Does the Sun Revolve Around the Earth, or does the Earth Revolve Around the Sun?

a reply to: pikestaff

You are talking about Eratosthenes. Flat earth theorist have explanations for the ships mast and such. They use the same argument about curvature to support their own theories. They have done test with lasers miles apart and say that it is proof because with the curvature there should be no way for them to connect with the target. They show island chains where you can see islands 60 miles away but according to them the curvature would prevent this.

People stopped questioning the flat earth after the "Columbus/Magellan" era of circumnavigation but FE model also explains circumnavigation as being nothing but a circle on the flat earth.

a reply to: Soylent Green Is People

Well i'll be damned lol.

originally posted by: SynchronousSnake
a reply to: Arbitrageur

IMO Voyager is overpriced for what we got

The primary mission was the exploration of Jupiter and Saturn.Source

With that said this is a pic of Saturn from Voyager whilst on the mission
voyager.jpl.nasa.gov...

Here is a Pic from a amateur with what he sees with a telescope

www.skyandtelescope.com...

WTF?

Also that's supposed to be 1.2 billion kilometers away from us...

Data from Voyager is what was used to determine that Europa probably had an ocean under its crust. Voyager 1 was used to first determine the gasses in Titan's atmosphere. The best and clearest images of Uranus and Neptune are (by far) the images taken by Voyager 2. Voyager 2 also has taken the only detailed images of the moons of Uranus and Neptune.

a reply to: Soylent Green Is People

That advances the human cause how?

a reply to: Soylent Green Is People

Yeah.. I'm gonna agree with NihilistSanta and what you've posted only side steps what I was presenting which was the scale issue.. the best pic from voyager is up to par with what any layman can achieve with a ground based telescope. You don't see a problem with that?

I'll present to you this then

blogs.discovermagazine.com...

that is the best pic we can get from the ground of the iss.. does anyone not see which one of these things just does not add up?

originally posted by: NihilistSanta
a reply to: Soylent Green Is People

That advances the human cause how?

Define "human cause".

just saw this thread....wow....8 pages so far discussing something that is a known fact...

originally posted by: jimmyx
just saw this thread....wow....8 pages so far discussing something that is a known fact...

Have You really asked Yourself what is known fact lately? There's scientists that believe we are in a simulation and others that We live in a quantum multiverse and there's "countless unseen dimensions " others that say the universe is flat and the planets and stuff can bend it like fabric ....and still other theories that state it's curved.. and countless other untestable unproven theories about existence. known fact.. yeah I guess that's a logical question.. just what the f does anyone really know. only what we are told.which breaks down to most critical thinking and real application to the real world we live in.

Have You researched all the data? done the actual equation for the curvature of the earth and drove the required distance to see significant curvature?(which according to the math is small but you wont observer it ever irl)

a reply to: NihilistSanta

Now remember I don't believe in the theory so my defense is merely that we should not throw out its observations because of some preconceived notions.

You chose to defend FE 'theory' (FET) as possible. Our view of Polaris is not some preconceived notion. It's a nail in the coffin of FET.

You need to understand this:

If you stand at Earth's north pole, Polaris is directly above you. If you stand at the equator, Polaris is on the horizon. If you are at a location between the north pole and the equator, Polaris occupies an intermediate position above the horizon. In other words, Polaris is a useful marker to help you determine where north is, and at what latitude you are located. Your latitudinal position is equal to the elevation above the horizon. At the north pole (90 degrees latitude ) Polaris is overhead at an altitude of 90 degrees. At the equator (zero degrees latitude) Polaris is at an altitude of zero degrees. The same is true for any location on Earth. For example, Cleveland, Ohio, is at a latitude of about 42 degrees north of the equator; Polaris can be observed at an altitude 42 degrees above the horizon

www.lpi.usra.edu...

45°lat is about 3100 or so miles from the North pole. Simple geometry tells you that would mean Polaris is only about 3100 miles above the FE, yet the closer to the equator you get the lower Polaris gets to the horizon. The Earth is not flat.

Observers from opposite sides of the Earth at the equator would have their telescopes aligned to each other while others would have to point their scopes higher and higher the further north they're located.

Dubay's nonsense does not address this.

a reply to: SynchronousSnake

Have You really asked Yourself what is known fact lately? There's scientists that believe we are in a simulation and others that We live in a quantum multiverse and there's "countless unseen dimensions " others that say the universe is flat and the planets and stuff can bend it like fabric ....and still other theories that state it's curved.. and countless other untestable unproven theories about existence

Hypotheses are just that.

known fact..

None of the above fits the bill.

Yeah I guess that's a logical question.. just what the f does anyone really know. only what we are told

You are free to reproduce any number of scientific experiments yourself. That you chose to not do so is your own prerogative.

which breaks down to most critical thinking and real application to the real world we live in.

Only if you chose to remain in scientific ignorance.

Have You researched all the data?

Have you? You would have the answer to your "what ifs" if you bothered to do so.

done the actual equation for the curvature of the earth and drove the required distance to see significant curvature?

A simple GoPro and a weather balloon is enough to definitively show this flat earth nonsense to be utterly false and ridiculous. Or, you know, looking at the horizon. There really is no excuse for such ignorance in this day and age.

a reply to: GetHyped

gtfo. gopro's have a fish eye lens

originally posted by: SynchronousSnake

originally posted by: jimmyx
just saw this thread....wow....8 pages so far discussing something that is a known fact...

Have You really asked Yourself what is known fact lately? There's scientists that believe we are in a simulation and others that We live in a quantum multiverse and there's "countless unseen dimensions " others that say the universe is flat and the planets and stuff can bend it like fabric ....and still other theories that state it's curved.. and countless other untestable unproven theories about existence. known fact.. yeah I guess that's a logical question.. just what the f does anyone really know. only what we are told.which breaks down to most critical thinking and real application to the real world we live in.

Have You researched all the data? done the actual equation for the curvature of the earth and drove the required distance to see significant curvature?(which according to the math is small but you wont observer it ever irl)

all the data?.......you mean from the 16th century when Nicolaus Copernicus discovered it using...quote.... "a fully predictive mathematical model of a heliocentric system" or from the 17th century when Sir Issac Newton used a telescope?
I'll take my true facts from those men, rather than some fringe science quacks around today

originally posted by: SynchronousSnake
a reply to: GetHyped

gtfo. gopro's have a fish eye lens

But you can see farther over the horizon the higher up you go. A ship that was invisible over the horizon will come into view as you go up in a balloon. Why would that happen on a flat Earth?

a reply to: SynchronousSnake

*groan*

Because fish eye lenses turn flat earths round, right? /s

Use another camera then and stop making excuses for your profound ignorance.

Are you fricken kidding me??? Really!!!???

originally posted by: Soylent Green Is People

originally posted by: SynchronousSnake
a reply to: GetHyped

gtfo. gopro's have a fish eye lens

But you can see farther over the horizon the higher up you go. A ship that was invisible over the horizon will come into view as you go up in a balloon. Why would that happen on a flat Earth?

Why?Gravity.. Has it not be proven that the closer to the source of gravity (earth in this case) that light bends? Every thing you see is dependent on seeing light. If it bends with gravity over distance this is what gives that effect.

Here is the thing. This is why I would defend FET although I don't believe in it personally. Almost everyone believes the earth to be spherical but only a tiny portion of people even know why. I laughed and scoffed first time I encountered the theory also but by actually taking my time and researching their claims I was able to know why I believe what I believe. I don't believe the theory as a whole but they make some interesting points about the dissemination of info from sources like NASA.

There is an interesting documentary I will add below called the Cosmonaut Cover up. The vid has nothing to do with FET but instead focuses on how the Russians had sent Vladimir Ilyushin before Yuri Gagarin. They were able to keep this hidden for a very long time. The vid chalks it up to the fact that communist propaganda would not allow for any failures. Essentially they had to make their followers believe everything they did was a success the first time. If they could keep that hidden there is really no idea what else we are lied to about.



I just think it is arrogant to assume that because someone plays with the idea of a flat earth that they are insane or somehow not intelligent. I think it to be the opposite in some regards and shows true skepticism.

Gravity has also been proven to have affects on the passage of time so therefore the supposed distance to the earth to the sun at 92.96 million miles is false as space has micro gravity the light would only slow down when entering the earths area of gravity influence .

the statement the sunlight is also 8 minutes old would also be false as well. due to gravity having this affect on light and would prop up these insane distances of our solar system and pic's of planets for instance Saturn from a telescope at a alleged 1.2 billion kilometers on the ground but we can't get a good shot of the ISS with the same damn tech?

a reply to: NihilistSanta

Here is the thing. This is why I would defend FET although I don't believe in it personally. Almost everyone believes the earth to be spherical but only a tiny portion of people even know why.

That seems to be a bit of a backpedal from your earlier unwarranted and disparaging remarks:

originally posted by: NihilistSanta
a reply to: occrest

Good luck with this post. So many people are committed to the lie which they can in no way verify. They can regurgitate math equations they google and act like some sort of arm chair experts but they know as much as anyone tells them. I am not saying your theory is valid however the fact that you have the balls to question accepted (indoctrinated) reality is a big plus in my book.

originally posted by: NihilistSanta
a reply to: Arbitrageur

I don't think you guys understand the skepticism of people who believe in a flat earth or myself. All of the information comes from basically 3 international government agencies. No one can verify anything (please don't mention commercial telescopes it is an insult). What we the public are shown are grainy pictures of blurs and dots and a crap load of CGI renderings or composite images.

originally posted by: NihilistSanta
a reply to: DenyObfuscation


I find it funny that you poke fun at a model you yourself do not understand.

Are you laughing now? I don't need to understand a false model to know it's wrong. Maybe you see that now.

a reply to: DenyObfuscation

I commended that poster for their stance because it takes balls to question accepted reality. How is that a back peddle?

Your last comment is full of hubris. How do you know its wrong? You don't understand it (admittedly). Group think doesn't make someone intelligent. Regurgitating "facts" to pass test does not make you intelligent. Critical thinking gets such a bad rap on ATS and its always from the crowd that appeals the loudest to authority.