If Jesus Had An Obituary...............

Originally posted by Seapeople
I don't exclude based on contradictory nonsense.

But, you christians...who by the way managed to eradicate millions based on your hatred of their religions and beliefs over the past 2 thousand years, you are the ones with hate. Your bible tells you.......don't associate with thinkers. Dont associate with those who are obviously smarter than you.

First, he made me smarter than you and eddy. Second, he wouldn't want me to allow you to continue on being as dilusional and ignorant as you are without at least giving a good effort to teach you THAT YOU ARE ALLOWED TO THINK.

I know, your pastor doesnt like it when people think. You have to ignore him. Oh, and stop paying his mortgage on his house too, as well as for his paid vacations...I mean missions.

Your kind have been killing my kind for centuries.

Too bad your foolish leaders murdered hundreds of thousands in an attempt to keep it secret.

Too bad he had to live his life in utter fear of what christians were going to do to him. They burned people at the stake for thinking. BURNED THEM ALIVE.

This is the history of your corrupt and evil belief system. You make up stupid rules, right them in a book, and murder those who disagree with you. Now days, thank anything that could be considered holy that the church doesn't have the influence it once did. Its now illegal to murder for a disagreement. In the past, it was that disagreement that was punishable by death. Unfortuneatly, I think that religion still has a century or two left before people wake up. I wont be alive to see that wonderful day. But it is coming. Your kind. Your ignorant and foolish lifestyles full of blind following and exclusionatory tactics.

I rest my case. Your witness?


[edit on 15-4-2005 by saint4God]

Originally posted by Seapeople
Your bible tells you.......don't associate with thinkers. Dont associate with those who are obviously smarter than you.

I might surprise you. So you obviously believe that we are the results of chance and a universe created from a giant cosmic fart and you call me stupid? I have an engineering degree from one of the best electrical engineering schools in the United States so therefore I believe that I am qualified to consider myself a thinker. You on the other hand want to label me as a Bible Thumper because you are filled with hate and the surprising part is your creator STILL loves you and wants you to come to Him of YOUR free will. He doesn't want to force it, "and there shall come a strong delusion, that even the most elect would fall under it, if not for God's Grace"

Originally posted by Seapeople
Though it may not use those words, thats what it means. If there is a creating god, I can tell you two things. First, he made me smarter than you and eddy.

See above.....In my time I have seen many like you that claim intelligence over others, and 9 times out of 10, they are wrong. But I dunno, maybe you can solve Einsteins last equation, I mean that is what you worship, yourself.

Originally posted by Seapeople
Second, he wouldn't want me to allow you to continue on being as dilusional and ignorant as you are without at least giving a good effort to teach you THAT YOU ARE ALLOWED TO THINK.

Ignorant? Do you know the meaning of that word? I am ignorant of many things, the Bible is not one of them.

Originally posted by Seapeople
I know, your pastor doesnt like it when people think. You have to ignore him. Oh, and stop paying his mortgage on his house too, as well as for his paid vacations...I mean missions.

My pastor encourages people to think and I disagree with him on a few items and I 'show' him why, he doesnt hate nor scold me for it. Hate biols within you. I am happy to give the Lord HIS money. All belongs to him anyway, we are just the managers of it.

Originally posted by Seapeople
Your kind have been killing my kind for centuries. Keppler, and his laws of planetary motions. How beautiful his knowledge must have been to him. Too bad your foolish leaders murdered hundreds of thousands in an attempt to keep it secret. Galileo. The wonders of his thinking surpass almost everyone of recent memory.

Oh and your kind hasnt? Get real, I am Lutheran and the old Catholic Church had many 'issues', of course that is why the Lutherans came about anyway. Man is sinful, but that is a concept that you fail to grasp.

Originally posted by Seapeople
Your kind. Your ignorant and foolish lifestyles full of blind following and exclusionatory tactics.

Not at all, foolish? well maybe wasting my time dealing with the likes of you but hey, I like it. I live in peace knowing what is in store for me for Eternity how about you?

Originally posted by Seapeople
...YOU ARE ALLOWED TO THINK.

I can just hear the background music for that line....

Hopefully SOMEDAY we'll learn from our mistakes. We cant be living with our head stuck in the dirt.

Originally posted by edsinger
...a universe created from a giant cosmic fart...

Now THAT is funny!

Originally posted by edsinger
I have an engineering degree from one of the best electrical engineering schools in the United States so therefore I believe that I am qualified to consider myself a thinker.

Great! Would you mind checking my thinking and the math presented on this thread? It would be most appreciated. It's a discussion on PI, volume and the like. Half way down the page, radardog begins the discussion:

www.abovetopsecret.com...


[edit on 15-4-2005 by saint4God]

Anyone notice that when Saint copied my original post, that he removed certain portions of it?

Somewhere in there is motive for something.

Oh, and eddy, I hope to your false god, that you never design a building I walk into. They give idiots degrees these days I see? Well, you lie to yourself everyday...so I am going to assume you are lying when you claim to have this degree.

In any case, you and I can go one on one any day of the week. I guarantee you, that I can come up with better and more cost efficient ideas in the engineering field you claim to be in. See, you insinuate that you are smarter than me, even though you claim to not say that. In laymans terms...you are hoping that you are smarter than me, but are at least intelligent to understand that the prospect of that idea fades quickly when you speak. So, knowing you probably are not, you have to put your disclaimer in.

Here is one without disclaimer. I am more intelligent that you. I am better able to work through problems. I am far better with my ability to see all aspects of any given situation or problem than you are. Sorry buddy, but you are just like the rest. A liar to boot.

Originally posted by saint4God

Great! Would you mind checking my thinking and the math presented on this thread? It would be most appreciated. It's a discussion on PI, volume and the like. Half way down the page, radardog begins the discussion:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Man I spend all day with that #, If you want to say PI just give em 22/7

Originally posted by Seapeople
Oh, and eddy, I hope to your false god, that you never design a building I walk into. They give idiots degrees these days I see? Well, you lie to yourself everyday...so I am going to assume you are lying when you claim to have this degree.

I don't design biuldings. If you were half as smart as you claim to be you would have noticed the 'electrical' part of engineering. I POWER THEM!

Originally posted by Seapeople
In any case, you and I can go one on one any day of the week. I guarantee you, that I can come up with better and more cost efficient ideas in the engineering field you claim to be in. See, you insinuate that you are smarter than me, even though you claim to not say that. In laymans terms...you are hoping that you are smarter than me, but are at least intelligent to understand that the prospect of that idea fades quickly when you speak. So, knowing you probably are not, you have to put your disclaimer in.

By that statement alone you have lost. You questioned my intelligence and since I am a Bible 'thumper' you therefore believe that I can not have a degree? How about a BSEE from UIUC.....look it up. I don't hope I am smarter than you, I now know it.

Dislaimer: My dad always told me not to argue with a stump. ahem.

Originally posted by Seapeople
Here is one without disclaimer. I am more intelligent that you. I am better able to work through problems. I am far better with my ability to see all aspects of any given situation or problem than you are. Sorry buddy, but you are just like the rest. A liar to boot.

Oh my o great one I shall bow down before the great....nah......

You are a Darwin Award waiting to happen.

I have not lost eddie. I don't believe that someone with the logical processes you have could possibly have a degree. However, knowing the rate at which this world is decaying, I wouldn't be suprised at all if someone like you managed to get through school. Even the dumbest morons can get into college these days. So, youll fit right in.

Anyways, your pi statement. The irony is kinda funny. Did you know that your beloved bible tells you what pi is? Maybe you should look it up in your bible. Then go and engineer a wheel using the bibles version of pi. Or maybe do some calculations for an arc using the bibles version of pi.

Somehow...I just don't think you will have much success. Not that you do now, but you know what I mean. That is truly ironic.......

By the way, who here wants to take a poll as to how many times eddy has managed to shock himself? Its the amps that kill....right eddy?

[edit on 4/16/2005 by Seapeople]

Originally posted by Seapeople
Anyone notice that when Saint copied my original post, that he removed certain portions of it?

Somewhere in there is motive for something.

My motive was to show how much hate-talk you've got in a single post. Notice how most of it is still in tact? You're right. I had a motive, but not a hidden one.

Hate? I don't think it is called hate. It is simply point making. I am right 100% of the time when I discuss things with you. You are completely oblivious to reality. You ignore truth and fact as well as science and math. You do this because your brain simply wasn't equipped with enough capacity to add I suppose, but that still doesn't make it right.

Ignorance is no defense of the law. Its also no defence in your case. Especially due to the intentional disregard to known fact and science that you continue to show. Go ahead.....Believe in your bible word for word. Don't forget to do this while ignoring at least half of it because of the contradictions.

I don't choose to believe in fantasy because I fear death like you. Its your fear of the reality that is life that continues this nonsense. Like I said above, I am glad that religion is on such a significant decline in this country. I am glad your BS isn't pread through our schools any more. I am glad that their are people intelligent enough to see through you and others like you.

When your dead, and you don't even know it, it will be unfortunate that I cannot laugh at your emptiness. I wouldn't want to waste my time on the non existant. You wouldn't be able to hear anyway.

Originally posted by SeapeopleBy the way, who here wants to take a poll as to how many times eddy has managed to shock himself? Its the amps that kill....right eddy?

Well as a matter of fact it is, you learn that in your 10th grade class yet? Actually in answer to your question, 3 times of significance, the worst being @120V, the other 2 being 277V and it just hurt like hell but I was able to get off of it easier.

Now that I am no longer an Industrial Electrician, but an 'injuneer', I am less exposed to things but I still do as long as I am sure I will not get a grievance filed.



You know ... I dont give a #.

for folks like you maybe we should keep abortion legal

Oh and by the way - IGNORED.


[edit on 16-4-2005 by edsinger]

Originally posted by Seapeople
Hate? I don't think it is called hate. It is simply point making. I am right 100% of the time when I discuss things with you. You are completely oblivious to reality. You ignore truth and fact as well as science and math. You do this because your brain simply wasn't equipped with enough capacity to add I suppose, but that still doesn't make it right.

LOL! This stuff reads like comedy anymore

Originally posted by Seapeople
Ignorance is no defense of the law. Its also no defence in your case. Especially due to the intentional disregard to known fact and science that you continue to show. Go ahead.....Believe in your bible word for word. Don't forget to do this while ignoring at least half of it because of the contradictions.

I don't choose to believe in fantasy because I fear death like you. Its your fear of the reality that is life that continues this nonsense. Like I said above, I am glad that religion is on such a significant decline in this country. I am glad your BS isn't pread through our schools any more. I am glad that their are people intelligent enough to see through you and others like you.

*rolls on the floor laughing* Oh yeah...well.. *laughs harder* Sorry, I can't keep this up. I need air

Originally posted by Seapeople
When your dead, and you don't even know it, it will be unfortunate that I cannot laugh at your emptiness. I wouldn't want to waste my time on the non existant. You wouldn't be able to hear anyway.

*chuckles* You're losing it now. This one was only a little funny. Ah well, until your next , I'll be here doing the thing.

First off i would like to express how deeply I am hurt by eddy ignoring me. It is nice when I knwo that i get to someone like him. Like the coward that him as well as those like him are, he ran away. So sad. I might cry. Just wanted to point out that he never mentioned anything of significance in response to my open challenges of his supposed education. I wonder....

On to saint. Once again the hardcore christians of this site show their true cowardice. Why you are afraid of me with your god on your side is far beyond me....maybe you are unsure he will help you?

I would like everyone to note how saint responds. Instead of offering science and fact to support his backwards and insane mindset, he laughs. Why? because it is the only thing he can do. He cannot say anything of meaning because his belief system has too many obvious holes.

Please note his tactic of seperating my posts in an effort to point out my faults. Then please notice how he doesn't provide any. Interesting.....

As eddy said, maybe they should legalize abortion... Hmm, I would assume that was meaning that he wishes I would have died in the womb...

Now, being that edmiester is ignoring me...and oh how hurtful that is, I will ask everyone else. Wouldn't that be a sin? Such a good christian shouldn't be thinking of things like this, because your thoughts are equal to your actions in gods eyes...read the bible. Eddy, according to his precious book, commited murder by advocating my death...

I love christians.....so easy to get them to open up and say what they are really thinking.

Originally posted by Seapeople
Why? because it is the only thing he can do. He cannot say anything of meaning because his belief system has too many obvious holes.

*BUZZ* Wrong answer. Thanks for trying to speak for me yet again. The correct answer is: Because whenever I bring up something rational and logical to you, you have to get into these slappy-fights without producing anything that merits discussing. Now I enjoy the Three Stooges as much as anyone else, but I don't think I'm going to be one. This is apparently a very emotional topic for you. You've made it clear that I cannot help you with these emotions. If you'd like me to, I will do my best. Until that day, the 'spitting fire' thing isn't going to have any effect on me.

Originally posted by Seapeople
I love christians.....so easy to get them to open up and say what they are really thinking.

I love you too, but perhaps not in the same way.

Whenever you bring up something rational and logical?

Lets look closer.....again.

As I recall, it was my posting regarding noah's ark that started all of this. When I stood so steadfast in my belief that the story was impossible, thats when the christian base of this forum attacked me. Accordingly, thats when I responded.

Lets look at rational and logical. One of my threads detailed the mathematics behind a global flood as described in the bible. This of course generated a significant response from christians. You attacked me because I was providing logical and rational factual information. Go back and look at the thread. Tell me where the christains provided a mathematical calculation that gave the flood its physical possibility.

You are the one who attacks me for having a rational point of view. You are the one who cannot take the fact that your book is fool of inconsitent and irrational ideas. When someone poses mathematical principals showing the impossibility of something, that warrants attention. That is the bases of rational thought. I did my homework on my own and presented you this information. When a book that holds as much significance in your life contains contradictory information, that should hold significant importance to you, and is certainly worth rational discussion.

When ideas such as this are presented to you, you ignore them and attack the presenter. Contradictory words in the bible are completely ignored. You make up your own words, or use those made up by others to avoid admitting what the bible actually says.

When math is proposed to you, showing impossibilities, you ignore them as well.

That is the base for irrational thought. I provide facts to you, in a sharp manor as of late. But I get my point across. I show you for what you are time and time again.

Do not ever criticise me for not being rational. Show me ONE irrational thought of mine. One thought...... Ill show you 50 of yours. You ignore reality to sustain your dilusions. This is your flaw and not mine.

Want to play a game? I bet that you don't. Lets try. Wouldn't you say an earthquake is a significant event? Something worth noting? How about if it was involved with the resurection of...lets say, a god? I would argue that it would be very significant...much like that gods last words would be.

Tell me, was there, or was there not an earthquake the day jesus rose from the dead? Please cite all 4 gospels.

Now, you will dance around this like always...unless you finally get brave enough to face me. When you do, you will make up reasons, that are not in the bible, to make your case. I will refer to the actual words of the bible to make mine. Lets see if you will play the game. The game of being rational.... Your god may or may not tempt depending on what part of the bible you are looking at on any given day. I do every day. I challenge you to face me.

you have an open heart and an open mind to where you are willing to change the way you feel and think about these things when viewed from another perspective. Tell me you don't know everything and acknowledge we could learn things from each other. Then, I will be glad to go through any scenarios you like.

Our last discussion was far from productive since you were unwilling to even attempt to see things from another paradigm. I'm willing to change how much I know, how I feel, and see things in a different light. Are you?

Candidly, I like one discussion at a time. Pages of multiple points force me to take a lot of time in chucks that I rarely have so I'm really slow in researching, considering, and responding to those.



[edit on 18-4-2005 by saint4God]

I am open to anything. You show me a miracle. One that is not hearsay, and has no possible explanation, then I will believe. You show me a man rising from the dead. You show me a global flood. You show me water turning to wine. How about seperating the seas.

You show me anything of the likes, and I will disregard all math and science. I am only as open as any logical person should be. There are limits to our world. I choose to observe them. I don't by any means ignore things when I know them to be true. You have never once seen a man rise from the dead or walk on water. Not once have you seen water turn to wine, or an entire sea split in two. You haven't ever seen a flood cover the earth. Nor have you seen bread and wine turn to the body and blood of a man.

In addition to this, you have seen math and science that says these things are impossible. You can take your world and your interactive environment and show that water simply cannot turn to wine. You can show that a man cannot walk on water. You can show that it is mathematically impossible to flood the earth.

Yet you choose to ignore what you see in favor of the bible. The bible that doesn't even have a clear moral message unless you only consider the new testament, and disregard the old. It has no clear points to be honest, unless you interpret. Unless you change what you read in your own mind to fit what you want it to say.

You choose to believe this book over mathematical processes that are tried true and true. Maybe your open mind and heart are blinding you from intelligence. When you start to face the facts and laws of this world, then things will appear to you as they do for me.

I am very open to anything. Show me, and I will believe. I am the doubting thomas, and rightfully so. Only a bafoon would choose to believe this book over his reality without ANY EVIDENCE.

Originally posted by Seapeople
I am open to anything. You show me a miracle. One that is not hearsay, and has no possible explanation, then I will believe.

I think this is a reasonable request. The source of any miracle would not be me though. If God chooses to involve me in a miracle, I think that would be great. Rather than asking me, waiting and expecting something to happen, you could ask Him. I'll ask Him too. I think that would give you the undeniable results you're looking for. Many people didn't believe Jesus and accused him of trickery because they couldn't see that what he was doing was because of God, despite the constant proclamations that this was the case.

Originally posted by Seapeople
You show me a man rising from the dead.

Just to show proof? Kind of an ugly way of proving, don't you think? If memory serves, Lazarus wasn't clean, trimmed, and smelling like roses when he was brought back.

Originally posted by Seapeople
You show me a global flood.

What kind of heart would I have to cause that event? Who am I to pass judgement on all of humanty to say we all deserve that? Besides, we'd all be dead and there'd be no point to that proof.

Originally posted by Seapeople
You show me water turning to wine. How about seperating the seas.

Duplicate Jesus or Moses? But you don't believe in them. Why would I do something to make you not believe God works through me?

Originally posted by Seapeople
You show me anything of the likes, and I will disregard all math and science. I am only as open as any logical person should be. There are limits to our world. I choose to observe them. I don't by any means ignore things when I know them to be true. You have never once seen a man rise from the dead or walk on water. Not once have you seen water turn to wine, or an entire sea split in two. You haven't ever seen a flood cover the earth. Nor have you seen bread and wine turn to the body and blood of a man.

This is fair and true I think. I don't think someone should disregard all math and science. I'm a believer and find them very helpful, consistent tools. They're just not the absolutes as college likes to preach.

Originally posted by Seapeople
In addition to this, you have seen math and science that says these things are impossible. You can take your world and your interactive environment and show that water simply cannot turn to wine. You can show that a man cannot walk on water. You can show that it is mathematically impossible to flood the earth.

I've seen some pretty weird shtuff go down that didn't have any science and math explanation. I think in this regard we're a lot a like. I needed my proof to believe. I respect that you're looking for yours too. I hope I can help you find it.

Originally posted by Seapeople
Yet you choose to ignore what you see in favor of the bible. The bible that doesn't even have a clear moral message unless you only consider the new testament, and disregard the old. It has no clear points to be honest, unless you interpret. Unless you change what you read in your own mind to fit what you want it to say.

It's not supposed to be that way. I think a lot of what I read is pretty clear. Some things I don't quite understand, but the more I study, the more sense it tends to make. One of Jesus' points was to take our noses out of the law and look around. See how it works naturally. Love, faith, hope, joy. By using these things that come from God, you feel what the right thing to do is.

Originally posted by Seapeople
You choose to believe this book over mathematical processes that are tried true and true. Maybe your open mind and heart are blinding you from intelligence. When you start to face the facts and laws of this world, then things will appear to you as they do for me.

I've devoted a lot of time and study to the laws of this world. At first glance, they don't make sense either. But, the more you study and apply them, the more sense they make. The Bible is no different in that regard.

Originally posted by Seapeople
I am very open to anything. Show me, and I will believe. I am the doubting thomas, and rightfully so. Only a bafoon would choose to believe this book over his reality without ANY EVIDENCE.

Alright, you're right in that you and I could not believe without evidence. Here's the only difference between you and me. I got my evidence, though you haven't yet. I'll work with you to get it. I think you've hit right on the heart of the matter. It's not about argument of what is and is not in the text, how the scripture coalesces, or what makes mathmatical/scientific sense, but rather how we can get your proof. That's a far more difficult matter than arguing text. Would you be willing to work with me to get it?




[edit on 18-4-2005 by saint4God]

Nazarene Rabbi Yehoshua Bar Joseph, peacefully at home last Wednesday night, aged 63 years. He will be greatly missed by his widow Mary, sons Jesus Justus and Joseph, and daughter Joanna, and his grandchildren. Services to be held in Razes. It will be a small ceremony, with only the closest family and friends, so please respect the families request for privacy, and do not arrive unless formally invited. Also, the family has requested of all journalists that there be no further reports written or published regarding their tragic loss.