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Proof Illegals should be shot on site...........

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posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 05:35 AM
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With his victim's family watching through tears in a Riverhead courtroom, Faustino Chavez described in new detail Tuesday how he raped, suffocated and slashed the throat of Mastic Beach single mother Vinessa Hoera.

As part of an impromptu agreement, Chavez, 26, pleaded guilty to a charge of first-degree murder for killing Hoera, 23, a co-worker at a Westhampton seafood store.

In exchange, Acting State Supreme Court Judge Michael Mullen promised to sentence Chavez to 22 years to life in prison on March 15. If found guilty at a trial, Chavez could have been sentenced to life without parole. Pretrial hearings had been scheduled to begin Tuesday.

"If I had my choice, the man would never see the light of day," said Hoera's mother, Donna Monti, of Flanders. " if I had to go through a trial, I don't think I would have been able to handle it."

Hoera's body was discovered in a wooded area in Westhampton in April, nearly two months after her car was found ablaze on a Southampton roadside. Chavez was arrested April 5. Days later, he disclosed the site of the body.

"The pain they have gone through from the moment Vinessa went missing is immeasurable," said John Collins, chief of the Suffolk District Attorney's Homicide Bureau, who said the family's anguish was "a factor" in the deal.

Chavez Tuesday subjected Hoera's family to the most troubling account to date of the slaying, including details the family never knew.

Answering questions from Suffolk District Attorney Kerriann Kelly, Chavez, through a Spanish interpreter, explained that he left his job at Cor-J Seafood early that Feb. 27, then returned later and got into Hoera's car with her as she was leaving for the day. They drove to the parking lot of a Hampton Bays store, where he raped her at knifepoint.

Afterward, Hoera said she was going to tell Patrick Moore, the father of her child, what had happened. Chavez grabbed a plastic bag from the car and put it over the head of Hoera, who he said was "very afraid," until she passed out.

"You didn't want her to tell anybody you had raped her?" Kelly asked.

"Yes," he replied.

Chavez then drove to a Westhampton soccer field. He tied the shoelaces on Hoera's sneakers together, threw her over his shoulders and carried her into the woods.

Despite believing "she was already dead," Chavez said he rested Hoera on the ground, took out his knife and sliced her throat ear to ear, several times. Chavez said he then drove her car to Southampton, doused it with gasoline and set it on fire.

Sources said Chavez, who came to the United States illegally from his native Guatemala, has been receiving treatment for severe depression at Pilgrim Psychiatric Center in West Brentwood for most of the last year. He has attempted suicide six times, sources said.

www.newsday.com...

Robotic 50 cal's stationed 100 years apart programed to shoot anything that crosses the borders.................End the stupidity now..........

[edit on 17-2-2005 by DrHoracid]




posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 05:44 AM
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Ok, this is bad, real bad.

Its tragic, and its heart renderingly sad, but, you cannot tar all with the same brush. I bet you most illegals were horrified!
look at the crime statistics in the US, and you will see that people of all races kill other people.

If you advocate tighter border controls, thats fine, but have a more valid reason. The ladies murder was horrific, and yes it was done by an illegal, but, sadly, humans hurt each other for fun or for gain.



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 05:47 AM
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You need locking up.

So how did you manage to conclude that illegals should be shot on sight(I assume you meant sight and not site). They are all murderers? What a laugh. So you advocate the murder of these people?

I cannot believe I have just spent time responding to yet another of your moronic posts.



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 05:55 AM
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Not The Right Response

Advocating that the U.S. adopt the same rules of engagement that East Germany did at the Berlin Wall will never gain my support.

I strongly support major reforms to clean up the underground slave economy that is leading to incidents like these.

But advocating indiscriminate shooting of civilians moves you either into the "Crackpot" column or "Monster" column.

Please, I urge you to adopt a more reasoned stance – and change the title if you can.

Yes, there's a problem, but the problem is that our leaders in both major parties are secretly supporting illegal immigration.

The people who are being taken advantage of are the victims, and most of them are very good people, and our fellow human beings.

Let's get our own house in order instead of shooting at unarmed civilians.


[edit on 2/17/2005 by Majic]



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 05:56 AM
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Illegals are a vile, disgusting, cancer on america. They need to be tracked down each and every one and thrown back under the rocks they crawled out from under. Shooting anyone that crosses the border on "site" ie on the land they defile will stop this BS. If the bodies pile up then eventually these subhuman peices of filth might get the message.......Take your disease and crime back to your own filthy countries.


JAK

posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 05:58 AM
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DrHoracid, I think you have a mistake in your mini profile.

You have:
    Mood: Boiling Glass
I believe what you meant was:
    Mood: Bumbling Arse
Glad to help


Jack



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 06:01 AM
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No, Please, NO!


Originally posted by DrHoracid
Illegals are a vile, disgusting, cancer on america. They need to be tracked down each and every one and thrown back under the rocks they crawled out from under. Shooting anyone that crosses the border on "site" ie on the land they defile will stop this BS. If the bodies pile up then eventually these subhuman peices of filth might get the message.......Take your disease and crime back to your own filthy countries.

I'll take the hit for full-quoting this, because I can't bear to edit it.

I would be lying to you if I didn't admit that it is heartbreaking for me to read this. Please, try to relax and think about what you're saying.

This just isn't what Americans do. Please reconsider this position.

I know you're better than this. Please, don't go down this road.

I beg you.



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 06:02 AM
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Originally posted by Majic
Not The Right Response

Advocating that the U.S. adopt the same rules of engagement that East Germany did at the Berlin Wall will never gain my support.

[edit on 2/17/2005 by Majic]


East germany shot people trying to ESCAPE communisim. By definition Illegals are crimminals. PERIOD. These same borders are letting terrorist flow through at will hiding among these poor underprivleged immigrants. Close the f..ing borders.


JAK

posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 06:09 AM
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My previous post was crass.

I apologise.

Jack



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 06:18 AM
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A Matter Of Strategy


Originally posted by DrHoracid
East germany shot people trying to ESCAPE communisim. By definition Illegals are crimminals. PERIOD. These same borders are letting terrorist flow through at will hiding among these poor underprivleged immigrants. Close the f..ing borders.

YES, CLOSE THE F..ING BORDERS!

I'm with you on that 100%. But I am opposed to your "solution" and could never support it. It is madness to suggest it.

The reason the borders aren't being closed is because of economics and political corruption. Both Democrats and Republicans in our government support illegal immigration for economic reasons.

I am furious with that, and that is but one of a laundry list of reasons why I cannot join either party.

But advocating shooting people on sight is UN-AMERICAN.

Please, please adopt a more resonable stance.

Your solution will not solve any problems.

Forcing our leaders to solve the illegal immigration problem and secure the borders will.



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 06:22 AM
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Usually I'd just skip to the next thread, but I'm having a bad day today.

Dr Horacid,

As seems to be more and more the norm with your posts, your outrage is justified, but your reasoning, suggested solutions and general tunnel-visioned, fight-fire-with-napalm attitude come across as childish, bigoted, grossly over-reactionary, and quite honestly, farcical to the point of being blackly comedic.

My 13 year-old nephew has more wisdom about the ways of the world than you present in your posts. Change the record, please. This tune's getting old.



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 06:28 AM
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Originally posted by Majic

But advocating shooting people on sight is UN-AMERICAN.

Please, please adopt a more resonable stance.



More reseaonable stance? In the 90's even Clinton put Marines on the borders and in fact did shoot "on sight". Protecting our borders in now "un-american"? Coastguard boat "shoot" across the bow of many illegal boats trying to enter this country. ALL border patrol carry weapons. History is full of data on shooting those trying to smuggle alcohol across the borders during proabition. Drug dealers shoot at drug enforcement all the time and are "shot". UN-American? I hate the public education system..........



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 07:05 AM
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The problem with closing the borders is that the border patrol is so under staffed it's impossible to close the borders, I say, dam the rio grande and make it radioactive. I must say though, there are some illegals that work their tails off in order to make a good living, but then again there are some illegals that come here just to live off government subsidies and leech off society. So how can you filter out the good from the bad? I don't believe in amnesty of illegals, because there are many more people in other countries that immigrate to the U.S. legally, and they too should be given the chance to make it.



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 07:16 AM
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Can someone please tell me how DrHoracid has not been banned from this board due to his inflamitory posts and attitude?



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 07:45 AM
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Originally posted by DrHoracid
Illegals are a vile, disgusting, cancer on america. They need to be tracked down each and every one and thrown back under the rocks they crawled out from under. Shooting anyone that crosses the border on "site" ie on the land they defile will stop this BS. If the bodies pile up then eventually these subhuman peices of filth might get the message.......Take your disease and crime back to your own filthy countries.


Wow you seriously should get some hardcore therapy dude.
That's just dumb.

You remind me of Hitler.



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 07:53 AM
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Was that a little wordplay from drhoracid? I thought you only played with ammunition and varmits? And subtlety? This truly is a sign of the apocalypse.

As for shooting people, anywhere, on sight (short of an actual war, etcetc) that would be a 'bad thing'.

But shooting illegal border crosses on the site of the border, well, thats at least a defensible position.

Illegals are illegal, this should be obvious. They have protections, being human, and thankfully are not all criminals (outside of the fraud and evasion involved in being in the US illegally), if they were, then there'd be lots more problems.


jakko
You remind me of Hitler.

I call Godwin! Haha! Was I the first to call it!?



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 07:58 AM
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Originally posted by IKnowNothing
The problem with closing the borders is that the
border patrol is so under staffed it's impossible
to close the borders,


That's why we have to stop giving so much money
overseas in aid. Example - Why the heck we are giving
multi-trillions in $$$ to Africa to fight aids is beyond
me. G.W. promised it about a year ago. UGH!
Spend that money at home on border security
(a nice big fat wall would be great!!) and tell
those folks in Africa to change their lifestyles
so they don't catch AIDS. (see ... that advice
didn't cost trillions of US taxpayer dollars and I
just solved almost all the new cases of AIDS in
Africa. Simple)



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 08:05 AM
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Originally posted by Nygdan
I call Godwin! Haha! Was I the first to call it!?


One common objection to Godwin's law is that sometimes using Hitler or the Nazis is a perfectly apt way of making a point.



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 08:06 AM
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Originally posted by Nygdan

jakko
You remind me of Hitler.

I call Godwin! Haha! Was I the first to call it!?

geeeeeeeez.
Another reference to Hitler.
I'm beginning to think that everyone was asleep
in history class except for the section on WWII.
Could we pleeeeeeeeeeeeease find someone else
to reference for a while? Hitler and Nazi is so OLD.

Shooting illegals who cross the border isn't a warm
and fuzzy Politically Correct solution to the problem,
but it certainly would slow down the illegal problem
here in America, wouldn't it? I wouldn't like to see
that happen. I'd rather see Washington WAKE UP
and do the border job correctly. (fat chance, huh?)

One interesting thought ... if America is soooooo bad
and sooooooo evil, then why are Mexicans, Haitians,
and Cubans willing to die to get here?
Why
do we have so many illegals? It's because America
is a WONDERFUL country. Certainly much better
than where they are coming from. Perhaps if they
stayed in their respective countries and worked at
changing them for the better (instead of running
away to ours), then they and their countries and
the world would be a much better place.



posted on Feb, 17 2005 @ 08:13 AM
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Don't kid yourself flyersfan, they want to get into America for the same reason poor europeans want to go to the netherlands.
From their poor country, your rich country looks like paradise.

And I have to object to godwin this time, the comparison does make sense.



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