Parents Share 5-Year-Old Son’s Transgender Journey

originally posted by: WarminIndy


XY = male

XX = female

How hard is that to grasp? So your liberalism trumps science while at the same time telling others that they are stupid if they don't agree with science?

YOU say it is normal for a 2 year-old kid to WANT to change their gender, because it satisfies the emotional needs of the parents?

Changing gender does not change DNA. DNA determines gender. Regardless of whether you like it or not, DNA determines male or female, not the overemotional, liberal kool aid drinking mom.

Now how many links shall we be forced to post about how DNA determines gender in Homo Sapien Sapien?

If DNA were the only factor in human development, I would say you have a rock-solid airtight point.

However, homo sapiens are thinking apes. Your post ignores psychology, which is a massive factor in human development, and which presently is poorly understood by science.

Also, if a child feels more masculine or feminine, that is a matter of their own emotional needs. It has nothing to do with the emotional needs of the parents. Even most parents who are accepting of transgender people, do not actively "want" or hope to have a transgendered child. Most parents wouldn't want their child to have to have that kind of life, and experience the kind of pain and hardship transgender people feel.

The one area I think we agree on, is that I'd question the mental health of any parent who actively wanted that kind of situation. I think we just disagree on whether or not many such people exist in reality. Don't confuse acceptance with desire.

originally posted by: Joneselius
Of course it's a new study, we have an inherently selfish society now, one that's obsessed with self. It wasn't and shouldn't be as big a subject as it is. Even trans-gender people don't make a big deal out of it, just the one's who want to be noticed do.

The acidic responses in this very thread prove beyond a doubt that is something that should be a big deal. Look at how transsexual/transgender people are viewed & treated -- like throw-aways, pariahs, mistakes, worthless broken people. Look at Cuervo's post. Cuervo spoke from a personal point of view, being someone living through this. Everyone ignored the post. No one wants to hear how it effects trans-folks, not even from them themselves. All people with this vitriolic attitude want is to be validated in their own twisted beliefs that support a personal narrative of second-class status to people whom they barely feel are worth the smack-talk in the first place.

It's a very big deal & you know it.

Wow such outrage.. who cares? Its fascinating. see how it plays out, you know.. for science.

a reply to: ladyinwaiting

:-)

Most people like to imagine that children are sexless because they think sex is bad, wrong, evil... (unless you're married of course)

Kids may not know anything about sex - but they're still sexual. It's innate

It's difficult to argue this stuff realistically when everyone assumes that children have no sexual feelings. It all comes together - attraction, desire, identity

All normal - none of it evil

a reply to: Annee

I wasn't actually confused I was basically thinking over and over again, as happens with OCD, about what it means to be gay and or bi-sexual and I confused myself doing it, a woman or trans-gender. I started thinking about it so much I thought I must be that way, then I started to avoid gay people and other men, scared that they'd see right through me. This is common with OCD, just like hiding knives and avoiding things.

These people was a poor use of words on my part and I apologise for that. I shouldn't separate trans-genders from myself, they are my friends after all, one is even called the same name as I am. He likes to rib me about it.

I don't 'say' I have OCD either, I'm medically diagnosed with it, severe OCD. There's not much help available, not that works anyhow.

a reply to: Nyiah

Why shouldn't I be acidic? You're not being called a liar and having your very character defamed, I am.

"Look at how transsexual/transgender people are viewed & treated -- like throw-aways, pariahs, mistakes, worthless broken people" so are the disabled and the psychologically deranged. People will always alienate anyone who is different and make them feel worthless. Always.

I had it too.

The first question is why share it at all?

At the age of five this is not a transgender journey unless the parents are trying to make it one. At the age of five its a kid playing dress up at the very most. Will children ever be able to just grow up without all the socio-political baggage from their parents or the liberal agenda? Cant we just let kids be kids and not make them deal with issues like transgender journeys until they are old enough to deal with them-of they choose to?

a reply to: Vroomfondel

Oh no, now you've started it all up again......

originally posted by: VoidHawk

. . . is the fact that children of two years old (when this all strarted?) have no real sense of self, they are an extention of the parent.

According to who?

So, for a two year old to be saying such things just goes to prove the idea came from the parent!

According to who?

a reply to: Joneselius

What do you mean doesn't 'seem' to be rational. Of course it's rational. How could it be anything other than rational.

You choose to ignore evidence and instead say that anything that doesn't fit your world view is first of all automatically liberal - which to you is also delusional

Knee jerk reaction based on what you choose to believe - about people you don't like

Did you watch those videos? Did you not notice how boyish the boy is - how girly the girl? The evidence is right in front of you. You think this is some kind of an act - delusion... as if that's the logical answer. Not a rational choice

From a post a bit later on, you say about your transgendered friends:

...they have a deep, unending sadness that turns into depression on regular intervals because, as they put it "I'm in the wrong head".

Do you understand what they're saying? Do you think they're delusional?

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
The first question is why share it at all?

At the age of five this is not a transgender journey unless the parents are trying to make it one. At the age of five its a kid playing dress up at the very most. Will children ever be able to just grow up without all the socio-political baggage from their parents or the liberal agenda? Cant we just let kids be kids and not make them deal with issues like transgender journeys until they are old enough to deal with them-of they choose to?

There are many websites that parents have created to share their journey with a child who is "different".

Do you object to those websites as well?

Do you ask them why they share their child's journey?

Here's one: My Vegan Child's Journey: veganpublishers.com...

Or, My Gifted Child's Journey: giftedkids.about.com...

originally posted by: Joneselius

I don't 'say' I have OCD either, I'm medically diagnosed with it, severe OCD. There's not much help available, not that works anyhow.

I wish you well and hope scientific studies discover what causes OCD and better ways of coping with it and other "behaviors". I've had Bi-polar experiences, which seem to be caused by blood sugar. I keep myself on a very strict diet.

Gender differences do seem to be more brain related then physical in other ways. It is a "newish" area of research, although it is not new.

See: Charley Parkhurst

Charley Darkey Parkhurst, born Charlotte Darkey Parkhurst (1812–1879),[1] also known as One Eyed Charley or Six-Horse Charley, was an American stagecoach driver, farmer and rancher in California. Born and reared as a girl in New England, mostly in an orphanage, Parkhurst ran away as a youth, taking the name Charley and living as a male. He started work as a stable hand and learned to handle horses, including to drive coaches drawn by multiple horses. He worked in Massachusetts and Rhode Island, traveling to Georgia for associated work. In his late 30s, Parkhurst sailed to California following the Gold Rush in 1849; there he became a noted stagecoach driver. In 1868, he may have been the first female (though passing as a man) to vote in a presidential election in California.[2][1] At his death, it was discovered that he was female, as was the fact that he had given birth at an earlier time.[3]

en.m.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: Annee

Being vegan or gifted is a little different than an issue as personal as sexual identity. For that matter, I don't need to know if you are vegan either. Why do certain groups feel they have to tell everyone they meet they belong to that group? Do they really think everyone is that curious about them?

And I stand by my assessment. At the age of five this is not a transgender journey issue unless the parents want it to be. The fact that they also chose to publicize it says it all.

a reply to: Joneselius

Eep...didn't mean to do that...move along. Go back to what you were doing...

a reply to: Vroomfondel

There are a few videos some of us posted, watch them and then comment please.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: VoidHawk

. . . is the fact that children of two years old (when this all strarted?) have no real sense of self, they are an extention of the parent.

According to who?

So, for a two year old to be saying such things just goes to prove the idea came from the parent!

According to who?

Erik Erikson for one. He would put the "crisis of identity" in early to mid adolescence. That is, that children don't really begin to develop their sense of "self" fully until that age. Up to that point, all is in flux.

Developmentally a two year old (which is when this child began to express that she was a he) isn't even capable of theory of mind so I have my own doubts about a child that age (or five for that matter) having the capacity to fully understand gender identity and how it relates to their social schema.

However...

Youngsters actually begin developing strong gender identities long before middle childhood. A child's awareness of being a boy or a girl starts in the first year of life. It often begins by eight to ten months of age, when youngsters typ­ically discover their genitals. Then, between one and two years old, children become conscious of physical differences between boys and girls; before their third birthday they are easily able to label themselves as either a boy or a girl as they acquire a strong concept of self. By age four, children's gender identity is stable, and they know they will always be a boy or a girl.

Link

Sooo... I guess it depends upon which expert or panel of experts you want to go with. I do think this child is too young to be making this decision. I'm not sure exactly how I would handle the situation, it depends on the child, but I would certainly not be setting anything in stone at that age. I think the parents are being attentive, and responsive but I'm suspicious that there are some pretty intensive... I don't know... Histrionics going on for all, and I do mean all, involved.

originally posted by: redhorse

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: VoidHawk

. . . is the fact that children of two years old (when this all strarted?) have no real sense of self, they are an extention of the parent.

According to who?

So, for a two year old to be saying such things just goes to prove the idea came from the parent!

According to who?

Erik Erikson for one. He would put the "crisis of identity" in early to mid adolescence. That is, that children don't really begin to develop their sense of "self" fully until that age. Up to that point, all is in flux.

He died in 1992. At the age of 91.

A lot has happened since then in the areas of gender understanding.

originally posted by: redhorse

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: VoidHawk

. . . is the fact that children of two years old (when this all strarted?) have no real sense of self, they are an extention of the parent.

According to who?

So, for a two year old to be saying such things just goes to prove the idea came from the parent!

According to who?

Sooo... I guess it depends upon which expert or panel of experts you want to go with. I do think this child is too young to be making this decision. I'm not sure exactly how I would handle the situation, it depends on the child, but I would certainly not be setting anything in stone at that age. I think the parents are being attentive, and responsive but I'm suspicious that there are some pretty intensive... I don't know... Histrionics going on for all, and I do mean all, involved.

What decision is anyone making? Other then letting a child self-identify? Hey! I tracked down a "Brony" shirt for my 7 year old boy.

No drugs are used prior to puberty. Unless for other reasons.

If they have a good counselor who specializes in Gender, how does that hurt?

NOTE: I was trying to find a date on your article. It's really important on this issue that info is as current as you can find.

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: ladyinwaiting

:-)

Most people like to imagine that children are sexless because they think sex is bad, wrong, evil... (unless you're married of course)

Kids may not know anything about sex - but they're still sexual. It's innate

It's difficult to argue this stuff realistically when everyone assumes that children have no sexual feelings. It all comes together - attraction, desire, identity

All normal - none of it evil

You get that were talking about a now 5 year old that supposedly "started this journey" at 2 years old!

Your comments about toddlers being sexual is quite disturbing to me and very NAMBLA like. I guess that is the next civil rights cause?

I will admit, this thread has opened my eyes on just how sick our society in general has become.

originally posted by: Vroomfondel
a reply to: Annee

Being vegan or gifted is a little different than an issue as personal as sexual identity.

Why is it different? You objected to them telling their story in a public journal.

In reality, it's the subject you have issue with.