ATS requires substance to open an OP but the members don't like it.

I and other have attempted to follow the new guidelines on posting that ATS has required for starting a new post by not post minimal amounts of info but a complete explanation with the facts.

But the members who follow don't want to read the info posted that is required to start a post. They claim that "walls" of text are just to much for them and they want the minimum that ATS has condemned and are now enforcing the new standard which one must have substance and not just a opinion with no real facts.

The problem is not the Post but the members not wanting to read a post, especially if it something they don't want or like to read before getting to the point. I have seen these members complain and make replies to the final statement but it is clear they never read the supportive data before replying all the time crying that they wouldn't/couldn't and should not have to read a post with all the info before replying.

Maybe it is about time for ATS to start enforcing the replies that don't meet the standard of those who have actually read the whole OP before replying. That sure would weed out troublemakers who just want to fit and spit more than participate in a discussion of facts and truth.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Yes walls are bad. Paragraphs are key.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Yes!!! I've noticed the same thing.

Especially frustrating for me are the videos posted with no explanation of the content, and little commentary on the video. For many of us, for many reasons, we are not able to watch unlimited videos -- or any videos at all. And I suspect that many, like me, much prefer the written word anyway to videos. I cannot discuss and debate with the video... we discuss and debate with each other.

ATS is a discussion forum; if I wanted YouTube, I'd be on YouTube.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Sometimes it's not what you are posting. But how you are posting. A "wall" of text is that which has all your ideas, and information yet it is not separated by paragraphs, or formatted in a way that makes it easy for others to follow. I doubt many members would prefer content similar to twitter or facebook, and appreciate those who provide a detailed post .

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
I and other have attempted to follow the new guidelines on posting that ATS has required for starting a new post by not post minimal amounts of info but a complete explanation with the facts.

No, you haven't. And those guidelines are not in any way "new."

Maybe it is about time for ATS to start enforcing the replies that don't meet the standard of those who have actually read the whole OP before replying. That sure would weed out troublemakers who just want to fit and spit more than participate in a discussion of facts and truth.

Or, as in your case, non-facts and fantasy.

Your last big post is a case in point. You started out with a massive wall of text in bible verses, and a MINIMAL amount of your own discussion, just the exact opposite of what is required. Now you're angry at the replies. You don't really want a discussion of "facts and truth" because that would mean everyone must agree with you. Fact is, they don't. ATS is not a venue for your proselytizing, and people such as yourself seem to be blind to what a nuisance it is when you do.

If you truly want to adhere to the way ATS expects you to behave, you would put all those bible verses in a link to save a whole lot of space, then develop your thesis as your main presentation. So far you don't seem to get that, so now you're blaming others for pointing it out.

Right now you look like a guy in a soiled and rumpled suit on a soapbox in the park with a "Repent, you sinners" sign wailing away at the sky to no one in particular just hoping for an audience of grateful believers that never materializes. All you're getting is a few coins tossed in your hat because some people feel sorry for you. Any intelligent speaker who found this to be happening would recast his message in hopes of attracting more people to his cause. Instead, you blame the audience. The way you are operating now evokes an audience that says, "That guy's crazy!" And for that you have no one to blame but yourself.

a reply to: Boadicea

Guilty as charged .But like you said not all will be interested in the vid but some will .I don't look at popping a vid into a thread that may contain some info even if it doesn't reach the whole board .Some people could watch it and may choose not to .Its easy to skip over what ever poster you may choose to ignore or a vid you cant or wont watch . I see it as a no foul either way .Its only one of a few options and can sometimes bring something into the thread . It has happened before and I have enjoyed some .I have also ignored some .I have options and so do other members including you ....peace

a reply to: ChesterJohn

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Uhhhhhhhh . . . a WALL OF TEXT without paragraphing IS hideous and almost painful for some of us to attempt to read. Such a thoughtless post deserves to be scrolled by, ignored.

A fittingly brief posting of the referenced material is important. Following that with a substantive personal response to the referenced material should not be difficult and is crucial to a good, solid OP. I think ATS's insistence on meaty OP's is one of it's better hallmarks.

I agree that there's too often an absence of individuals in our era willing to take the time to consider something useful or important that's longer than a brief phone text. That's a crying shame. Idiots manipulated, conditioned and conformed to such mentalities may well deserve to miss out on possibly life-saving and relationship saving information just because they have become trained sheeple/rats in the maze conditioned to ignore substantive information.

I realize the oligarchy has a vested interest in conditioning the serfs and slaves against reading anything of substance and seriously thinking about it. That too many ATSers would be sooooo needlessly compliant and great examples of such conditioning is exceedingly sad.

Nevertheless, imho, one's task as an OPoster is to offer meaty substance for the opportunity of consideration. I hope that doesn't change to comply with a mindless texting conditioned capacity to read and ponder more than 10 words in a row.

a reply to: schuyler

Oh Dear me . . . a co-religionist is not being wise and sensible?

Maybe they will learn from the responses on this thread.

We have a hard enough time earning a hearing without shooting ourselves 12 times in our feet by poor OP posting habits.

I think it's vital to offer a meaty OP with short paragraphs and easily grasped personal points. I know that I tend to write too long a post at times. My rationalization is that the info is there for those seriously interested. So, I'm torn on that score.

Regardless of whether an OP is long or short--it at least needs a minimum of meaty points for readers to sink their minds into and offer thoughtful responses to. imho.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Well its more like this, if you put a wall of text.. it means you probably dont understand the topic to well and try to force yourself with your opinion onto others.. A. Einstein wrote this quote

“if you can't explain it simply you don't understand it well enough”?

If you have facts, break it down to parts explaining each part.. That becomes a large wall of text divided into sections.. Otherwise, it becomes a sort of an aesthetic philosophy paper on your thoughts, fantasies and ideals..

The real world has always been simple..

a reply to: ChesterJohn
Though, I have seen History posts where people write one line, a very long Wikipedia quote and a link....hate those threads. Not only history, but for example.

Every period or comma gives you a breather in English Literature.

you are unable to digest because you want it predigested for you.

Instant pudding, and noodles are for babies. Heavy meat is for those who know how to digest ideas from a wall of text with breath points.

I guess it is all about making life easy for you or you wont even try.

Crybabies and snowflakes this generation has.

a reply to: ChesterJohn
I mean, you're complaining now...so uh cry babies and snowflakes? Unless you mean something else.

a reply to: Tiamat384

the context suggest that people today want everything done for them and all they need to do is download the app and have it all.

Good Lord, life is not a app you can down load it is real work.

a reply to: ChesterJohn
People don't like large blocks of text. They are harder to follow than paragraphs. It shows you can construct writing well when you can divide your ideas into sub-parts. Also your thread filled with Bible verses....I mean it was a block and it isn't fact. You can't expect everyone to have the same beliefs, but then we are on the topic of construction.

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
Every period or comma gives you a breather in English Literature.

you are unable to digest because you want it predigested for you.

Instant pudding, and noodles are for babies. Heavy meat is for those who know how to digest ideas from a wall of text with breath points.

I guess it is all about making life easy for you or you wont even try.

Crybabies and snowflakes this generation has.

Its your own ideas and fantasies, since we are not mind -readers do you think we would understand a post that your mind made, without facts to go with it?

N.....O......

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Not an entirely accurate summary.

Our eyes and minds NEED the micro-rests that space between paragraphs provide.

When that space and the resulting micro-rest is NOT THERE, it fosters discomfort and trouble comprehending what is written.

IT IS THE DUTY OF THE AUTHOR to be fairly easily readable--just as it is the duty of the speaker to be fairly easily hearable.

Blaming the reader for poor writing habits is not Christian (not doing unto others as one would wisely want done unto them), not accurate, not fitting and not wise. It's also just not 'the loving thing' to do.

On this forum and most others--the term "a wall of text" = lines of text more than 8-12 and far too often many dozens of lines--without any paragraphing breaks. It does not mean what you are using it to mean. Trying to change the definition, in this case, is poor communication.

You'd be better off calling a long chunk of prose--too long an article. Too many words or whatever such.

a reply to: ChesterJohn

Those are the not the members who really want to consider and constructively respond to a post, then. But as long as a large amount of info is presented in a legible, well-thought-out way, most people will read it if the topic is interesting.

Disregard the whiney people and embrace those who have something to offer.

(hit 'submit' too soon)

ETA: But, also, you want to look at your own posts and see if they really do adhere to the guidelines, engage the reader, and provide your own thoughts on the subject matter. Not every lengthy post is interesting, and not all of them have an appropriate amount of editorializing that gets a conversation going.

originally posted by: ChesterJohn
Every period or comma gives you a breather in English Literature.

you are unable to digest because you want it predigested for you.

Instant pudding, and noodles are for babies. Heavy meat is for those who know how to digest ideas from a wall of text with breath points.

I guess it is all about making life easy for you or you wont even try.

Crybabies and snowflakes this generation has.

Well....there is someone here crying about how no one wants to read their walls of text. For whatever that is worth.

Apparently the only way to digest that real meat of a wall of text is with a few rocks of self superiority in the gizzard.

a reply to: Tiamat384

the texts are the facts. So what you are saying is people don't like to have to wade through the facts. Just like I said. They want someone else to make their opinions they can either agree with or disagree with and not do any thinking for them selves.

I wrote a long opinion on a water distiller, but before I did I got one and read the accompanying patents. To read through all those patents was tedious and time consuming but in the end I learned more about that machine than the inventor could ever describe. If I relied just on his claims and did no study of my own I would never had concluded I had in my possession one of the best water distillers ever. Many will never go far enough on their own and always depend on some one else to do the work.

Sorry life is not that simple and to do so makes us minions and serfs to others opinions and ideas. Be a master of ideas, not to make followers of them, but to free those who are nothing more that intellectual serfs. this is what today's educational system has produces intellectual serfs, who have no real opinions of their own that would benefit society, but only parrot what they learn without question and research.