impose sanctions because they don't need to. However European countries could and probably would block US sanctions, which would ultimately lead the USA to confront China in the South China Sea.



posted on Mar, 27 2005 @ 07:39 AM
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The chinese military is more shrouded in mystery than the US. They have layers of civilian industry wrapped around layers of military industry. It even hard to tell what they spend on their armed forces. Some say it could be as high as 100billion US. I think one thing is certain there will be a quit a few surprises coming out that military before the US kicks it ?#??. When I mean we will win, It will not because we could muster a huge military force. It will because we have 13 CBG's that can deliever, not this rough math given 18 hard point and JDAMs 5 500lb, 5 1000lb, and 8 2000lb, 23500x1040planes in all CBG (80 planes per), 2,444,000lbs of ordinace with just one sorty per plane. I know my information is wrong, I possible have seriously low balled that amt, but you guys get the point. We will unleash the thunder of God, and sea of fire will follow; nothing the chinese will be able to do about, no matter what they have up their sleeve.




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