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The religious bottleneck of the first century.

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posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 11:39 AM
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a reply to: Deetermined

Matthew is New Testament??

How is that relevant??



See that is the problem whoth Christians refusing to read the whole bible and instead just cherry picking a verse here and there..

You can make the Bible say ANYTHING you want that way..


edit on 17-1-2018 by JoshuaCox because: (no reason given)




posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 06:02 PM
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a reply to: JoshuaCox

I see you still can't explain who Isaiah 53 is talking about or deny the fact that's it's talking about a person with a mouth and a soul. Where are your verses that the nation of Israel is referred to in this way? You can't, nor can you explain who else it's talking about for that matter.


edit on 17-1-2018 by Deetermined because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 06:26 PM
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a reply to: Deetermined


Where are your verses that the nation of Israel is referred to in this way?


perhaps you should try reading the chapters before and after 53... not to mention most of the rest of the OT

Israel is clearly who is being spoken of in Isaiah 53




posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:06 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

Isaiah 54:5 tells me exactly who's being talked about and it's not a nation...

Isaiah 54:5 - 5 For thy Maker is thine husband; the Lord of hosts is his name; and thy Redeemer the Holy One of Israel; The God of the whole earth shall he be called.



posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:16 PM
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a reply to: Deetermined

Sure...

IF you want to take one verse out of context as Christians always do

Fortunately in reality its not talking about Jesus in any way, shape or form

though i know you wish it were




posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:22 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

LOL! You can bury your head, but you still can't hide. We all know that the following verses are not talking about a place, but a person.

Isaiah 53:8-10

8 He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken.

9 And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth.

10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

We don't have "graves" for places.

Places don't commit violence.

Places don't have deceit in their mouths.

Places don't feel "grief".

Places don't have souls.

Places don't carry their own seed to spread around and repopulate themselves.

Do I really need to pull each and every verse out of Isaiah 53 and explain them to you one by one. Because I will.



posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:33 PM
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a reply to: Deetermined

Again, try reading the chapters instead of cherry picking a few verses here and there and making your own interpretations...

Israel isn't a place, its a people... the decendants of Jacob

and Israel is referred to in the singular in many places

feel free to explain whatever you wish... i'd be happy to correct you




posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:47 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

I already did and I gave an explanation. What do you have besides the usual....nothing!



posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:51 PM
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a reply to: Akragon


Israel isn't a place, its a people... the decendants of Jacob

and Israel is referred to in the singular in many places


Show me in the Bible where Israel, as a people, all sacrificed themselves for the forgiveness of sins for the rest of the world as described in Isaiah 53. They didn't. One soul sacrificed themselves for the people of Israel and the whole world, and it was Jesus.



edit on 17-1-2018 by Deetermined because: (no reason given)



posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:53 PM
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a reply to: Deetermined

I have most of the bible that refers to Israel as a people... and the "servant" of their god

and your explanation is nonsense... typical but none the less

people have "graves"

People commit violence.

people have deceit in their mouths.

people feel "grief".

people have souls.

people carry their own seed to spread around and repopulate themselves.

Israel... exactly what all of the verses you people use to justify Jesus in your prophecy is talking about




posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:56 PM
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a reply to: Deetermined


Show me in the Bible where Israel, as a people, all sacrificed themselves for the forgiveness of sins for the rest of the world as described in Isaiah 53.


It doesn't say that.... lol

But if you want to twist that second last verse into what you believe it actually means.... OooooK




posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:56 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

Isaiah 53:7 said that there was NO deceit in his mouth and no violence. That pretty much leaves out describing Israel's people.



posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:57 PM
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originally posted by: Deetermined
a reply to: Akragon

Isaiah 53:7 said that there was NO deceit in his mouth and no violence. That pretty much leaves out describing Israel's people.


well the bible has a habit of being wrong...




posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:58 PM
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originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Deetermined


Show me in the Bible where Israel, as a people, all sacrificed themselves for the forgiveness of sins for the rest of the world as described in Isaiah 53.


It doesn't say that.... lol

But if you want to twist that second last verse into what you believe it actually means.... OooooK






What does it say then?



posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:59 PM
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originally posted by: Deetermined

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Deetermined


Show me in the Bible where Israel, as a people, all sacrificed themselves for the forgiveness of sins for the rest of the world as described in Isaiah 53.


It doesn't say that.... lol

But if you want to twist that second last verse into what you believe it actually means.... OooooK






What does it say then?


11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

Israel... Not Jesus




posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 07:59 PM
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originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: Deetermined
a reply to: Akragon

Isaiah 53:7 said that there was NO deceit in his mouth and no violence. That pretty much leaves out describing Israel's people.


well the bible has a habit of being wrong...



LOL! Why are you here in this conversation then?



posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 08:03 PM
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a reply to: Deetermined

As always, because i choose to participate...




posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 08:04 PM
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originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: Deetermined

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Deetermined


Show me in the Bible where Israel, as a people, all sacrificed themselves for the forgiveness of sins for the rest of the world as described in Isaiah 53.


It doesn't say that.... lol

But if you want to twist that second last verse into what you believe it actually means.... OooooK






What does it say then?


11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

Israel... Not Jesus



Really? You're really going to state that the people of Israel had to be sacrificed for other people's sins?! That's God's plan for salvation according to the Bible? You're hilarious!



posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 08:05 PM
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originally posted by: Deetermined

originally posted by: Akragon

originally posted by: Deetermined

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Deetermined


Show me in the Bible where Israel, as a people, all sacrificed themselves for the forgiveness of sins for the rest of the world as described in Isaiah 53.


It doesn't say that.... lol

But if you want to twist that second last verse into what you believe it actually means.... OooooK






What does it say then?


11 He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities.

Israel... Not Jesus



Really? You're really going to state that the people of Israel had to be sacrificed for other people's sins?! That's God's plan for salvation according to the Bible? You're hilarious!


again... thats not what the passage says...

try reading it...




posted on Jan, 17 2018 @ 08:09 PM
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a reply to: Akragon

Hey, Mr. Cherry Picker, why don't you read verse 12 to see the explanation for verse 11...

Isaiah 53:12

12 Therefore will I divide him a portion with the great, and he shall divide the spoil with the strong; because he hath poured out his soul unto death: and he was numbered with the transgressors; and he bare the sin of many, and made intercession for the transgressors.



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