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posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:15 AM
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a reply to: Iamschist

Ok, what happens when they ban a member that contributed quite a bit?

Do our donations save us.....or are we # out of luck?

How does "family" factor in then?
edit on 12/20/2014 by sheepslayer247 because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:17 AM
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a reply to: sheepslayer247

i think you will find that members donating are not donating to a business venture they are donating because they want to.....

no member that donates stands to profit from their donation ....call it a labor of love for something they love and if the business can benefit from these donations awesome and if they can turn it into a profit in the future ...good for them...

for me personally i live day to day and i donated (granted a small amount)because i wanted to....no one is forcing you to donate if you do not want to
edit on 20-12-2014 by hopenotfeariswhatweneed because: redacted



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:22 AM
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I think that its fair to say that those that agree and do not agree, should have the same respect given to them as those that either have the funds or are struggling to get them in this "endeavor" how can so many of you shout out good standing members on speaking their minds, especially those that have contributed with content, even if they question where, when, or how this is going?



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:23 AM
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originally posted by: TrueAmerican
a reply to: sheepslayer247

This transcends business sense. This goes back to long before you were here, and even longer before I was here. And that is a long damn time. I guess you're just never going to get it. You're just never going to trust and give them a chance. You're just going to whine. Ok Sheep, whine. If that makes you feel good. But you are upsetting this effort. And that's not good for the rest of us that would like for ATS to continue, in whatever form. I suggest you kindly bow out of this thread please. When you can do no more good, it's time to go.


Ok, I'll bow out.

How dare I call things how it is?

Deny ignorance?.........why don't you just pay for it?



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:25 AM
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a reply to: TrueAmerican

If a member of a forum has a question about a practice, shouldn't they have the right to question it? Or is questioning things not allowed if those questions or views don't agree with others?

It's called discourse and Sheepslayer's observations are good ones actually.

Since this has been, I presume, a for-profit venture, then a good one to ask, especially for those thinking about donating larger sums, is whether or not it is even tax deductible in that light. Now that might not matter to someone who donates $10 but it very well might to someone considering doing the $2500 maximum donation.

I'm pretty darn sure that, if Above Network, LLC, is in fact a for-profit business, any contributions to the site would not be deductible on one's income tax. That matters, doesn't it?



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:31 AM
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a reply to: sheepslayer247

If ATS does make it, and finds a way, because we have shown them that we will go to great lengths to help keep it as a membership, are you at that point STILL going to whine? No, you're going to be right back here posting like you always have. I want you to remember that, man. No, better yet, how about just coughing up a measily ten bucks, and relaxing?

K? Chance for truce. Just think about it. We heard your points. We get it. And we still want to help. Even if you're right.
edit on Sat Dec 20th 2014 by TrueAmerican because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:31 AM
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The true sign of this whole situation will become clear based on the agreement AND disagreement about the situation, how those members are treated and what is said, many times those that question authority can bring about truth more than those that conform.



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:33 AM
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a reply to: sheepslayer247

Banning is not something I have an opinion about, I know very little about the process, only what I have been told. ATS warns and tries to work with someone before banning them, they only ban in extremis. I don't think you can buy Springer or SO, at all, ever. I don't care who you are, if you screw up, you get banned. It was made clear at the beginning of this whole asking us for money thing, that money is not gonna buy you happiness on here. I believe them.

Family is my subjective feeling. It has no relevance except to me. If I mess up, I will get kicked, no matter who I love, or who loves me.



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:35 AM
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a reply to: TrueAmerican

Even IF I'm right?

All due respect my friend, and I consider you my friend, we must stand on principle.



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:36 AM
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a reply to: Iamschist

So what you are saying is that if I were to post something that might make the site uncomfortable simply to ask a question about it in relation to this thread, you'd think that that would fly?



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:36 AM
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a reply to: sheepslayer247

Hiya Sheep


I've donated to wikipedia, RadioLab and ATS this past week. It's not something I make a habit of, but I value the sites and get a lot out of them.

With ATS, I'm held to the T&Cs like the rest of us. I won't get a special Xmas card off Springer and SO and neither will I be entitled to bust up the T&Cs. Same with RadioLab, they'll appreciate the donation and that's my input all done. I'd miss that show if it wasn't here and the sum total of what little knowledge I have would lose some lustre. That's what ATS has done for me too.



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:38 AM
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originally posted by: Iamschist
a reply to: sheepslayer247

Banning is not something I have an opinion about, I know very little about the process, only what I have been told. ATS warns and tries to work with someone before banning them, they only ban in extremis. I don't think you can buy Springer or SO, at all, ever. I don't care who you are, if you screw up, you get banned. It was made clear at the beginning of this whole asking us for money thing, that money is not gonna buy you happiness on here. I believe them.

Family is my subjective feeling. It has no relevance except to me. If I mess up, I will get kicked, no matter who I love, or who loves me.


I know for a fact that you can be banned for any reason whatsoever and sometimes it has nothing to do with T&C's.

How would you approach any issue knowing such a thing?

Don't think for a second that politics and emotion do not drive the decisions made around here.



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:40 AM
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a reply to: WhiteAlice

I cannot speak for the Mods or Admin. I believe they cannot be bought. I know for a fact they can be criticized. I know for a fact they do listen. Ask your questions. I haven't seen anyone banned from this thread or any of the others discussing this issue, and I have read them all.



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:41 AM
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originally posted by: Kandinsky
a reply to: sheepslayer247

Hiya Sheep


I've donated to wikipedia, RadioLab and ATS this past week. It's not something I make a habit of, but I value the sites and get a lot out of them.

With ATS, I'm held to the T&Cs like the rest of us. I won't get a special Xmas card off Springer and SO and neither will I be entitled to bust up the T&Cs. Same with RadioLab, they'll appreciate the donation and that's my input all done. I'd miss that show if it wasn't here and the sum total of what little knowledge I have would lose some lustre. That's what ATS has done for me too.





Much respect.

I do, have done, the same.



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:47 AM
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I think that this is I think most "associations" in a sense are not privy or in the know of other things. I have been in secret societies threads (NOT SAYING THIS IS LIKE THAT) and heard people say, I am in that group, that never happens, well it does, your just not in that group.

This is not and cannot be on a mod or member level, this is "top level" only, banning, whether permanent or post is something that again is outside the realm of regular folks (members) we (those that are familiar the site) have learned as we all do in life, that as long as you follow the rules, when things happen they are for a reason.

So you know what we do? We dont question, as it only makes sense that their answered would be vindicated. Well this is one of those times that what we have learned FROM ATS, should be APPLIED to ATS, this can calm all fears, and concerns.



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 02:58 AM
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a reply to: sheepslayer247

Good man


I don't know if you trust me or not. However, I'd like to say that in 2 years of modding, I haven't seen any members getting banned without reasons. I've seen several come back and say they were summarily kicked. One of them was a favourite member of mine who I advocated strongly for. They hit FB with a series of claims and I couldn't relate to their dishonesty.

Over the years, several of my all-time favourites have gotten banned and I miss them frequently. Despite that, they genuinely made lifting Post Bans impossible. I've worked through dozens of post-bans with probably a 99% success rate of lifting them. It takes real effort to not get a post-ban lifted. Someone could donate $10000 and it wouldn't add any caveats to the T&Cs.

I've probably said too much and can't say any more than that. Merry Christmas SS


a reply to: NoRegretsEver

Hiya NRE, hopefully the above reassures you. I'd like to say 'Merry Christmas' to you too and thanks for some of your threads over the years. Funnily enough, I'm thinking it might have been you that got me hooked on RadioLab...a gift indeed!

edit on 12.20.2014 by Kandinsky because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 03:34 AM
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I just want to say that I am upset with this. I have issues. I had issues before this crisis emerged, but that's beside the point.

Sheepslayer may verbalize them more eloquently, but the fact remains.

Donate, don't donate.

I separate donate from invest.

Every member here already donates their thoughts, opinions on any given subject.

But to invest requires a return. I'm actually one of the few that used to get paid. granted, it was different website(s) but that is where quality over comes quantity.

This may be my last post on ATS. If that is the case, then fine. I wish everyone nothing but the best. God-speed and best wishes for any and every endeavor.

Personally, I think this issue has gotten out of hand. But that's just me.

I wish nothing but the best for everyone and will wish a very Merry Christmas to everyone.



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 03:50 AM
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originally posted by: beezzer
Donate, don't donate.


That's just it. It's as simple as that.

Why are people getting so worked up about something so simple?



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 04:07 AM
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a reply to: beezzer

I usually limit donations to decent charities or those that are local and resonate on some level. This is the first time I've gone about donating to websites and the next one will be archive.org because they're archiving valuable information. Their philosophy is something I admire.

I fully understand that ATS seeks profits which makes it different to the other sites I've donated to. I get that the donation is only a donation and not a contract promising dividends. Any of us who've pitched in have done so willingly and in full knowledge that we won't get our money back.

ATS is a business for the bosses and, for me, it's a website I love to visit. Maybe that's the way most other members feel too? We come to read stuff, write stuff and bicker about even more stuff. The biggest return on my investment of time is the company of some fine characters.

Of course, your mileage may vary on these points and that's fine too. Merry Christmas all the same!

@Liveforever - Xmas greetings mate



posted on Dec, 20 2014 @ 04:14 AM
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I've always been of the mindset that ATS is entertainment. If it doesn't entertain you, then why come in the first place. If it does entertain you and you come back everyday for more then surely it has a value in your life. There's very few entertainment sources I use everyday like ATS so I have no problems donating to it. It's like I pay my tv license in the UK, because I consume a lot of bbc content, whether radio, news or tv and Internet It's generally high quality content so I don't mind paying for it. It's also advertisement free which is a massive bonus.
Just because I pay my TV license, I don't expect the bbc to show and play content only I enjoy or behave in a fashion only I expect.

Im surprised the amount of people who pay monthly subscriptions to services like Netflix and spotify, both services are over priced for the pretty poor content they provide.



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