inconvienent facts

a reply to: network dude

Insults? Ok. I'm out. I have better things to do then talk to you pretending like you are smarter than the people you are talking to.

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: network dude
I am not here to be a "denier", or whatever other label needs to be attributed to me for voicing my opinion based on facts. I am just offering a perspective based on my reality. February was very warm. Unusually warm. But March and April have been uncharacteristically cold.
www.accuweather.com...

Yet, when I hear the news report on "weather", I hear this year has been the hottest on record yet again.
www.usatoday.com...

I understand that not everywhere is the same, but it sure seems that for shock value, all the cold areas are ignored, in favor of blasting the media with WARMING news. I feel like it's dishonest and not explaining the facts is misrepresenting the truth. Is there some prize for converting believers? is there a quota that needs to be met?

It's not hot everywhere, and we might all still survive the Apocalypse.

One is weather in one place. The other is global average.

You even even acknowledge this in your post.

No scientist or reputable commentator claims that global warming means its always hotter everywhere.

So what is it you expect exactly?

Part of the problem is that they've created this situation where the prediction is always right... it is quite comical to us common sense guys.

If it gets warmer, then it is climate change. If it gets colder, it is still climate change. If it rains more, it is climate change. If it is a drought, it is climate change.

No matter what the weather or climate does, we can always blame it on man made climate change and need to be taxed to oblivion.

Intuitively, we know weather men can't predict local weather worth a sh*t a few days out... yet, we are supposed to believe computer simulations for GLOBAL climate over decades. The models are consistently wrong and even when they go back and update them with actual weather that resulted, they are still wrong.

Only that isn't really true at all. The scientific evidence overwhelming supports that man is having an escalating effect on climate change.

The models are updated to make them more accurate, not to revisit previous predictions.

Is media reporting on climate change often misleading? Absolutely, by both 'sides'.

However that in no way detracts from the actual science, and a thread about how it's cold somewhere disproves climate change doesn't either.

Why would you not go back and test a model's outputs against actual results? That is how you narrow down what variables are correlated the most with the results.

For example, if a model says climate is going to increase by X this year. The year passes and the climate only changed by Y. You go back and figure out why the model's prediction was wrong against what actually occurred. You can also adjust the variables to see if you can make the model's prediction match to what occurred to see what variables were having the biggest impact and accuracy on the prediction.

The thing is when they go back and compare model's predictions to the actual results, they are wrong. Even when they update the models actual variables, the predictions are still wrong indicating scientist still don't really know what causes the changes.

Climate Models vs Climate Reality

Your link disputes the rate that climate is changing, not the fact it is.

It certainly doesn't go ' its snowing outside therefore science is wrong' .

Oh for crying out loud. Since I am sitting on the spot where there used to be a massive, mile-thick ice sheet, I think we can all agree that the climate certainly does change.

So your statement is a bit silly, don't you think?

Of course, the freakin' climate changes. That's what it does and always has done and always will do. It's part of living on a dynamic planet.

a reply to: intrepid

And when hundreds of thousands of years are looked at to establish an overall climate trend, we see that our current climate change is indeed a natural occurring phenomenon that happens on a regular basis, at the same extremes, at the same speed.

a reply to: network dude

You have to look at where the temperature readings are happening, as well.

The majority of weather monitoring equipment is placed in urban areas, surrounded by concrete and cars. As buildings and concrete/asphalt tend to intensify natural heat, it's only logical that temps would read higher than what they actually are in real life.

One of the clever ways they can subtly manipulate temperature readings.

a reply to: network dude

DOUBLE POST

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: network dude

I did. Your first source is talking about local temperatures. Your second source is talking about the global average.

You have compared them as if they are comparable. They are not.

did you read my OP? I was speaking about my local area. Then I went on to say how the global average was discussed as being record hot. I fully understand that my local weather isn't the same as what everyone else feels, but the point I was making is that when we speak of all things "climate related", you just don't hear about the cold parts. It doens't fit the narrative. that was pretty much my only point. I suppose I didn't make it short enough to keep everyone's attention.

a reply to: RAY1990

Yep, it certainly seems to be getting colder. The big freeze killed off some of my climbers that were well established.
Also noticed the same late sprouting of leaves on my trees.

According to NASA we should be expecting an ongoing cooling of the sun, which will offset effects that are allegedly warming the earth. We'll see. I won't be surprised to see a general cooling.

It's a shame none of the data can be believed due to tampering and the politicization of the climate, so general observation will have to do.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: network dude

Insults? Ok. I'm out. I have better things to do then talk to you pretending like you are smarter than the people you are talking to.

I hope you weren't damaged by my horrifically insulting post.

originally posted by: ketsuko

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: ScepticScot

originally posted by: network dude
I am not here to be a "denier", or whatever other label needs to be attributed to me for voicing my opinion based on facts. I am just offering a perspective based on my reality. February was very warm. Unusually warm. But March and April have been uncharacteristically cold.
www.accuweather.com...

Yet, when I hear the news report on "weather", I hear this year has been the hottest on record yet again.
www.usatoday.com...

I understand that not everywhere is the same, but it sure seems that for shock value, all the cold areas are ignored, in favor of blasting the media with WARMING news. I feel like it's dishonest and not explaining the facts is misrepresenting the truth. Is there some prize for converting believers? is there a quota that needs to be met?

It's not hot everywhere, and we might all still survive the Apocalypse.

One is weather in one place. The other is global average.

You even even acknowledge this in your post.

No scientist or reputable commentator claims that global warming means its always hotter everywhere.

So what is it you expect exactly?

Part of the problem is that they've created this situation where the prediction is always right... it is quite comical to us common sense guys.

If it gets warmer, then it is climate change. If it gets colder, it is still climate change. If it rains more, it is climate change. If it is a drought, it is climate change.

No matter what the weather or climate does, we can always blame it on man made climate change and need to be taxed to oblivion.

Intuitively, we know weather men can't predict local weather worth a sh*t a few days out... yet, we are supposed to believe computer simulations for GLOBAL climate over decades. The models are consistently wrong and even when they go back and update them with actual weather that resulted, they are still wrong.

Only that isn't really true at all. The scientific evidence overwhelming supports that man is having an escalating effect on climate change.

The models are updated to make them more accurate, not to revisit previous predictions.

Is media reporting on climate change often misleading? Absolutely, by both 'sides'.

However that in no way detracts from the actual science, and a thread about how it's cold somewhere disproves climate change doesn't either.

Why would you not go back and test a model's outputs against actual results? That is how you narrow down what variables are correlated the most with the results.

For example, if a model says climate is going to increase by X this year. The year passes and the climate only changed by Y. You go back and figure out why the model's prediction was wrong against what actually occurred. You can also adjust the variables to see if you can make the model's prediction match to what occurred to see what variables were having the biggest impact and accuracy on the prediction.

The thing is when they go back and compare model's predictions to the actual results, they are wrong. Even when they update the models actual variables, the predictions are still wrong indicating scientist still don't really know what causes the changes.

Climate Models vs Climate Reality

Your link disputes the rate that climate is changing, not the fact it is.

It certainly doesn't go ' its snowing outside therefore science is wrong' .

Oh for crying out loud. Since I am sitting on the spot where there used to be a massive, mile-thick ice sheet, I think we can all agree that the climate certainly does change.

So your statement is a bit silly, don't you think?

Of course, the freakin' climate changes. That's what it does and always has done and always will do. It's part of living on a dynamic planet.

And humanity is accelerating the process.

It's fairly obvious that's what we are talking about.

a reply to: network dude

did you read my OP?

Yes.

Then I went on to say how the global average was discussed as being record hot.

No, you did not mention the global average:

Yet, when I hear the news report on "weather", I hear this year has been the hottest on record yet again.

Global warming does not mean no place will ever be cold, nor does it mean that everywhere will be hot. It means the average temperature of the planet is rising. Your OP makes no mention of the global average. You are conflating local weather and global warming.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: network dude

did you read my OP?

Yes.

Then I went on to say how the global average was discussed as being record hot.

No, you did not mention the global average:

Yet, when I hear the news report on "weather", I hear this year has been the hottest on record yet again.

Global warming does not mean no place will ever be cold, nor does it mean that everywhere will be hot. It means the average temperature of the planet is rising. Your OP makes no mention of the global average.

Phage, perhaps I should just make this easy and say I was wrong and you were right, as that seems to be the only way to make you understand my point.

here is my OP:

I am not here to be a "denier", or whatever other label needs to be attributed to me for voicing my opinion based on facts. I am just offering a perspective based on my reality. February was very warm. Unusually warm. But March and April have been uncharacteristically cold. www.accuweather.com... Yet, when I hear the news report on "weather", I hear this year has been the hottest on record yet again. www.usatoday.com... I understand that not everywhere is the same, but it sure seems that for shock value, all the cold areas are ignored, in favor of blasting the media with WARMING news. I feel like it's dishonest and not explaining the facts is misrepresenting the truth. Is there some prize for converting believers? is there a quota that needs to be met? It's not hot everywhere, and we might all still survive the Apocalypse.

The bold part is where I mentioned the global average, though I didn't call it that, my mistake. I also used an old article, which was another mistake. I did offer a current one later in the thread to be sure my point was understood, but to no avail.

In conclusion, I network dude, do hereby agree that climate isn't weather. My local cold snap isn't indicative of the world average. the general consensus is that the word as a whole is warming. 97% of scientists agree.

None of that changes the fact that my area is colder than expected this time of year. I hope that by stating that, I'm not offending you in any way. You are free to ignore it if you choose.

You even offered a nice graphic showing exactly what I stated in my OP, and still somehow managed to try to make me look wrong.

a reply to: network dude

None of that changes the fact that my area is colder than expected this time of year.

Should we expect quarterly updates on your local weather?

originally posted by: network dude
I am not here to be a "denier", or whatever other label needs to be attributed to me for voicing my opinion based on facts. I am just offering a perspective based on my reality. February was very warm. Unusually warm. But March and April have been uncharacteristically cold.
www.accuweather.com...

Yet, when I hear the news report on "weather", I hear this year has been the hottest on record yet again.
www.usatoday.com...

I understand that not everywhere is the same, but it sure seems that for shock value, all the cold areas are ignored, in favor of blasting the media with WARMING news. I feel like it's dishonest and not explaining the facts is misrepresenting the truth. Is there some prize for converting believers? is there a quota that needs to be met?

It's not hot everywhere, and we might all still survive the Apocalypse.

You got a point. In this vein...Vegas get's hotter every year. We've had a fairly cold April, but overall we keep getting hotter. You and I could argue about global warming based on our locations...I'm in Vegas, so of course I'll be hot, but we need to realize that global temperatures are based off of everything from every location to Ocean temps etc.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: network dude

None of that changes the fact that my area is colder than expected this time of year.

Should we expect quarterly updates on your local weather?

Suggestion for a new ATS forum?

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: network dude

None of that changes the fact that my area is colder than expected this time of year.

Should we expect quarterly updates on your local weather?

If you would like, I can send them directly to you via PM. though, somehow, I bet you don't care and are just trying to be an ass. Remember, there is no mandate that you engage in a thread you just aren't that interested in. (the magic X is there for any and all)

a reply to: network dude

Remember, there is no mandate that you engage in a thread you just aren't that interested in.

Actually, I'm quite interested in attempts to distort and denigrate the science of climatology.

originally posted by: amazing

originally posted by: network dude
I am not here to be a "denier", or whatever other label needs to be attributed to me for voicing my opinion based on facts. I am just offering a perspective based on my reality. February was very warm. Unusually warm. But March and April have been uncharacteristically cold.
www.accuweather.com...

Yet, when I hear the news report on "weather", I hear this year has been the hottest on record yet again.
www.usatoday.com...

I understand that not everywhere is the same, but it sure seems that for shock value, all the cold areas are ignored, in favor of blasting the media with WARMING news. I feel like it's dishonest and not explaining the facts is misrepresenting the truth. Is there some prize for converting believers? is there a quota that needs to be met?

It's not hot everywhere, and we might all still survive the Apocalypse.

You got a point. In this vein...Vegas get's hotter every year. We've had a fairly cold April, but overall we keep getting hotter. You and I could argue about global warming based on our locations...I'm in Vegas, so of course I'll be hot, but we need to realize that global temperatures are based off of everything from every location to Ocean temps etc.

thanks for understanding the reason for the OP. I was worried it was too cryptic. just showing that in some parts of the US, it's not super hot. And it's nice to know that it's still hot in the desert. My last trip to Vegas was warm, and a nice change from the cold temps of December.

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: network dude

Remember, there is no mandate that you engage in a thread you just aren't that interested in.

Actually, I'm quite interested in attempts to distort and denigrate the science of climatology.

Is that was I was doing? damn, I must be on to something. the cult of climatology won't allow any talk of the "c" word. (cold) Do you guys do audits and make people "clear" as well?

originally posted by: network dude

originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: network dude

Remember, there is no mandate that you engage in a thread you just aren't that interested in.

Actually, I'm quite interested in attempts to distort and denigrate the science of climatology.

Is that was I was doing? damn, I must be on to something. the cult of climatology won't allow any talk of the "c" word. (cold) Do you guys do audits and make people "clear" as well?

I guess it's the psychology of the thing.

If you are starting believe the sky may be on the verge of turning green, then every time you see the green flash, it's proof of premise, but every day when the sky seems to be that pretty deep blue, it's just weather, er, whatever.

So, a hot spell like a heat dome effect is proof of premise, not mere weather, while living through the 4th coldest April ever recorded in your area is just mere weather and an anomalous blip, not anything significant.

a reply to: network dude

I must be on to something. the cult of climatology won't allow any talk of the "c" word. (cold) Do you guys do audits and make people "clear" as well?

No. You can talk about cold weather all you wish. I had a few chilly nights earlier this year too. Actually fired up my fireplace. Not because I needed it, but for the ambiance.

It's when you present your cold weather as a counterpoint to global warming that it becomes problematic. And stupid. Global warming does not mean nowhere will ever be cold and it doesn't mean that everywhere will always be hot.