Did Paul Invent Christianity?

a reply to: mysticalmetalhippie

You're not wrong there!!! Peace

a reply to: ChesterJohn

all of it has been answered go back and read slowly.

So you interject in a response of Malocchios to Matrxsurvivor - but you called me out for responding to your response to semoneone else a few posts ago.
hahaha

Talk about Hypocrisy

a reply to: Akragon

Mister is probably a good descriptor (see Master/master defn) judging by some of the comments he has made about women

a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

Peace and love to ya brother from the mystical metal hippie !

originally posted by: mysticalmetalhippie
a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

Peace and love to ya brother from the mystical metal hippie !

Man...you crack me up, lol. Cheers, bro.

a reply to: Malocchio

your agenda is to prove Paul a liar and dismiss his letters as the preserved words of God.

a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

the says "he himself IS judged of no man."

Learn to read 6th grade English.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

the says "he himself IS judged of no man."

Yet, Paul sure went around judging the heck out of everyone else.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

There is only one or two Bibles today that translate 2 Timothy to "rightly divide the word of truth."

Alternate translations are rightly interpret, handle, and similar words but "divide" is the LEAST common.

It's pretty much unique to the KJV and in all likelihood not the correct translation of the original Greek meaning which is why you can't explain the meaning of the passage and merely quote it rhetorically whenever you're busted erring in scripture.

I don't know anyone who has ever suggested that 2 Timothy is suggesting that certain parts of the Bible are for one group and certain parts for other, especially the New Testament which is a universal teaching applicable to all Christian denominations equally regardless of race or whatever the basis of your perception of division.

I am afraid you are misinterpreting the spirit of the particular passage and not considering the fact that at that time (of writing) the epistles weren't a part of the ''word of truth" i.e. the Bible and were not used so aren't even the topic of the statement that would only apply to the teachings of Jesus and the Old Testament.


When Marcion ''found" the Epistles of Paul they were unheard of and collecting dust, nobody used them and they aren't "the word of truth" but the writings of an angry and rejected turncoat who was written in to the New Testament by the author(s) of the book of Acts with a conversion story not even Paul writes about and as much as he boasts you know he wouldn't forget to mention such an important event.

Thankfully whoever gave us Acts leaves enough inconsistencies to tell the mind it's a fabrication.

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
a reply to: Malocchio

your agenda is to prove Paul a liar and dismiss his letters as the preserved words of God.

If you want to consider it an agenda, be my guest. I don't rate it of such importance to rise to the level of agenda but agendas aren't necessarily sinister so I don't care if you do.

I find it a relaxing way to pass the time and fulfilling in that I am dropping truth bombs on textbook theology, something that I feel is a worthy cause.

Your comments are all structured to insult and demean anyone with the willingness to expose the hypocrisy of mainstream Christianity and It's Pauline centered theology/marginalization of Jesus and the Apostles teachings.

The foundation of Christianity is corruption of truth and the New Testament is a monument to hypocrisy and a mockery of the true movement founded by the followers of the Nazarene True Prophet.

Any rational and unbiased investigation into the New Testament and early Church history will reveal the same things I have been saying.

Paul is either a literary invention and non historical character or:

A false prophet.

a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

Peace and love to ya brother ! What do you call a pharisee jukebox ! A cash register , ka-ching ! Peace and love from the mystical metal hippie

originally posted by: mysticalmetalhippie
a reply to: Matrixsurvivor

Peace and love to ya brother ! What do you call a pharisee jukebox ! A cash register , ka-ching !

Peace and love from the mystical metal hippie

Sending you a "cyber hug", bro.

Either God has kept his word to preserve his words to every generation or he has not.

That is the choice you all have. If you say that the Bible is corrupt and no version is accurate then you don't believe God kept his word as he promises in Psalm 12:6, 7. If that is what you believe then don't waste your time following JHVH or Jesus Christ because he is not powerful enough to keep his own promises.

But if you are like me, and there be few who are, then you know where God's preserved word is and you believe every word of it.

Now I divide it because the command to Noah to build an ark is obviously not for me today. Nor are the Laws given Israel for existence in the land of Israel. The Gospel of the Kingdom is based on the kingdom Promise to Israel that one would reign from the loins of David for all eternity, and that gospel required all who believed it to keep all the law of Moses. But Religious and civil leadership of Israel rejected their messiah and so God rejected them after they stoned Stephen. The gospel of the kingdom is temporarily postponed until Israel's chastisement is completed in the great Tribulation.

Until that time, Paul was called as one out of do time, and he was given the Gospel of the grace of God from Jesus Christ himself, hence the difference between the two Gospels one for Israel and those who would live with them in the kingdom, and one for all men both Jew and Gentile all based on the work of the Cross of Christ that is for today until the great Tribulation, which starts when the Body of Christ is gathered unto Jesus in the clouds ever more to be with him.

Once that gathering takes place then the kingdom gospel will go back into effect and the gospel of the grace of God will no longer be available to man kind again. Towards the end of the great tribulation another Gospel is presented, by this time almost everyone has been killed off and those that remain must prepare themselves to meet God, it is preached by an angel standing in the sun and it required those who here it to give God glory for his judgment is at hand.

This division is found throughout the NT and has many cross references to the OT prophets.

God created Christianity of today and it was Paul and Barnabas who first called them Christians in Antioch Caesarea. Where Paul taught them three years before going to Jerusalem to refute the Judaizes who wanted to put the Gentiles under the law of Moses after they heard the Gospel of the grace of God. The converts of Paul not the converts of the kingdom Gospel under peter and the 11 plus Mathias and the 500 others who were apostles before Paul.

blessings to those who believe and curses to those who do not believe that God has perfectly preserved ALL his words in the 66 books we have of the Old and New Testament.

I now leave this to those who hate Paul and the Lord Jesus who called him to testify of the gospel of the grace of God.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

So thats one vote for "Paul created Christianity"

Much appreciated

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
Either God has kept his word to preserve his words to every generation or he has not.

That is the choice you all have. If you say that the Bible is corrupt and no version is accurate then you don't believe God kept his word as he promises in Psalm 12:6, 7. If that is what you believe then don't waste your time following JHVH or Jesus Christ because he is not powerful enough to keep his own promises.

But if you are like me, and there be few who are, then you know where God's preserved word is and you believe every word of it.

Now I divide it because the command to Noah to build an ark is obviously not for me today. Nor are the Laws given Israel for existence in the land of Israel. The Gospel of the Kingdom is based on the kingdom Promise to Israel that one would reign from the loins of David for all eternity, and that gospel required all who believed it to keep all the law of Moses. But Religious and civil leadership of Israel rejected their messiah and so God rejected them after they stoned Stephen. The gospel of the kingdom is temporarily postponed until Israel's chastisement is completed in the great Tribulation.

Until that time, Paul was called as one out of do time, and he was given the Gospel of the grace of God from Jesus Christ himself, hence the difference between the two Gospels one for Israel and those who would live with them in the kingdom, and one for all men both Jew and Gentile all based on the work of the Cross of Christ that is for today until the great Tribulation, which starts when the Body of Christ is gathered unto Jesus in the clouds ever more to be with him.

Once that gathering takes place then the kingdom gospel will go back into effect and the gospel of the grace of God will no longer be available to man kind again. Towards the end of the great tribulation another Gospel is presented, by this time almost everyone has been killed off and those that remain must prepare themselves to meet God, it is preached by an angel standing in the sun and it required those who here it to give God glory for his judgment is at hand.

This division is found throughout the NT and has many cross references to the OT prophets.

God created Christianity of today and it was Paul and Barnabas who first called them Christians in Antioch Caesarea. Where Paul taught them three years before going to Jerusalem to refute the Judaizes who wanted to put the Gentiles under the law of Moses after they heard the Gospel of the grace of God. The converts of Paul not the converts of the kingdom Gospel under peter and the 11 plus Mathias and the 500 others who were apostles before Paul.

blessings to those who believe and curses to those who do not believe that God has perfectly preserved ALL his words in the 66 books we have of the Old and New Testament.

I now leave this to those who hate Paul and the Lord Jesus who called him to testify of the gospel of the grace of God.

I do hate Paul...but I don't hate Jesus. What do you do with that? isn't Jesus who we're supposed to be listening to?

a reply to: Akragon

Go back and read I said God created Christianity and Jesus Christ called Paul and gave him the gospel of the grace of God.

a reply to: ChesterJohn


You have a tendency towards repetition of phrases.

"Rightly divide the word of truth" and "preserved word of God" being common themes in a lot of your comments.

I have addressed your misinterpretation that led to you errantly believing that ''divide" is the absolute best translation and something to build a dogma around, a dogma of division, based on the LEAST preferred and least common translation of 2 Timothy that is more accurately ''interpret."

Now I will address your errant belief that God is a protector of literature.

God doesn't interfere in the murders of innocent people which happen every day, doesn't prevent children from fatal illnesses and allows man FREE WILL to commit sin.


He obviously doesn't value a book more than human life. A book doesn't breath or have children, parents. A book doesn't come from the finger of God, people are his priority and most intelligent biological creation.

Yet he allows unimaginable pain to be inflicted on millions of innocent people.


"Either God protects his word or he doesn't."

Was what you said.

You have also said that only one Bible is the ''preserved word."

The problem with that theory is that dozens of versions and many more accurate than the KJV exist and the KJV didn't exist until around 1500 or so and that means that for 1500 years it didn't exist while Christianity DID exist.

So obviously the KJV isn't the original Bible and versions in Greek and Latin, Syriac and Aramaic preceded it making it the least likely to be accurate.

It was also produced in the interest of the Crown, to make sure the word King is used instead of Caesar as often as possible and without the informative footnotes of the Geneva Bible.

God may or may not have had a hand in preserving the Bible but it was man who wrote, re-wrote and destroyed the history of the ancient world to erase anything that would expose the Romans scheme of turning the Spiritual Messiah of Israel into the God of the Empire.

God doesn't have to preserve it because man did that and it isn't God's Word, it's the combined Law, Prophets and writings of the Jews united to Pagan mythology.


I think one could say that God preserved the Nag Hammadi scriptures and the Dead Sea Scrolls, as they have forever changed Christianity in a time people want the truth about Christianity's origins more than ever despite the efforts of the Catholic Church to prevent the DSS from being released in the public arena, especially the Eisenmen translated, previously unreleased material that proves the existence of the Ebionites in the first century and their Messianic expectations.

If you are familiar with the Scrolls it's obvious that whoever they belonged to were the originators of what we know today as Christianity. 12 leaders, 3 pillar leaders, tongues of fire, all themes shared by the NT and DSS and by far not the only.


God shows the Truth to those who can accept it, handle it and spread it to others who want it and are Spiritually mature.

Everyone else is stuck with Paul and his spiritually inhibiting doctrine of us vs. them, curse those who don't agree, doctrine of ''believe me and go to heaven, don't believe burn in hell."

If you can't see the fallacy in spiritual threats you can't see what's above you and are only seeing what is in front of you.


Islam and Judaism don't have to teach people that they will go to hell if they aren't Muslims or Jews and have a live and let live policy in their book(s). They may believe differently but I know of know teaching in Judaism that says ''all non Jews go to hell" although the Talmud has some goyim unfriendly teachings it doesn't go so far as to commit them to eternal torment.

In Islam it is not even an issue as who has the right to say who God will pardon or punish?

Only Christianity approaches people on the street and threatens them with hellfire if they don't ''get saved" (whatever saved is).

Yet salvation is not the focus of Jesus teachings but how to live on earth as though it were Heaven because you are in the Kingdom of God NOW and salvation is self serving not a sacrifice.

Jesus didn't say ''My death is the new atonement for sacrifice" that comes from the false apostle Paul. Jesus was killed but not for your benefit and to believe that his death is your salvation gets your hands bloody.

Because that means you are in a human sacrifice or deicidal atonement believing religion and far from the narrow path of the Way.

Christianity teaches if you don't accept Jesus as God and Saviour who died for your sins you will go to hell.


That's causing fear in the mind in order to create conformity to the doctrines of men.


God is in no book but his messengers the Prophets (not Paul) all teach essentially the same thing. There is one God with who all things descended. No MAN whether prophet or Messiah is God.

Your actions matter, faith alone is not going to cut it, even demons believe in God but they are still evil and what is more appealing to the evil mind than:


"Believe what I say and you will go to heaven. If you accept our doctrine you have eternal salvation and all you have to do is say Jesus is God and you're in!"

If it sounds to good to be true...or to stupid to be the Word of God:


It's probably Paul.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Now how come you refuse to answer the questions I asked.


I looked, all you did was parrot the poorly translated words of Paul in the KJV of 2 Timothy where he says:

"...rightly divide/handle/interpret the word of truth."

I already knew about that.

What I want to know is:


What are the actual divisions, is it a Jew vs. Gentile thing?

If not Jew vs. Gentile then who is being divided?


Because if you divide the word of truth you do it to distribute to the proper faction yet all Christians use the whole Bible and not just a portion. Mainstream Christianity doesn't believe in Jew vs Gentile IN HOUSE.

If a Jew joins a Christian Church he is equal to everyone else and not allotted a seperate division of scripture. Matthew applies as much as Romans, Hebrews and Jamea.

Everyone is equal under God so who gets what division of the word of truth upon its right division?

You claim you already answered but that is incorrect, you quoted the words and pointed to their location in the Bible WITHOUT answering EVEN ONE QUESTION I had asked.

Because you can't, you don't know the answer and thought using rhetoric and quotation would suffice. It doesn't. So one more time:


Who gets what portion of the rightly divided word of truth, once it is rightly divided?

a reply to: Malocchio

the Bible speaks for itself. the less words of men and all Bible is better than nothing but men's opinions and non-biblical writings and quotes.

Building an ark is a command given Noah. So obviously it is not for today.

The Law of Moses is given to all Israel in the land of Israel. so obviously it is not for Gentiles today especially because of the ordinances delivered by Paul and Barnabas to the churches saved under the gospel to the uncircumcised which is the the gospel of the grace of God. So again it is obvious that those scriptures are not for today.

The command to Israel to sacrifice at certain times of the year, certain types of animals. Which obviously cannot be done by even Jews today because there is not temple.

The command to eat of all creatures was given Noah and is applicable to all today as is the command to eat of herbs. Eating would be a choice of the individual. As Paul said just don't offend any with your food or days you worship or call for a holy day.

The Gospel of the Kingdom was presented by Christ before his crucifixion. the crucifixion of Christ was for told as was his resurrection. Jesus taught that all who accept the gospel of the kingdom should do all that the law of Moses commanded and those he healed were told to go and present the sacrifice according to the law of Moses.

Unfortunately, once again there is no temple in Jerusalem for any follower f the gospel of the kingdom to go to to do the law of Moses, plus there are two vital requirements one must repent of all ones sins and wickedness (something no man can really do because oft he sin of unaware or unknown, of which God provided a sacrifice for but there is no temple to sacrifice as required. Even Jesus Sacrificed on the Passover and held the the feast of the unleavened bread with his disciples. That is the problem for all who try to hold to and believe the feast of Passover it cannot be held but in Jerusalem and there must be a temple and an altar and a sacrifice.

And the other requirement under the kingdom Gospel is one must be baptized. Unlike the baptism that Paul taught as did only a few times, it is in water and is ones proof of his faith in Christ. Baptism under the kingdom gospel is mandatory.

Baptism under the gospel of the grace of God is the H9ly Ghost entering and placing one in Christ giving one new life. Water baptism is not required. and in Romans 6 you will not find water with in 20 verses either direction of the direct context it is a spiritual baptism.

If one tries to get saved by following the Everlasting Gospel of Rev 14 one will not receive salvation at all and if they died tomorrow believing the Gospel that has not even been preached yet, for that gospel is unfulfilled prophecy. Anyone placing their trust in the everlasting gospel will die in their sins and go to judgement and later the lake of fire.

ALL men are saved today by the gospel of the grace of God, which Jesus gave to Paul as a testimony to the world. If a midget or one born with a withered hand gets saved under the gospel of the grace of God he will receive a new and whole and complete body which will be holy and without blemish at the gathering unto Jesus in the clouds ever more to be with him.

That is right division of the word of truth. And there is much more as we go through the scriptures and find many verses that are not for today and plenty that are for today.

You know all the scriptures I have alluded to but many you deny as true, and without error.

To people with no Torah knowledge, and no love for Jews ....
Amid people who believe every conception of “God” one can imagine,

a vagabond Jew named Paul of Tarsus proclaimed salvation in another Jew who had been rejected by Jewish leaders and crucified by a Roman governor.
Salvation apart from Law-keeping.

That wandering Jewish tentmaker preacher [whose last address was a prison in Rome] was so influential, that 2000 years later many of his critics claim Paul is the real creator of "christianity." He [inspired by Jesus] changed the world.

Why did many Gentiles believe him ?

Because he was confirmed with power. POWER. Paul changed the world. Paul is a MADE MAN.

Compared to Paul, his critics are ankle biting Chihuahuas.