I want the TRUTH about Islam

a reply to: Expat888

Thats exactly why I made this thread, to learn, to expand my knowledge on a faith system I know nothing about. If there were a mosque nearby, I'd go talk to the Imam and learn why they believe in what they believe in, why such extremism exists and put the propaganda to bed as far as I am concerned. No offense taken brother

a reply to: HomerinNC

Well there are atrocities still being done in modern times by Christian fundamentalists, like bombing abortion clinics.

Come on please, you can't seriously equate the number of atrocities carried out by 'Christian fundamentalists' to anything similar to the scale and number of atrocities carried out by the plethora of Muslim extremist groups throughout the world.

But thats not what I'm asking about. Like I said, extremism can be found in all religions.

Of course it can....but on the same scale as it is found within Islam today?

What I'm talking about is a Muslim to tell me what he was taught, and why such propaganda is being said about his or her religion.

I understand that - it'd be interesting if any replied.

And I wouldn't have commented at all if it hadn't been in reply to something YOU had posted.
You raised the point about past Christian atrocities....I merely replied to you.

a reply to: Freeborn

An atrocity is an atrocity, its done in the name of a deity by extremists, by fundies. Lets not get into an e-peen contest about whose atrocities are worse. Its ALL BAD

a reply to: HomerinNC

Yes, I agree - an atrocity is an atrocity.

It is ALL BAD....but in the interests of honesty and accuracy I think its only fair and right to recognise and acknowledge that the number and scale of atrocities carried out by Islamic extremists at present far exceeds anything carried out by extremists of other religions.

That's not to say that I excuse or dismiss other atrocities; they are equally odious and barbaric just not as common and widespread - its a point that needs to be accepted, by all, if open and frank discussion is to be entered into.

a reply to: HomerinNC

Always good to learn .. and great idea on the post .. glad to hear didnt offend ..
will be in malaysia next week to tend to a few matters there .. will ask some of the malay friends if one can come help answer your questions .. wrote down in my notebook so I dont forget .. they explained alot to me about Islam and had many interesting conversations with with them ..

a reply to: Freeborn

Especially atrocities within their own people.

Muslims living with Hindus - problem
Muslims living with Buddhist - problem
Muslims living with Christians - problem
Muslims living with Catholics - problem
Muslims living with Jews - problem
Muslims living with Atheist - problem
Muslims Sunnis living with Muslims Shiites - BIG PROBLEM

How many enemies can this religion have.

If they can't live together than how can they integrate in the western world with other religions and people.

originally posted by: HomerinNC
What I'm looking for is a Muslim to tell me what THEY know about their religion

I am not a Muslim, but from what I can gather in the world today the denomination is also a decision to make. After all, it is Muslims who are killing Muslims for doctrinal reasons e.g. Sunni versus Shia. A visit to a local mosque would be helpful, although careful that Imans propagate different interpretations, inclusding those who hold views that could be unsavoury.

originally posted by: HomerinNC
Look at the atrocities done in the past in the name of Jesus.

To be balanced with history is always a good thing. The Muslims often cite the Crusades where the Christians attempted to take the Holy Lands, but it was Muslims who expanded through conquest. Whereas there has been historical atrocities by both religions, it must be recognised that Islam was not spread peacefully.

Today, regrettably, the crimes in the name of Muhammad far exceed any done in the name of Jesus.

Regards

quadruple post

double post...somehow.

Islam is the Religion of the 'Brother in Law' who justifies his ancestors poor decisions.

it only becomes a problem when a man decides that he has a problem with another man 'banging his sister and taking control of her wealth.

but that's just an estimate from a certain point of view. perhaps there are other elements of the religion that aren't of any particular importance to me, but in general its a religion that defines itself first and foremost relative to another system that is not subject to it and responds with hostility to it.

just remember to leave your sisters and expect the same from your wife's brothers and there won't be any problems...otherwise there will be nothing but problems.

triple post

a reply to: HomerinNC

Hi there, if you are interested, try searching for Zakir Naik in Youtube. A lot of videos of him answering/debating questions from both muslims and non-muslim. I am using my tablet at my office lol..i'll try and help if i get back home soon!

Aside from zakir naik, search for yusuf estes and ahmad deedat.

a reply to: HomerinNC

I am an ex-Muslim. I no longer hold hold the beliefs of the religion, but I can help answer questions you may have about Islam.

Islamic theology is fundamentally comprised of the Qur'an and life-example of Muhammad. The core beliefs of the religion are summarized by the "5 Pillars" and "7 Articles of Faith."

5 Pillars of Islam

1. Iman, Shahadah: Belief/Faith in Islam. Declaring that there is no god except Allah, and Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah.

2. Salat: Five daily prayers.

3. Zakat: Charity and alms-giving.

4. Sawm: Fasting during the month of Ramadan.

5. Hajj: Pilgrimage to Mecca at least once in a lifetime, if one is able.

7 Articles of Faith

1. Belief in Allah

2. Belief in the books of Allah

3. Belief in the angels of Allah

4. Belief in prophets of Allah

5. Belief in the Day of Resurrection

6. Belief in the Day of Judgement

7. Belief in Predestination

• Qur'an
The Qur'an is the central Holy Book of Islam. It can be easily read in 30 days by following the 30 Juz (30 Sections).

• Sealed Nectar (Ar-Raheeq-ul-Makhtum)
This is a quintessential biography of Muhammad. During the first "Islamic Conference on Seerah (Biography)," this book was ranked as number 1 by the "Muslim World League."

• Sahih al-Bukhari
This is considered the preeminent collection of Hadith; Sayings, actions, examples, and teachings of Muhammad.

• Sahih Muslim
This distinguished Hadith collection is second to only Sahih al-Bukhari.

"Muhammad taking a 9 year old girl for his wife"

A'ishah bint Abi-Bakr (Aisha, daughter of Abu Bakr) was betrothed to Muhammad between the age of 6-9, and moved-in with Muhammad who consummated the marriage when she was between the age of 9-12. The age of A'ishah is debatable even amongst Muslims, but the majority consensus says the engagement happened at the age of 6, while the consummation occurred at the age of 9.

"rules in the Quaran about how to beat slaves, wifes"

You might find this thread interesting:
Becoming Muslim: I Did Not Read The Fine Print

Islam does not allow one to beat a slave, however, a man is permitted to beat his wife if she is disobedient.

Islam does indeed ordain slavery. Islam gives basic human rights to slaves and actually prohibits the abuse, torture, and mutilation of slaves. However, Allah made lawful the consensual or non-consensual (rape) sex of male slave masters with their female slaves.

Islam sugar-coats the issue of slavery by saying things like it is ok to keep slaves but freeing slaves is better,... treat slaves with kindness,... or saying that the freeing of slaves can grant forgiveness of sins,... etc. Regardless, Islam never abolished slavery.

"how it tells to 'kill infidels'"

You may find this thread interesting:
Islam's Lie: "There Is No Compulsion In Religion" (2:256)

In the early Meccan period of Islam, Muhammad preached peace, non-violence, tolerance, and freedom of belief.

In the Medinan period, Muhammad practiced preemptive caravan robberies and preemptive military attacks. Muhammad's army never had to fight on the defensive home-front, but was always on the offensive. Muhammad waged all-out war and beheaded military prisoners of war who refused to convert to Islam. Muhammad's army massacred men, enslaved women and children, and expelled populations from many villages and towns.

Muhammad continued aggressive and preemptive military campaigns all the way up until his death. His immediate successors continued to wage war in an effort to spread Islam and widen the territory of the Islamic Empire. Islam was only the "Religion of Peace" during the early Meccan period.

a reply to: Sahabi

Can the Meccan period be revived or do we have to kill them all?
Mind you ,I'M NOT for killing innocent hostages but if THEY will continue to press the attack then...sorry.

a reply to: HomerinNC

imho, it started as religion of peace
i believe the real prophet was not a pedophilia.
maybe his teachings was pure but unfortunately, the tribe leaders or imams (or maybe tptb of the era) who possessed 'psychopatic' personality, altered the teachings for their own benefits.
you can see that hadits are full of non sense and barbaric.

so the evolution of islam was just like how roman empire altered the original christianity by adding extra scriptures like OT to confuse the followers (and to exercise their authority over the world, which was possible with their esoteric knowledge of the scriptures itself)

pure islam would be sufism, imho.

peace

Everyone ty for the info, its odd how everyone flips out about Muhammad taking a 9 year old wife, yet we read about how the Egyptian Pharaohs would be betrothed to infants then marry them when they turned 9 years or older, or their sisters, and noone bats an eye.

a reply to: HomerinNC

Maybe that's because no-one today is trying to use the life and words of the Egyptian Pharaoh's to justify barbaric and terrorist acts etc.

I don't see extremist followers of the the Pharaoh's beheading people or trying to impose their beliefs on others.

Yes, it happened back then - and that's where it belongs, in ancient history books.

a reply to: Expat888

This, One of the greatest men i've ever known was muslim. I wanted to be just like him, very peaceful, hard working, and wise and stood up for what he believed in like a man and he would always tell me , "when you're doubting yourself or need help. Always trust in the almighty allah".

originally posted by: Sahabi
a reply to: HomerinNC

I am an ex-Muslim. I no longer hold hold the beliefs of the religion, but I can help answer questions you may have about Islam.

Islamic theology is fundamentally comprised of the Qur'an and life-example of Muhammad. The core beliefs of the religion are summarized by the "5 Pillars" and "7 Articles of Faith."

5 Pillars of Islam

1. Iman, Shahadah: Belief/Faith in Islam. Declaring that there is no god except Allah, and Muhammad is the Messenger of Allah.

2. Salat: Five daily prayers.

3. Zakat: Charity and alms-giving.

4. Sawm: Fasting during the month of Ramadan.

5. Hajj: Pilgrimage to Mecca at least once in a lifetime, if one is able.

7 Articles of Faith

1. Belief in Allah

2. Belief in the books of Allah

3. Belief in the angels of Allah

4. Belief in prophets of Allah

5. Belief in the Day of Resurrection

6. Belief in the Day of Judgement

7. Belief in Predestination

• Qur'an
The Qur'an is the central Holy Book of Islam. It can be easily read in 30 days by following the 30 Juz (30 Sections).

• Sealed Nectar (Ar-Raheeq-ul-Makhtum)
This is a quintessential biography of Muhammad. During the first "Islamic Conference on Seerah (Biography)," this book was ranked as number 1 by the "Muslim World League."

• Sahih al-Bukhari
This is considered the preeminent collection of Hadith; Sayings, actions, examples, and teachings of Muhammad.

• Sahih Muslim
This distinguished Hadith collection is second to only Sahih al-Bukhari.

 

 

"Muhammad taking a 9 year old girl for his wife"

A'ishah bint Abi-Bakr (Aisha, daughter of Abu Bakr) was betrothed to Muhammad between the age of 6-9, and moved-in with Muhammad who consummated the marriage when she was between the age of 9-12. The age of A'ishah is debatable even amongst Muslims, but the majority consensus says the engagement happened at the age of 6, while the consummation occurred at the age of 9.

 

"rules in the Quaran about how to beat slaves, wifes"

You might find this thread interesting:
Becoming Muslim: I Did Not Read The Fine Print

Islam does not allow one to beat a slave, however, a man is permitted to beat his wife if she is disobedient.

Islam does indeed ordain slavery. Islam gives basic human rights to slaves and actually prohibits the abuse, torture, and mutilation of slaves. However, Allah made lawful the consensual or non-consensual (rape) sex of male slave masters with their female slaves.

Islam sugar-coats the issue of slavery by saying things like it is ok to keep slaves but freeing slaves is better,... treat slaves with kindness,... or saying that the freeing of slaves can grant forgiveness of sins,... etc. Regardless, Islam never abolished slavery.

 

"how it tells to 'kill infidels'"

You may find this thread interesting:
Islam's Lie: "There Is No Compulsion In Religion" (2:256)

In the early Meccan period of Islam, Muhammad preached peace, non-violence, tolerance, and freedom of belief.

In the Medinan period, Muhammad practiced preemptive caravan robberies and preemptive military attacks. Muhammad's army never had to fight on the defensive home-front, but was always on the offensive. Muhammad waged all-out war and beheaded military prisoners of war who refused to convert to Islam. Muhammad's army massacred men, enslaved women and children, and expelled populations from many villages and towns.

Muhammad continued aggressive and preemptive military campaigns all the way up until his death. His immediate successors continued to wage war in an effort to spread Islam and widen the territory of the Islamic Empire. Islam was only the "Religion of Peace" during the early Meccan period.

interesting, awaiting some angry muslim refutations.

you must be young.

You learn as you get older that it's not so important what people spew out as utopian doctrines or platitudes; but what they do.

Sharia law is what the Muslim extremists want. Subjugation of women and for that matter, all humans. Problem is - is that moderate Muslims can not and will not fight against Sharia law if it gets enacted.