Thomas Jefferson statue toppled by protesters

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

I repeat what i stated in an earlier post.

The topic under discussion is civil unrest in The U.S. Historical slavery being one of the issues for the unrest.

As the bar chart that i linked shows, The U.S. imported far more slaves after it's independence. That you cannot deny.

If you want to talk about British Slave Trade to other regions of the world, that is entirely a different subject to what is currently taking place in The U.S.

I know facts can be painful for you, but it is what it is. So before you state that Britain imported more slaves into America before independence, when in fact the opposite is true, i suggest you do your research before you post false information.

a reply to: alldaylong

what one hunderd and fifty thousand after the the uk brought to their colonies in that time frame? notice the date on that graph is from 1761 to 1810, 15 of those years were british rule. and like i said they more than likely bought some of them from the british slavers.

I know facts can be painful for you, but it is what it is. So before you state that Britain imported more slaves into America before independence, when in fact the opposite is true, i suggest you do your research before you post false information

i have no problems with facts, your the one that that doesn't want to admit what your government does.

a reply to: alldaylong

Civil unrest.

heh.

There is nothing "civil" about toppling statues because some morons got offended.

post deux

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: alldaylong

Civil unrest.

heh.

There is nothing "civil" about toppling statues because some morons got offended.

For your guidance.

Peaceful demonstrations and protests that abide by the law, such as the Women's March, do not constitute civil unrest. Civil unrest is typically defined by law enforcement as a gathering of three or more people, in reaction to an event, with the intention of causing a public disturbance in violation of the law. Civil unrest typically involves damage to property or injury to other people. Some examples of civil unrest incidents within the United States include

study.com...

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
a reply to: alldaylong

what one hunderd and fifty thousand after the the uk brought to their colonies in that time frame? notice the date on that graph is from 1761 to 1810, 15 of those years were british rule. and like i said they more than likely bought some of them from the british slavers.

I know facts can be painful for you, but it is what it is. So before you state that Britain imported more slaves into America before independence, when in fact the opposite is true, i suggest you do your research before you post false information

i have no problems with facts, your the one that that doesn't want to admit what your government does.

Up to 1761 180.00 slaves imported into America.

After 1761 320,000 slaves imported into America.

Now tell me i am wrong that more slaves where imported after independence .

originally posted by: burdman30ott6
a reply to: ketsuko

I'll be honest here, the USA wouldn't be what it is (and I mean the good things, global superpower, largest economy, shining city on a hill) without slavery. Given that, I think slavery was OK for 1789... just being honest about how I view things. .

yeah
totes fine

Can't imagine why people don't want to pass statues of slave owners as they cruise through town or go into a government building.

a reply to: Gryphon66

Do you know why I'm arguing about those cultures in the past the way I am?

Because they are largely gone.

Nothing we do about it now will change them. For better or worse, history is what it is. Bring any one of those cultures into the modern day, and fine, have at and go change them. They need to change. These aren't their days. But what happened then happened and you cannot change it anymore than you can argue woulda, coulda because you can find some guys who thought differently than almost everyone else back then.

Shoot, maybe in a few hundred years polygamy and forced child marriages will be the cultural norm and two other people will be having this argument and one person will be taking your tac based on Warren Jeffs.

a reply to: ketsuko

The outcomes of those cultures' actions and beliefs still impact us today.

We are talking about today.

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: ketsuko

The outcomes of those cultures' actions and beliefs still impact us today.

We are talking about today.

No. We're talking about judging the past as though it were the modern day. It's not and never can be.

We moved on from it, but we need to learn it or else we'll be right back where we started.

But sure. Since we now view our history as inimical, let's erase it all and start relearning it the hard, but reliving it.

a reply to: alldaylong

Up to 1761 180.00 slaves imported into America. After 1761 320,000 slaves imported into America. Now tell me i am wrong that more slaves where imported after independence .

what?

do you not know as i said that from 1761 to 1776 the colonies were under british rule. 15 years.

now on this graph on the bar that i have the black arrow pointing to that says 1761 to 1810 show me where the cut off is for 1761 for all we know in those 15 years according the graph the british could have brought 220,000 of them in. there is no date on the column.

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
a reply to: alldaylong

Up to 1761 180.00 slaves imported into America. After 1761 320,000 slaves imported into America. Now tell me i am wrong that more slaves where imported after independence .

what?

do you not know as i said that from 1761 to 1776 the colonies were under british rule. 15 years.

now on this graph on the bar that i have the black arrow pointing to that says 1761 to 1810 show me where the cut off is for 1761 for all we know in those 15 years according the graph the british could have brought 220,000 of them in. there is no date on the column.

Get real.

Are you seriously suggesting America imported more slaves in 15 years than in the previous 100 years ?

Also after independence and up to 1810 America added more states to the union above the 13 original states. More states means more slaves required.

Your having a laugh.

Here you go. More slaves imported after independence.

1620-1700 20,500
1701-1760 188,600
1761-1770 62,668
1771-1780 14,902
1781-1790 55,750
1791-1800 79,041
1801-1810 114,090
1761-1810
Louisiana imports 10,200
1810-1870 51,000
Total 596,75

www.americanabolitionists.com...

a reply to: ketsuko

No ma'am. That's your cultural relativistic argument.

My argument, vis-a-vis the topic, is that the destruction of public property is a crime, and if people have a problem with a statue's presence, regardless of their reason why (which is where your argument seems to be stuck) then they need to use the legal channels to try to get rid of it instead of trying to destroy it.

I can see it now...

Used to be, in K-12 school, you had Art classes and you had History classes.

In the not too distant future they're going to be teaching about Art in History classes.

...right along with Literature, Humanities, Home Economics and Shop and many others.

Can these things not be put in an Antebellum museum or something like that?

Not erased from history. Right there for people to enjoy if they wish but not in the middle of town or in government buildings.

What is so hard about that?

Hellz no
They need to be right out in the open so every time a certain demographic passes it it is an in your face reminder.

a reply to: alldaylong

Get real. Are you seriously suggesting America imported more slaves in 15 years than in the previous 100 years ?

no you are, the U.S was not even a country in 1761, it was still part of the british empire until 1776.
there is no date to show when 1776 came on the column in relation to how many were imported.

there is no way to know how many of those 320,000 were brought here before 1776 by the British or U.S. after 1776 using that graph.




ETA: another link to add, from PBS

) Between 1525 and 1866, in the entire history of the slave trade to the New World, according to the Trans-Atlantic Slave Trade Database, 12.5 million Africans were shipped to the New World. 10.7 million survived the dreaded Middle Passage, disembarking in North America, the Caribbean and South America. And how many of these 10.7 million Africans were shipped directly to North America? Only about 388,000. That’s right: a tiny percentage.
100 Amazing Facts About the Negro

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
a reply to: alldaylong

Get real. Are you seriously suggesting America imported more slaves in 15 years than in the previous 100 years ?

no you are, the U.S was not even a country in 1761, it was still part of the british empire until 1776.
there is no date to show when 1776 came on the column in relation to how many were imported.

there is no way to know how many of those 320,000 were brought here before 1776 by the British or U.S. after 1776 using that graph.

Just edited my last post with slave import numbers, that show more slave imported after 1776.

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
a reply to: alldaylong

Get real. Are you seriously suggesting America imported more slaves in 15 years than in the previous 100 years ?

no you are, the U.S was not even a country in 1761, it was still part of the british empire until 1776.
there is no date to show when 1776 came on the column in relation to how many were imported.

there is no way to know how many of those 320,000 were brought here before 1776 by the British or U.S. after 1776 using that graph.

Jesus Christ. 1776 was the Declaration of Independence. Treaty of Paris was 1783. Ratifcation of the US Constitution was June 21 1788.

"America" was what we called the place, not the name of the Country in 1761.

a reply to: alldaylong

see my last edit in my post, that guy is a researcher that does a lot of black history tracing.

originally posted by: Granby
Can these things not be put in an Antebellum museum or something like that?

Not erased from history. Right there for people to enjoy if they wish but not in the middle of town or in government buildings.

What is so hard about that?

Hellz no
They need to be right out in the open so every time a certain demographic passes it it is an in your face reminder.

Can't they put books I find offensive in a different building?

Do they need to be on the shelves every time I come to the library?