The magnanimity of Scientology

a reply to: smurfy

Being magnanimous though is a trait, and very singular, so much so as to be a riddle when it comes to organised religion, or just about any formal organisation for that matter. AKA you just bend things a bit when it suits…the very things that you should not do.

Religion is man made, spirituality, something different . General enough?

And you're right they are all clubs. They got them a club house, club meetings and club activities, dues and a membership you can 'belong' to.

a reply to: smurfy

Sorry, had to respond twice…

Not quite there with your summation, maybe it's the context, generalize about religion, then you could say there is recognizable evil within most of them.

Sorry you misunderstood, I don't think these organizations are evil.

a reply to: Thetan

I see a lot of denial in your comments. You saw a documentary featuring high level Scientolgists like Marty Rathbun and a lot of other Scientolgists who just want to save people like you from joining a predatory cult and you dismiss it as silly. You aren't even willing to listen, so why are you conducting a poll?

If you were having second thoughts you would have said so but you are defending the sadistic organization so you aren't having second thoughts you are showing off your pride in being a member of a known and famously ridiculed by the most gullible of people who aren't gullible enoughto go where yyou are going.

You joined for help and community and a sense of belonging. You can get that from somewhere they aren't only interested in turning you into a robot slave.

You are in a cult. I have every OT level on pdf on my phone, some in LRH's own handwriting. Do you really want to spend your life and money to find out about an intergalactic warlord named Xenu?

Do you actually believe Hubbard was an honest man? That he hadsecret kknowledge that could save the world (for a fee)?

He was a liar about his life story, military career, and just about everything. I have read Bare face Messiah and I know his life story.

You will dismiss any negative info as the actions of a suppressive person. I don't have the ability to suppress you or the will. I just think that you are in a bad way and sought help from the wrong people.

Everyone KNOWS Scientology is a ridiculous organization full of brainwashed idiots. A mean thing to say but a fact.

Do you not know that a therapist is cheaper and better and more honest?

Or that all Scientology cares about is money and power?

You have to be one of the most uninformed and easily influenced-by- crooks people on the planet to take seriously a well known cult created by a well known con artist and lunatic science fiction writer who never had a friend in his life that he actually cared about.

What is wrong with you? Scientology is the most absurd organization on earth but the one thing they know how to do is brainwash people.

You don't have to join to know what they are about like you claim. That is a recruiting method sales tactic.

I am just flabbergasted that you are not aware you have just sold your freedom for a dream that doesn't exist.

But by all means, tell everyone that we don't know because we aren't Scientolgists.

But the truth is you DON'T know because you ARE.

reply to: Willingly

That interview was creepier than these creepy
North Korean Children playing guitars ...

link

Yes, very evil. For the many reasons given here already. I lived in Clearwater and ran into them-there were lots of them-recruiting at the Florida Fair. They took up a third of the huge tent and acted like the "moonies" from the 70s. As my daughter looked at all the trinkets being marketed I stood close by to hear what the freaks were saying to be able to attract so many people who were sitting and listening one on one at their tables. It was interesting that they did not call themselves Scientologists, hate it I can't remember what they called their area-but there was Hubbard's book front and center. So they were kinda pretending to go incognito. They were promising the moon and every human desire to all these young people. I am by nature quite a shy person and not religious but I began encountering the hawkers and telling every person that went by to move along as this was a cult. To this day I am shocked by how persuasive they were and how they were able to stop people at a far, mostly young people, and the intensity of their ability to get their full attention.

Okay, and the fact the St Pete Times did a huge expose on them and then Scientology bought the newspaper and it all stopped.

Yes, they are scary and evil and manipulative. I am enraged at this manipulation and very frightened by their ability to hone in on the vulnerable.

Yes, this evil.

a reply to: Thetan

no - with the caveat - an " organisation " is just a concept - it cannot be evil - or good - it just is

scientologists are cultists - who routinley practice evil

originally posted by: Thetan
I'm conducting a poll, and I thank everyone who participates in advance.

The question is: Do you think Scientology is an evil organization?

Yes
No
Unsure
Other

Feel free elaborate on your answers.

There is no such thing as an 'evil' anything!

ALL 'good', and ALL 'evil', exist in the vain judgmental thoughts/imagination/ego (vanity) of the beholder!

"We do not see the world as it is, we see it as we are!"

The eye of unconditional Love never sees 'good', never sees 'evil', never 'judges'!
The eye of Love only sees the Beloved!

To imagine that 'evil' (or 'good') exists in 'things', is rather ignorant and juvenile.

a reply to: Thetan

The Purification Rundown and the Survival Rundown are both part of Scientology and NOT dianetics.

You are wrong. Anything that has to do with the body is Dianetics. The Purification Rundown is about the body, I don't know anything about the "Survival Runddown", but I imagine it also has to do with the body, because the spirit doesn't need to survive, it's eternal.

a reply to: Thetan

I thought Scientologists were "actively discouraged" from researching Scientology online. Do your Scientology mates know what you are doing here?

As to your "poll", I not only find Scientology to be a brainwashing cult that deludes its followers into handing over their life savings in order to find out that an "alien" named "Xenu" put bad spirits into volcanoes, I also find its brainwashed followers to be offensive to the highest degree with their treatment of people who are not part of the cult.

I do hope that someday you wake up to yourself, but judging by your replies in this thread I am sure that will never happen.

a reply to: namelesss

On a side-note, it certainly takes some sort of evil "genius" to make people beliefe that grabbing two empty cans of beans that are connected to something the miniature-train lovers use for their hobby, will solve their mommy and daddy issues.

Scientology is like spending craploads of money for each successive chapter of a really bad sci-fi novel. And, typically, it tells you there's something inherently wrong with you that only they can fix. I consider it pretty much the same as any other religion, they're all silly but Scientology doesn't have the perceived legitimacy of having been around for hundreds of years.

Honestly I don't understand how people stay in scientology in the age of the world wide web. Before you had to pay money to access the higher levels of crazy that only the people with more money than sense could afford to be told, but now you can preemptively read EVERYTHING you'd be getting yourself into before you even go in for your first thetan test.

There's something else I'd like to bring up, but it's a bit painful as well as stupid.

I can't remember the correct name for this exercise, but it basically involves the member 'confessing' to anyone they've wronged in the past.

The person who introduced me to Scientology told me, during a visit, that he had a confession to make to me but it was so awful he couldn't tell me face to face. He said he'd write me a letter. And so he did.

What he confessed to was, indeed, awful and actually criminal. And I had his written confession. If I'd taken that letter to the police he could have been prosecuted. If convicted he'd probably have received a considerable sentence.

Seriously, what sort of organisation encourages its members to confess to crimes that they could have gotten away with if only they'd kept quiet? I know, some deep 'spiritual' thing that will work for their greater good. Well, bugger that.

And what of the victim who suddenly has the confession landed on them? I'm still trying to come to terms with it some years later.

Just out of curiosity I looked up the local scientology church website. I've done so in the past(just to see if we even had one out here in the sticks), but that was a few years ago.

Well, we have one(just 1, thank xenu), so while I was on the site I checked out some of the sales pitch(er informational videos).

First, just wanted to get something out of the way, the church is located in the old state science museum building. The irony of a place that was once used to educate, now being the center of an organization that brainwashes people was surely not lost on me. I'm sure that is no coincidence.

So watching a few of the videos I have to admit, I was impressed. The facility is top notch, lot of money in the coffers. Looks like scientology found a way to catch up on what took other churches 100's of years to achieve. No doubt because they target the higher income individuals and get them paying right in the door.

Still, looking at the site and watching some of the videos is strange. I just can't believe this is real, I just can't believe that people fall for this. Having to spend large sums of money to be "enlightened" is such an obvious ploy, even for a religion. You could walk into any "old religion" church and attend services, hear their teachings and probably eat some cookies and milk without spending a dime. This could go on for years if you choose to, the worst you would get is a few glances as you continually pass the collection plate on without ever dropping a cent in it. The fact that you have to pay thousands for these "courses" should be raising red flags and shooting off flares for even the dullest bulbs in modern society.

Xenu help us all.

a reply to: MisterSpock

I have a theory of a psychological nature on why Scientology is successful even with the universally horrible press and the fact that it is obviously a scam fronting as empowering people fronting as a church.

L. Ron Hubbard was for all his madness able to ingratiate himself to almost all who weren't as dishonest as he was. Even though most people knew he was full of it, he was entertaining and jovial in the early days when he met the disciple of Aleister Crowley and self trained rocket fuel expert Jack Parsons. Parsons was made head of the Agape lodge of the O.T.O in California and was a man with high level government clearance for his work in rocket propulsion. I suppose this is more common than we think.

But from this Jack Parsons, a nice guy really who trusted the absolute last person you should trust and Crowley would call him a" weak fool" and end his association with Jack after he let Ron participate in a sex magick working called and recorded as the Babalon Working designed to create a moonchild. It was a serious violation of ethics because Ron was not a member and whatever the hell went on L. Ron Hubbard learned from Parsons a secret that was more valuable than 30 grand h LRH stole.

I don't exactly know if he learned btainwashing techniques or how to sell his soul but after the whole thing is over Parsons would die mysteriously and Hubbard would go on to be a best selling author of the pseudo science fiction self help book Dianetics and create the most ridiculously named and unlikely successful Scientology.

It was the secret society that Hubbard had wanted after flirting with the occult and hearing about Crowley only his was successful because as wicked as you might think Crowley was Hubbard had no morals and was a better con artist because he would go on to recruit a team of shadowy people who would use his brainwashing occult psychology and make people feel good about it. And then it would wear off and you would go back and pay and get happy on and on.

He died with 600,000,000 dollars that is still in Scientology's coffers plus some billions in cash and real estate because Hubbard learned and taught a secret and effective way to brainwash people and charge then for it.

An occult secret. It's got an appeal to some people who don't ever actually learn it yet keep paying. I don't think there is a secret anymore but people still think that they have secret knowledge. And people will pay for secret things. You sell the sizzle not the steak.


Oh, and as P.T. Barnum said:

"A sucker is born every minute!"

originally posted by: Thetan
a reply to: Blaine91555

Over 99% of Scientology is available to the general public and the remaining fraction of a percent is esoteric only because knowledge has to be taught in a logical order. As for a price list? I'm honestly not sure, I learn about prices through the church I attend. Try here perhaps. www.scientology.org... Scientology charges money because that's what it takes to thrive and expand as an organisation in today's modern world. Money.

Thanks.

I guess its the idea of it being a church that does not act like a church that I find odd.

All churches need money, but they do just fine with voluntary donations and nobody is left out due to their income. The key is the member and believers are not billed, they gladly send in money and help pay for those who can't. Without that, for me it's not a church.

We all have equal value whether rich or poor and I question any idea that those with money deserve better unless it is just a for profit operation to create jobs and salaries.

I remain neutral, other than this idea Scientology is a church.

If they are still using negative feedback I'll always be against that method. I have that issue also.

I'm truly happy to hear it's helping you though.

originally posted by: angeldoll
a reply to: Blaine91555

My problem is the secrecy first, since secrets always mean things are hidden. What is being hidden? Why does it need hidden?

I think they are afraid of being laughed at.

That's not right

What a person believes should never be laughed at. It's just wrong on so many levels.

If it helps people and it's their cup of tea, then it's a good thing for them.

a reply to: berenike

That's more what I'd gathered from reading. Thanks, that gives me a good idea.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Thetan



The best expose film about what goes on there is a movie titled Going Clear.

Religions aren't as evil as some countries, Scientology isn't bombing countries back to the stone age. The only control man made religion has over people is the power their members give to it.

All they have to do is walk away…

Going Clear

Yep...they just need to walk away! And get harassed non stop by the scum over at scientology. Are they evil? Yep.

a reply to: 3danimator2014

Yep...they just need to walk away! And get harassed non stop by the scum over at scientology. Are they evil? Yep.

Religions aren't evil, dinkums. They're clubs. Name a religion that builds nuclear weapons, ICBMs, aircraft carriers, tanks bombers.

Get your head straight.

a reply to: intrptr

building any of the technology you list is NOT evil - they can all me used in acts of evil - but i digress

as for religions - as i have stated previously - religious wingnuts preform acts of evil at the drp of a hat - and groups of them do it faster - and they all justify thier actions by refference to the dogmas of thier cult