Florida church sends $1,000 collection notice to single mother because she didn’t tithe

a reply to: NthOther

Right whatever. I don't care about dragging this topic OT to settle this squabble. So about auditing this church, are you game yet? Or is this activity ok in your book still because Unions don't have to pay taxes?

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: AdmireTheDistance
... Kinda feel like we forgot something...

Oh yeah! Tunes!

In all seriousness though, we should never wonder why people despair of this place sometimes. This planet is totally rammed full of double standards and BS merchants.

That would be me in the back right..

The first time I heard of anything similar was there was a Synagogue in Montgomery Country Maryland (one of the richest counties in the US) when I lived there that had a buy in fee (12 thousand? IIRC?) and monthly dues like a country club.

The megachurch down the road where I live now, Baptist, wants to see pay stubs so they know exactly what to charge you for your 10%.

I sleep in on Sundays.

The reason I stopped going to church wasn't that I didn't enjoy church. I went to multiple churches actually. One was a children's church that picked up kids by bus every Sunday and was cool for a while.

Then my uncle invited me to his church. It was a Mega church. There were seats like a stadium but they did services I enjoyed on Saturday so I just kept going to two churches. Until... my uncle had signed an agreement with the church to "donate" 10% of his income. His payment was never in question until his divorce went through so after child support and the like his income decreased.

The church threatened to sue him! Their excuse was that they make their obligations based on the members obligations to them. I was a teeny bopper, but even then I was so offended. To me the church was basically saying they were more important than my cousin! I never willingly went back.

He attended that church for many years after. His response to me was that he wished I wasn't aware of what happened. It seems odd to me I cared about it more than he did. But I don't do church anymore and, my kids know why I feel this way.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

As an ex-catholic, I'm not used to the 10% tithe amount either. Like you said, they'd just hand the plate around and you'd toss a buck or so into the plate and that was that.

As another former Catholic our church used to distribute numbered envelopes for the donation plate, if your envelope was not in there (with something in there) you got a talking to by the priest.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic
This is that gray area BH. Tithing was part of the law, which Christians technically are not beholden to. The new testament does not teach tithing. It teaches giving. Yet the leadership wants that tithe money, so they blur the lines, and pervert things to get it.

originally posted by: Spider879

originally posted by: KnightFire

originally posted by: AdmireTheDistance

originally posted by: NthOther
What's the IRS gonna do?

Revoke their tax-exempt status, for one...

Nothing for a variety of reasons in this case. For one, they will find some loop hole. Second is, the pastor and devoted members will start yelling racism and that they are being targeted, then Al Sharpen will get involved and all hell will break loose. Next the New Black Panthers will put bounties on the IRS agent's head because you know he/she will be white and then Obama in his un-greatness wisdom whom is a Muslim and not a Baptist will give some asinine speech about how the church is right in their ways and shouldn't be bothered. But of course, if it was a white pastor with a majority of white members, they would be paying a tons of fines, and never hit the news or the attention of the president. Nor will they riot in the streets and burn down their town.

The society we live in sucks and we all just have to deal with it.

??????

AWESOME how you are getting stars because you didn't understand what I was saying. Look at the race divide in the United States and you will get it.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: Klassified

One thing you can never trust worth a damn in this world.

A holy man with out dirt under his nails, and holes in his clothes.

I've known a few of those too. Good men.

You're right. lol.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

So about auditing this church, are you game yet?

Sigh.

Why? What evidence is there that they've broken the law?

None. You just want the IRS to harass them because they're a church and you don't like them.

I don't like them either. But I'm not going to use their religiosity as an excuse to target them.

Again, what evidence is there that they've broken the law? They sent a membership delinquency statement out.

So what? Or is it the plan now to use the IRS to target religious groups in some kind of reverse witch hunt?

originally posted by: NthOther

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

So about auditing this church, are you game yet?

Sigh.

Why? What evidence is there that they've broken the law?

None. You just want the IRS to harass them because they're a church and you don't like them.

I don't like them either. But I'm not going to use their religiosity as an excuse to target them.

Again, what evidence is there that they've broken the law? They sent a membership delinquency statement out.

So what? Or is it the plan now to use the IRS to target religious groups in some kind of reverse witch hunt?

How is it you are failing to see, the leadership of this church is scamming and coercing its congregants? What they're doing goes against the very tenets they claim to stand for as Christian leaders. They're corrupt, and they should be removed. If it takes another corrupt organization, like the IRS, to do it. Then so be it.

originally posted by: NthOther

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

So about auditing this church, are you game yet?

Sigh.

Why? What evidence is there that they've broken the law?

None. You just want the IRS to harass them because they're a church and you don't like them.

I don't like them either. But I'm not going to use their religiosity as an excuse to target them.

Again, what evidence is there that they've broken the law? They sent a membership delinquency statement out.

So what? Or is it the plan now to use the IRS to target religious groups in some kind of reverse witch hunt?

I can't see any law violations in the note either, I'd say the lady should just find another church.

originally posted by: Klassified

How is it you are failing to see that the leadership of this church is scamming and coercing its congregants? What they're doing goes against the very tenets they claim Christianity stands for.

I've said about five times now I don't agree with what they're doing.

Jesus Christ.

But if someone could please show me which law they may have broken to justify an IRS audit, I'm all ears.

Until then, you're just discriminating against a religious group.

You stalwarts of social tolerance, you.

a reply to: NavyDoc
I would think coercion would be a violation of their tax exempt status. Especially if they don't notify members upfront what it costs to attend, or be a member of their club church.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: dawnstar

How can you bill someone for something they didn't sign a contract saying they'd pay? Plus donations, by their nature, aren't supposed to be mandatory.

Did she actually join the church?

My parents started a church in the 70's they were under an association of their denomination, sort of like a chapter. Their are strict by-laws for membership. Tithing is one, for voting privileges and other things.

I was only five at the time, but later, I read the entire thing.
Needless to say, I haven't stepped foot in a church in a very very long time.

originally posted by: KnightFire

originally posted by: Spider879

originally posted by: KnightFire

originally posted by: AdmireTheDistance

originally posted by: NthOther
What's the IRS gonna do?

Revoke their tax-exempt status, for one...

Nothing for a variety of reasons in this case. For one, they will find some loop hole. Second is, the pastor and devoted members will start yelling racism and that they are being targeted, then Al Sharpen will get involved and all hell will break loose. Next the New Black Panthers will put bounties on the IRS agent's head because you know he/she will be white and then Obama in his un-greatness wisdom whom is a Muslim and not a Baptist will give some asinine speech about how the church is right in their ways and shouldn't be bothered. But of course, if it was a white pastor with a majority of white members, they would be paying a tons of fines, and never hit the news or the attention of the president. Nor will they riot in the streets and burn down their town.

The society we live in sucks and we all just have to deal with it.

??????

AWESOME how you are getting stars because you didn't understand what I was saying. Look at the race divide in the United States and you will get it.

I read and I am usually good at reading comprehension , if I didn't get it like a lot of folks apparently didn't, then maybe what you wrote is simply incomprehensible.

originally posted by: NthOther

originally posted by: Klassified

How is it you are failing to see that the leadership of this church is scamming and coercing its congregants? What they're doing goes against the very tenets they claim Christianity stands for.

I've said about five times now I don't agree with what they're doing.

Jesus Christ.

But if someone could please show me which law they may have broken to justify an IRS audit, I'm all ears.

Until then, you're just discriminating against a religious group.

You stalwarts of social tolerance, you.

One law they're possibly breaking was posted on page 2. I guess you conveniently missed it?
www.abovetopsecret.com...

originally posted by: Klassified

One law they're possibly breaking was posted on page 2. I guess you conveniently missed it?
www.abovetopsecret.com...

That's a bit of a stretch, if you ask me. Grasping at legal straws, even.

But then, I'm not an attorney.

Are you?

a reply to: Krazysh0t
you're thinking legal, I am thinking religion.
think it's wrong on both really. but, well what do I know...
am wondering though if this church isn't one that is caught up in the dominist gig. ya know where gee if you aren't affluent and wealthy well you are a sinner obviously and therefore deserve no voice or vote.

I love some quotes on their facebook page

Are these christians certain they're not really scientologists?

How many airplanes do this church have?? Wonder how many cars the pastor has??

I would like to invest in this church, it looks like a very sound business. What is the church's current share price, and its total market capitalization right now?
Are you traded on the NASDAQ? What dividend payout ratio can I expect?

Your not Christian by any means! Your greedy! How dare your require a fee to worship the Lord ! Your church is is total disgrace !!!

originally posted by: NthOther

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

So about auditing this church, are you game yet?

Sigh.

Why? What evidence is there that they've broken the law?

None. You just want the IRS to harass them because they're a church and you don't like them.

I don't like them either. But I'm not going to use their religiosity as an excuse to target them.

Again, what evidence is there that they've broken the law? They sent a membership delinquency statement out.

So what? Or is it the plan now to use the IRS to target religious groups in some kind of reverse witch hunt?

Well that is why you audit them. If nothing is out of order then they can go about their business. If they ARE breaking the law then that is when they get the book thrown at them. That's what audits are for, to check to see if there is any wrong doing taking place.

What you are doing is the equivalent of saying, "hey this broken window and missing cell phone isn't evidence that someone broke into your house, no need to call the police and have an investigation done."