Pyramids and the Symbol on the Dollar bill ?

Originally posted by Mr No One

Originally posted by OpenSecret2012
1. The Hebrews didn't exist when the pyramids in Egypt were being built, [edit on 18-3-2005 by OpenSecret2012]

Ummm...OK. I'm not sure what history you're referring to, but Hebrews have been around as long, if not longer (depending on whether or not you consider the Bible to be based on historical fact) than the pyramids. You are correct in saying there were not many of them (counted in the thousands). Please see the link in my previous post and...

Here is a link saying the Egyptians used the Hebrews as slaves - see The exodus.

The Bible, starting from Adam to present time, covers a period of roughly 7,000 years. (Noah and his flood happened roughly 6,000 years ago. Almost all the guys from Adam to Noah lived long enough to have met Adam.) Moshe was born roughly 4,000 years ago.

The Great Pyramids were built roughly 150,000 years ago. (To any Bible believers, relax, the Bible talks of civilizations existing millions of years before Adam and Eve were created. )
They have been repaired, and touched up, by Egyptian rulers the past thousands of years. And even messed with, like how the cap stone was removed and hidden.

Zecharia Sitchen goes into detail about the date they were made, in his books. One of his examples is the fact that the Great Pyramids are built at a steeper angle then the more "younger" pyramids all over Egypt. Also whenever the Egyptians attempted to make more pyramids like the Great Pyramids, they crumbled. There's even 1 pyramid that started off at the same angle as the Great Pyramids, but started crumbling, and the rest was built at a less steeper angle to stop it from crumbling.
Sitchen shows this is proof Egyptian rulers during Bible times never made the Great Pyramids, since they could never replicate the steep angle they were made.

It IS possible Hebrews were used as part of the slave force to build other pyramids, temples, oblilsks, buildings, around Egypt.
I think the Hebrew god Yahweh on purpose wanted the Hebrews to remain slaves for roughly 400 years or something. It was long enough time that the Hebrews gave up calling on their god.

Originally posted by Mr No One

Originally posted by OpenSecret2012
1. The Hebrews didn't exist when the pyramids in Egypt were being built, [edit on 18-3-2005 by OpenSecret2012]

Ummm...OK. I'm not sure what history you're referring to, but Hebrews have been around as long, if not longer (depending on whether or not you consider the Bible to be based on historical fact) than the pyramids. You are correct in saying there were not many of them (counted in the thousands). Please see the link in my previous post and...

Here is a link saying the Egyptians used the Hebrews as slaves - see The exodus.

I read this link you gave. Umm.... do you realize it shows proof the Jews did NOT build the pyramids? LOL! It says the Hebrews were in Egypt roughly 4,000 years ago. The Great Pyramids were definatly built before 1,700 BC!

Some of the tribes, traditionally belonging to the Joseph group, wandered toward Egypt, probably during the period of the Hyksos kings, the predominantly Semitic conquerors of Egypt, between 1694 and 1600 bc.

Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by drogo
i will state that that websight is not the only one. not only that but i have never heard anyone acuse freemasonary of feeding thier dogs laxitives. by your reaction being so strong i would sudgest that perhaps you are a mason yourself? if so i urge you to tell all to bring your secrets out openly before the world. even the ones that are reserved only for those enlightened enough to recieve them.

I am. Freemasonry's secrets are only esoteric, deealing with our rituals. And our modes of recognition, that's it. Even so, you can find everything in over one thousand books and several website son the internet. you call those secrets?

i havew pointedly asked a couple of ex-masons about these secrets. do you know what response i get? they almost turn white and start to look around like they are paranoid. then they will not answer.

You sir are a LIAR. That has never happened and YOU KNOW this as well as I do. If you mention these secrets to a mason, they will give you the same reaction I just did, and probably laugh at you. You don't see me turning white and getting paranoid, eh? Go do some research and come back when you know what you're talking about.

Ahhh, but sebatwerk,

What level are you? What level Freemason are you? How many degrees are you?

"I'm a Freemason! Yeah! .... I'm a level 1 out of 32 levels though."

Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by Mr No One
The pyramids of Egypt were erected by the then ruling class by use of slaves. The ruling class of Egpyt being black in ethnicity and the majority of their slaves being Hebrew (or white).

Are you kidding? Where do you get your history from, Hollywood? Anybody with a decent knowledge of history knows that Egyptians built their own pyramids, not Jewish slaves! Provided, some Egyptians were forced to build them, but that's it. Don't believe everything you see in a movie.

The unfinished pyramid is a representation of a country that is still building itself, progressing towards the geometric perfection of a pyramid.

andersonr: I too saw a thing on the history Channel that explained what youre talking about. Khufu's pyramid, the Great Pyramid, was covered with a layer of something or other, I forget the details. but, just like the guy stated above, the winds eroded the layering away except at the very top. I think that was the only pyramid like that, so that's why you see this

Don't listen to Novusordo or the other guy pointing you to freemasonrywatch.com. They've been drinking a little too much coffee and are so paranoid they think Freemasons are running the world and feeding their dogs laxatives.



[edit on 18-3-2005 by sebatwerk]

okay for one you don't nave any idea of what you are talking about because every thing that nevusordo and or the "other guy" are both correct so don't do stupid things

Originally posted by drogo
why does britton now have laws about discloseing free masonary status for many government possitions.

1. It's Britain. B-r-i-t-a-i-n. But you can call it Great Britain if you like.

2. There are no laws about discloseing (sic) membership of freemasonry in the UK. The reason for that is very simple - to discriminate in that way against one group in society is against the European Convention on Human Rights and is therefore illegal in the UK. Not that that stops some ignorant people from trying to discriminate against freemasons on the grounds that 'they are secret and therefore up to no good'. The fact that neither is true seems to pass them by.

You may be thinking of the parliamentary special interest register. In the interests of transparency British Members of Parliament have to register every company directorship and organisational membership that could cause a conflict of interest in their legislative jobs. Whilst membership of freemasonry doesn't have to be included most freemasons do so, following the spirit of the parliamentary guidelines.

Originally posted by OpenSecret2012
Ahhh, but sebatwerk,

What level are you? What level Freemason are you? How many degrees are you?

"I'm a Freemason! Yeah! .... I'm a level 1 out of 32 levels though."

I'm a 3rd degree Master Mason. What does this have ANYTHING to do with what we're talking about?

Because thats all the degrees there are, uh huh, yessir.

And although we do acknowledge wisdom in the Lodge, don't we treat those with greater knowledge of Freemasonry like gods, while we run off like dogs to read the books they PANder.

13 degrees for the York Rite (9 admitted, 4 'commandery orders', not a degree honest)
33 for Scottish Rite, I mean 32 and 1 arbitrary (yet you can find a Crime Overlord with the 33 degree in Eastern Europe a dime a dozen, I guess you can buy it over there)
So take for example, the Great Seal of the USA, with its Eagle and other Occult symbolism.

Its Right Wing, symbolizing the Right Hand Path one can assume, has 32 feathers, for the 32 degrees of the Scottish Rite, presumably.
Its Left Wing, symbolizing the Left Hand Path, has 33 feathers, suggesting the nature of what is necessary to achieve the 33 degree.

The Eagle on the Great Seal has 9 tail feathers, you are the sas of the Nation!
The first Grand Lodge of the Scottish Rite in America, was formed at Charleston, South Carolina, in 1783: a Supreme Council and it lies exactly on the 33rd parallel of latitude.

Again, 32 degrees is frozen, 33 degrees is beginning to thaw.
If you like numbers, take Pi, the layman's version will suffice, 3.1415 x 10, so we will only have to deal with three decimal places. Add the GOLDEN Phi, 1.618 (again, because we want 3 decimals, the sequence continues with a 1, so it is rounded down to 1.618 from 1.61819), what do you get?
31.415 +
1 .618=
33.033

Ok, so there is something to 33. Add up the first 7 (mystical) Fibonacci (holy) numbers and the total is? 1, +1, +2, +3, +5, +8, +13= 33!
And, as if 33 wasn't important enough already, you take the distance between the Earth and the Sun, called 1 AU, Astronomical Unit, AKA 92,955,807 miles, or 4.9080666 x 10^11 feet from Earth. Well, whats so special about that?
Divide the above distance in feet by 33 and you get the Golden Phi(1.61819), (you will get 1.6196 if you do the math which I will explain to anyone that bothers to ask). Yes, the ratio of 33 and the Golden Phi give us the Harmonic of distance between the Earth and the Sun.

But what is the connection between 13 and 33? Why, the Metric system will tell us that in a jiffy (not a Metric unit) 13 inches is 33 centimetres, closer to exact, in fact, than any other inch to cm conversion short of 100/254.

And we all know that if you're a 32 degree, over here in Celsius world, your just a ZERO!

"the candidate that he must first learn [who] to obey before he can rule, and to [be] govern[ed] himself before he can govern others."
You received the Substitute word, because you deserved it.

13 degrees is how much the Moon travels across the sky in one day,
and there are 13 moon cycles in a YEAR as well.
But is there evidence of the use of the number 13 in the Great Masonic Seal?
13 stars in the crest

13 stripes in the shield

13 olive leaves

13 olives

13 arrows

13 feathers on each arrow

13 letters in “E Pluribus Unum” (Out of many one)

13 letters in “Annuit Coeptis” (He hath prospered our beginning)

13 elements in a pyramid (4 edges meet on the bottom, 4 meet at the tip + 5 surfaces)

13 cources (levels) in the pyramid

I say, what is evidence? Jezeus, I mean Jesus had 12 disciples. Zeus had 12 Olympians (which the Elite like to still refer to themselves as), making themselves the 13th.

Now that your eyes are open, read the meaning of ignorance: To not know WHAT is worth knowing.
"They suppose that because the smallest circle hath as many degrees as the largest, therefore the regulation and management of the world require
no more abilities than the handling and turning of a Globe."- World Domination lessons more than 300 years old.

And finally, for those who are looking for a taste of the Bible, the number 13 does not appear in the SCRIPTURE of the New Testament, however open your virtual Bibles to Matthew 13:13
"This is why, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand, I speak to them in parables."
As above, so below. So look up.

Originally posted by akilles
Because thats all the degrees there are, uh huh, yessir.

And although we do acknowledge wisdom in the Lodge, don't we treat those with greater knowledge of Freemasonry like gods, while we run off like dogs to read the books they PANder.

13 degrees for the York Rite (9 admitted, 4 'commandery orders', not a degree honest)
33 for Scottish Rite, I mean 32 and 1 arbitrary (yet you can find a Crime Overlord with the 33 degree in Eastern Europe a dime a dozen, I guess you can buy it over there)
So take for example, the Great Seal of the USA, with its Eagle and other Occult symbolism.

Its Right Wing, symbolizing the Right Hand Path one can assume, has 32 feathers, for the 32 degrees of the Scottish Rite, presumably.
Its Left Wing, symbolizing the Left Hand Path, has 33 feathers, suggesting the nature of what is necessary to achieve the 33 degree.

The Eagle on the Great Seal has 9 tail feathers, you are the sas of the Nation!
The first Grand Lodge of the Scottish Rite in America, was formed at Charleston, South Carolina, in 1783: a Supreme Council and it lies exactly on the 33rd parallel of latitude.

Again, 32 degrees is frozen, 33 degrees is beginning to thaw.
If you like numbers, take Pi, the layman's version will suffice, 3.1415 x 10, so we will only have to deal with three decimal places. Add the GOLDEN Phi, 1.618 (again, because we want 3 decimals, the sequence continues with a 1, so it is rounded down to 1.618 from 1.61819), what do you get?
31.415 +
1 .618=
33.033

Ok, so there is something to 33. Add up the first 7 (mystical) Fibonacci (holy) numbers and the total is? 1, +1, +2, +3, +5, +8, +13= 33!
And, as if 33 wasn't important enough already, you take the distance between the Earth and the Sun, called 1 AU, Astronomical Unit, AKA 92,955,807 miles, or 4.9080666 x 10^11 feet from Earth. Well, whats so special about that?
Divide the above distance in feet by 33 and you get the Golden Phi(1.61819), (you will get 1.6196 if you do the math which I will explain to anyone that bothers to ask). Yes, the ratio of 33 and the Golden Phi give us the Harmonic of distance between the Earth and the Sun.

But what is the connection between 13 and 33? Why, the Metric system will tell us that in a jiffy (not a Metric unit

) 13 inches is 33 centimetres, closer to exact, in fact, than any other inch to cm conversion short of 100/254.

And we all know that if you're a 32 degree, over here in Celsius world, your just a ZERO!

"the candidate that he must first learn [who] to obey before he can rule, and to [be] govern[ed] himself before he can govern others."
You received the Substitute word, because you deserved it.

13 degrees is how much the Moon travels across the sky in one day,
and there are 13 moon cycles in a YEAR as well.
But is there evidence of the use of the number 13 in the Great Masonic Seal?
13 stars in the crest

13 stripes in the shield

13 olive leaves

13 olives

13 arrows

13 feathers on each arrow

13 letters in “E Pluribus Unum” (Out of many one)

13 letters in “Annuit Coeptis” (He hath prospered our beginning)

13 elements in a pyramid (4 edges meet on the bottom, 4 meet at the tip + 5 surfaces)

13 cources (levels) in the pyramid

I say, what is evidence? Jezeus, I mean Jesus had 12 disciples. Zeus had 12 Olympians (which the Elite like to still refer to themselves as), making themselves the 13th.

Now that your eyes are open, read the meaning of ignorance: To not know WHAT is worth knowing.
"They suppose that because the smallest circle hath as many degrees as the largest, therefore the regulation and management of the world require
no more abilities than the handling and turning of a Globe."- World Domination lessons more than 300 years old.

And finally, for those who are looking for a taste of the Bible, the number 13 does not appear in the SCRIPTURE of the New Testament, however open your virtual Bibles to Matthew 13:13
"This is why, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand, I speak to them in parables."
As above, so below. So look up.

You're completely off your rocker, Akilles. NOTHING you posted above has ever meant ANYTHING to anyone but you.

NOBODY creates symbolism by making people do stuff like take Pi, add 1.618, round down to 1.618 from 1.61819, take 31.415 + 1 .618 = 33.033. That's completely ludicrous and you are absolutely GRASPING AT STRAWS to try to make a point that only means something to you.

And, for the last time: 13 DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING TO MASONS!!!

You are GUESSING everything you wrote above, and you have absolutely NO EVIDENCE that ANY of that was done on purpose. So until you do, save your breath.

To be clear, 1.618 is IN NO WAY ARBITRARY as Sebatwerk claimed. It is very important in Nature... As everyone knows, PI does NOT show up in nature, there are no perfect circles out there (except for the Rock band).
So here we go, the Golden Phi. It is the Golden Section, the Golden Spiral...
The ratio of 0.618 to 1, which is equal to 1 to 1.618
The SAME AS ADDING 1, yet it is a multiplication. You must multiply .618 x 1.618 to get 1.
You must multiply 1 x 1.618, and then, for the most interesting step, multiply by 1.618 again! 2.1618!!! Now you see, now you know, the self-repeating pattern of nature.

Humans know this pattern as Fibonacci series, you know like PHIbonacci, the number PHIve, maybe even PHIre? 2, 3, 5, 8, 13... Take 5/8, that gives you an approx. of .618, but wait, take 13 OVER 8+13 (the next number in the series), and you get .619, very close. So you see, the series actually approaches NATURE'S ratio as it progresses.
And so, Pi and Phi and 33, all important,tying in Sacred Geometry with Freemasonry.

Yeah, 13 means nothing? What letter is
G
13

So you mean its 13 in a Square? Not important at all...

"And although we do acknowledge wisdom in the Lodge, don't we treat those with greater knowledge of Freemasonry like gods, while we run off like dogs to read the books they PANder.

13 degrees for the York Rite (9 admitted, 4 'commandery orders', not a degree honest)
33 for Scottish Rite, I mean 32 and 1 arbitrary (yet you can find a Crime Overlord with the 33 degree in Eastern Europe a dime a dozen, I guess you can buy it over there)
So take for example, the Great Seal of the USA, with its Eagle and other Occult symbolism.

Its Right Wing, symbolizing the Right Hand Path one can assume, has 32 feathers, for the 32 degrees of the Scottish Rite, presumably.
Its Left Wing, symbolizing the Left Hand Path, has 33 feathers, suggesting the nature of what is necessary to achieve the 33 degree.

The Eagle on the Great Seal has 9 tail feathers, you are the sas of the Nation!
The first Grand Lodge of the Scottish Rite in America, was formed at Charleston, South Carolina, in 1783: a Supreme Council and it lies exactly on the 33rd parallel of latitude.

Again, 32 degrees is frozen, 33 degrees is beginning to thaw.
If you like numbers, take Pi, the layman's version will suffice, 3.1415 x 10, so we will only have to deal with three decimal places. Add the GOLDEN Phi, 1.618 (again, because we want 3 decimals, the sequence continues with a 1, so it is rounded down to 1.618 from 1.61819), what do you get?
31.415 +
1 .618=
33.033

Ok, so there is something to 33. Add up the first 7 (mystical) Fibonacci (holy) numbers and the total is? 1, +1, +2, +3, +5, +8, +13= 33! "

Numerology is pretty wacky in Freemasonry - they really go to town with it and pretty much EVERY number has some significance in it, but the number 14 that has all the big significance in The Scottish Rite and also "The Illuminati" (According to Barruel and others...)
3, 5, 7, 8, 10, 13, 14, 16, 18, 19, 21, 25, 28, 30 are the significant degrees of the Rite and hence they each of these numbers has an associated moral meaning.
But numbers play such a big part in all the rituals for one reason, to people who aren’t actually very good at maths, algebra looks like some sort of weird and magical language, so to “common folk” this notion is encouraged through Masonry.

Originally posted by MrNECROS
Numerology is pretty wacky in Freemasonry - they really go to town with it and pretty much EVERY number has some significance in it, but the number 14 that has all the big significance in The Scottish Rite and also "The Illuminati" (According to Barruel and others...)
3, 5, 7, 8, 10, 13, 14, 16, 18, 19, 21, 25, 28, 30 are the significant degrees of the Rite and hence they each of these numbers has an associated moral meaning.
But numbers play such a big part in all the rituals for one reason, to people who aren’t actually very good at maths, algebra looks like some sort of weird and magical language, so to “common folk” this notion is encouraged through Masonry.

So you think that 13 is as important to masonry as Akilles claims? So much so that we would purpoisely build a temple 13 blocks from the White House, and all the other crap that Akilles has said? I don't think so. 3 is important, 5 is important, and maybe 32 and 33 though those are just degrees so I'm not sure how significant they are. In any case, AKILLES IS COMPLETELY WRONG, 13 IS NOT AN IMPORTANT NUMBER IN MASONRY.

Akilles, you can repeat that all you want, but it's not going to make it true.

Actually akillies G is third.

Alpha
Beta
Gamma
Delta

Also this is Acts 13:13:


13 From Paphos, Paul and his companions sailed to Perga in Pamphylia, where John left them to return to Jerusalem.

What does that have to do with Masonry?

I've got to go with 13 not being important.

Ah huh...
You know they didn't have to call it the 13 colonies, right?
And they didn't have to have 13 stripes on the flag, either, you know.

10 Instances of 13, tells me they are praising 13 over 10, don't you think?

It could have been 10 instances of 10, or 10 of 12, etc.... This is no accident, and only someone who is trying to make people IGNORE SYMBOLISM would say otherwise.

You know, you're right about the 13th letter of the Alphabet, its M, you know, like for Mason. G is 7th, but both are prime numbers, interestingly enough, and both are important in occultic symbolism.

There are 13 teachings in the York Rite, again, they could have chosen any number!

Any one want to talk about the 76 years Lamech waited? What happened in the 77th year? Is THIS symbolism of ANY significance?

Originally posted by akilles
Ah huh...
You know they didn't have to call it the 13 colonies, right?
And they didn't have to have 13 stripes on the flag, either, you know.

10 Instances of 13, tells me they are praising 13 over 10, don't you think?

It could have been 10 instances of 10, or 10 of 12, etc.... This is no accident, and only someone who is trying to make people IGNORE SYMBOLISM would say otherwise.

You know, you're right about the 13th letter of the Alphabet, its M, you know, like for Mason. G is 7th, but both are prime numbers, interestingly enough, and both are important in occultic symbolism.

There are 13 teachings in the York Rite, again, they could have chosen any number!

Any one want to talk about the 76 years Lamech waited? What happened in the 77th year? Is THIS symbolism of ANY significance?

Akilles, you are SO ignorant it's embarrasing. Why would you say I'm trying to make you ignore symbolism, when I'm explicitly telling you which numbers ARE important to masons? 3 and 5, I've said many times. 13 and 7 DEFINITELY are not, I'm trying to point you in the right direction, you don't want to believe me.

The letter M is 13th, but wouldn't we hold the letter F as being more important than M? What you said makes no sense. Whatever number a letter occupies in the alphabet is important only to trolls like you. Masonic numbers like 3 and 5 are significant for meaningful reasons, not your ignorant interpretations.

Everyone has told you that 13 means nothing in masonry, and you can look up books of masonic symbolism and see that it means absolutely nothing. Keep saying what you want, you know you're completely mistaken.

American declaration of independence was 1776.

1776

1+7=8
7+6=13

8+13=21

[edit on 19-3-2005 by ThePunisher]

[edit on 19-3-2005 by ThePunisher]

[edit on 19-3-2005 by ThePunisher]

Originally posted by ThePunisher
American declaration of independence was 1776.

1776

1+7=8
7+6=13

8+13=21

[edit on 19-3-2005 by ThePunisher]

[edit on 19-3-2005 by ThePunisher]

[edit on 19-3-2005 by ThePunisher]

Actually 1776 was a signifigant year for other reasons:

1. It was the year the Bavarian Illuminatti formed.

2. It was the year the Rothschild empire formed (um... actually, re-formed, changing their name to "Rothschild" from the German words for "red shield" - rote sheld)
The Rothschilds were consolodating their power, and as the first act of their newer, stronger, power, they started the American Revolution. All the founding fathers (Ben Franklin the MOST!!) were members of secret societies. The SAME secret societies as the British elite, generals, commanders, rulling class, they were suppose to be at war with LOL!

Originally posted by sebatwerk

Originally posted by OpenSecret2012
Ahhh, but sebatwerk,

What level are you? What level Freemason are you? How many degrees are you?

"I'm a Freemason! Yeah! .... I'm a level 1 out of 32 levels though."

I'm a 3rd degree Master Mason. What does this have ANYTHING to do with what we're talking about?

It has everything to do with you! See, lower level Freemasons know less about Freemasonry than higher level Freemasons. This is obviously why they have different levels of Freemasonry.
Now, ready for me to blow two big holes in all your points claiming that the Freemasons are just a harmless little fraternaty?

1. Jim Shaw who was a 33rd Degree Master Mason wrote a book called "The Deadly Deception" (Huntington House Inc, Lafayette, Louisiana, (C) 1988 )
Jim Shaw states that lower level Masons are known as the "Blue Degrees" by the highest level Masons.
It is Jim Shaw who talks about being surprised at finding out there's a back door after a person reaches the highest level in the Freemasons. The back door leads to even higher levels, in higher secret societies.

2. Albert Pike who has sooo many uber, top, elite, Freemason titles, and ranks, he makes YOU look like absolutly... nothing. And guess what? Uber, master, Freemason, Albert Pike, who has every top elite level Freemason title... also ... wrote... a... book! And guess what he said in his book?
First, the name of his book is "Morals And Dogma". Now onward to what he wrote, which he also wrote talking about Freemason members like yourself:

"It's not intended that he shall understand them, but it is intended that he shall imagine that he understands them."

Albert Pike was talking about all the rest of the 99.99% members of the Freemasons. To put it in simple terms, the 1-3 people who run the Freemasons, view all the other members as gullible fools. And on purpose mislead all other Freemason members into thinking they all know what's going on. Into thinking they know what the Freemasons are about.
Meanwhile the 1-3 guys running the Freemasons are the only ones who really know the true intentions behind the Freemasons.
Incidently, the Elite of the Elite of the Freemasons, are fodder for and to even higher ranking secret societies.

You sir, can call everyone else at this site allll the names you want. BUT the fact remains that the top guys in the Freemasons, who wrote their own books, are irrefutable proof of the true intentions behind the Freemasons. I will enjoy seeing you try to refute Jim Shaw. And it will be even more intresting to see you even attempt to refute Albert Pike, who's level in Freemasonry you will never, ever, never, reach.


I leave it to everyone else who to believe - you. Or the guys who are also master masons, and billions of levels higher than your level, like Albert Pike. Who wrote in their own books what the true intentions of the Freemasons are. And how they on purpose mislead all other Freemason members - like yourself.

Albert Pike had sooo many Freemason elite level titles, he is litterally worshiped as a god, that there's even a huge statue of him in Washington, DC, in America.

[edit on 20-3-2005 by OpenSecret2012]

Originally posted by OpenSecret2012
All the founding fathers (Ben Franklin the MOST!!) were members of secret societies. The SAME secret societies as the British elite, generals, commanders, rulling class, they were suppose to be at war with LOL!

That just serves to show you that masons don't really hold the fraternity and its brothers above all else no matter what, especially not above ideals such as freedom and justice.


[edit on 20-3-2005 by sebatwerk]

Originally posted by OpenSecret2012
It has everything to do with you! See, lower level Freemasons know less about Freemasonry than higher level Freemasons. This is obviously why they have different levels of Freemasonry.

I'm as much of a mason as a 33rd degree mason. Master Mason is the highest regular degree one can have. All the other degrees are considered APPENDANT DEGREES (that means additional, incase ya didnt know) They only elaborate on the first three degrees. I would argue that I know more about masonry than MANY of (what you would call) "high-ranking" masons. Any of the many 32nd degree masons on this forum will tell you the same thing.

Now, ready for me to blow two big holes in all your points claiming that the Freemasons are just a harmless little fraternaty?

I'm ready.

Jim Shaw states that lower level Masons are known as the "Blue Degrees" by the highest level Masons.

They are called Blue Lodge degrees by ALL masons, buddy. You're not telling us anything new.

It is Jim Shaw who talks about being surprised at finding out there's a back door after a person reaches the highest level in the Freemasons. The back door leads to even higher levels, in higher secret societies.

You should tell that to on of my coaches at my lodge, who's a 33rd degree (White Cap). He's never been through a secret back door, but he does get a kick out of fantasy stories.

Uber, master, Freemason, Albert Pike, who has every top elite level Freemason title... also ... wrote... a... book! And guess what he said in his book?

Did you really go to Albert Pike? Are you REALLY quoting Pike??? Dude, before you do, read one the the hundreds of threads on Pikes quotes, in which masons much more knowledgeable about Pike than myself, completely tear up and refute every incorrect interpretation of his quotes that you guys have. Nice try, but I won't waste my time on this one.

Albert Pike was talking about all the rest of the 99.99% members of the Freemasons. To put it in simple terms, the 1-3 people who run the Freemasons, view all the other members as gullible fools. And on purpose mislead all other Freemason members into thinking they all know what's going on.

No he wasn't. You're a gullible fool for believing the author of whichever conspiracy website you got this from. Look up the real meaning by doing a search for threads here on ATS.

And by the way, you REALLY think that only 3 people run the fraternity!?!?!? I hate to break it to you, but THOUSANDS of people run the fraternity. Actually, every mason gets one equal vote, regardless of degree, so you could say that the fraternity is actually run by ALL of its members. But the thousands I am speaking of are the master of all the lodges in the world. They are the ones who run the fraternity.

And if you think the Supreme Council (33rd degree masons) run the fraternity, you're wrong again. Aside from the fact that there are hundreds of "White Caps" everywhere, the Supreme Council only controls the Southern jurisdiction of the American Scottish Rite Appendant Branch of masonry. But nice try, though.

Meanwhile the 1-3 guys running the Freemasons are the only ones who really know the true intentions behind the Freemasons.
Incidently, the Elite of the Elite of the Freemasons, are fodder for and to even higher ranking secret societies.

Is that right? And how do you know this? I'd love to see what evidence you have that led you to that conclusion. Go ahead, please post links or references to books or documents to conclusive evidence that determines what you just stated above.

You sir, can call everyone else at this site allll the names you want. BUT the fact remains that the top guys in the Freemasons, who wrote their own books, are irrefutable proof of the true intentions behind the Freemasons.

I never called anyone names, but nothing you said above is true. being a fraternity, masonry does not have "top guys". And any of the "High-ranking" masons on this forum will tell you the same thing.

I will enjoy seeing you try to refute Jim Shaw. And it will be even more intresting to see you even attempt to refute Albert Pike, who's level in Freemasonry you will never, ever, never, reach.

I just did.

I leave it to everyone else who to believe - you. Or the guys who are also master masons, and billions of levels higher than your level, like Albert Pike.

Albert Pike is also only a Master Mason, just like me. There is no higher degree in "regular" Freemasonry. You cannot compare him to me, because I am not a Scottish Rite mason, therefore I am not in the same organization that you are talking about in regards to Pike.

Who wrote in their own books what the true intentions of the Freemasons are. And how they on purpose mislead all other Freemason members - like yourself.

Actually, you very obviously misinterpreted the quote and purposely left out what came before and after that paragraph. Look up what the topic of what he was talking about in that quote is, and you will see what he really meant. Again, you can look up the TRUE meanings to Pike's quotes on MANY threads on this forum. We will not get into it because it's redundant. It suffices to say that you are mistaken.

Albert Pike had sooo many Freemason elite level titles, he is litterally worshiped as a god, that there's even a huge statue of him in Washington, DC, in America.

And your point is?

Many masons believe that Pike was very un-masonic and detest him for many comments he has made about the fraternity. What one man has said does not hold true for the whole fraternity, only the part that HE is involved with.

Dude, you sure blew apart everything I have ever known about Freemasonry! What ever will I do!?!? All you did was repeat tired old arguments that have been proven false, and can be again, and quoted an author who not only did you misrepresent, but who is NOT worshipped as a God and who does not speak for the fraternity as a whole. EVERY mason, including ones billions of level higher than myself, has his OWN interpretation of the fraternity and its degrees. Pike was merely offering his own views, which you twisted and distorted to suit your purposes.


[edit on 20-3-2005 by sebatwerk]