Kristallnacht : A warning from history

originally posted by: kitzik
a reply to: daaskapital

You are negatively generalising Arabic Muslims.

It is you have no idea.

I have more of an idea than you.

The majority thinking that ISIS represents better society, because they forbade wine, drugs etc. And for the time being they often distributing wealth amongst poor people, calling everyone brother.

During the honeymoon periods, some may be accepting of ISIS. But it is after that first month when ISIS actually implements Shariah Law, that those with rose tinted glasses see what's actually happening. Many obviously do not fall for it in the first place.

And killing only infidels, which don't want just society. That is how average Syrian/Iraqi fellahi thinking.

ISIS condemns anyone against their words as 'infidels'. They kill Muslims and Christians alike. Stop speaking on behalf of an oppressed population.

Also they erased arbitrary border between Syria/Iraq - another plus. You don't understand arabic mentality, they don't value that much your so called "western freedom", they value Honour above all. And they think that ISIS, above all, returning them Honour, that they were deprived for so long.

You hate Muslims, yet you are trying to speak on behalf of them to form an argument.

How the hell do you know what they want? I'm sure you haven't lived under the iron grip of ISIS. I think it plausible that many dislike the lack of freedom allowed in territory under ISIS' command.

You are not Arabic, and you are trying to force your biased opinions onto them and their situation. You think that just because they are Arab, they don't enjoy having personal freedoms. You are a bigot who inherently hates Muslims.

originally posted by: [post=18467785]

Through propaganda, carefully placed words, outright lies and fear mongering a public was manipulated and people began to take their frustration out on the Jews. Immigration, financial corruption, religious beliefs and all manner of other issues/practices were cited. Lies were repeated until they became "truth". Eventually a whole society lost its collective conscience, dropped into a state of apathy and then the country turned into a cesspit of hate and people stood by as despicable things began to happen, and those things then snowballed into genocide.

I cannot speak for anyone else, and this is just my opinion, but Its because of beheadings and wholesale massacres of villagers in the middle east that I choose to hate isis and everything about them. I dont think the Jewish people of 1930s europe did these sort of things though I am not a historian.

Your comparison is apples to oranges in my mind.

a reply to: ArmyOfNobunaga

You missed the point of the OP...

a reply to: AntiDude

absolutely no fear of a muslim invasion from the Middle East.

When this caliphate will be the size of Russia you will fear.

I personally don't have issues with Islam, Judaism, Christianity or people who believe in the Great pumpkin. I do however have MAJOR issues with Extremists of ANY faith.

When Westboro's Baptist hate monger was spewing his garbage, Everyone I knew denounced their garbage, Hell, I read even the Ku Klux Klan *Of All people* staged protests to counter Westboro's demonstrations at military funerals etc.

Christians of many denominations pretty much told them to STFU, I'd like to see as big or bigger outcry by the larger Islamic community, By that I mean by average Muslim.


My two pennies tossed in.

PEACE

The way I see it Islam (and all religion/atheism) is more like a firearm - they were invented for a purpose, but how you use it is your call. Some people use firearms to kill people, some for happiness, some for fun. It is just as easily used as misused.

Religion isnt inherently bad, as its existed for as long as humanity (hundreds of thousands of years). A non-religious man who wants to kill someone will kill someone, and justify it in some other way.

Religion doesnt tell people to kill. If anyone actually reads the quran passages instead of repeating right wing websites, it only allows members to struggle against those oppressing them. And the same goes for judaism - even though their books justify mass genocide of canaanites and others most jews dont adhere to that. Christianity also doesnt accept the old testament as a valid moral compass.

So of course it begs the question - why then does modern violence occur in the name of religion? The end of this book "The New Great Game" says it precisely - its about "Angry Young Men" and the Kalashnikov Culture. Wealthy, happy people arent suicide bombing people. I wonder why.

The generations of misguided, lost, impoverished kids who have nothing to live for and nothing to believe in - they find solace in extremism. People who give them a purpose. Especially in places where there is no public education. Pakistani madrassas, saudi religious schools, if you replace these with real moderate education, you eliminate extremism at the core.

a reply to: SLAYER69

Moderate Muslims have publicly denounced ISIS. Scholars, religious leaders, established organisations and even the average Muslim have done so. Just because the media doesn't report on it, doesn't mean it never happened. Muslims, as everyone else, shouldn't have to stand up an condemn people everytime something happens. Such expectations are unrealistic.

Islam is in need of PR help, but Muslims of all colours have denounced the likes of ISIS. It is just a matter for the larger Muslim community to get their key messages out into the public more.

a reply to: TechniXcality

Exactly. We're not demonizing an ethnicity. In fact, anybody can be Muslim if they wish. We're at war against a very extreme and dangerous form of Sunni Islam that seems to be growing. This isn't a war against Arabs or Persians or Kurds, etc. It's a clash of ideology.

This form of extremism is completely unacceptable. It's not a freedom of religion exercise if you are oppressing other peoples and religions in that expression. Just like we have the freedom to keep and bear arms, but not use them in aggression against others.

To the OP: if you please, throw out your thinly veiled policitcal correctness. You can't lump me in with Nazis. I find that incredibly offensive and it shows that you have little knowledge of these subjects.

a reply to: daaskapital

So far I hear much more hate preaching, why ?

www.adelaidenow.com.au... /story-fni6uo1m-1226701605335?nk=c13658d3465e1e4b7112a4d518547053

Or this www.youtube.com...
This so called lawer want Armageddon, and he is moderate lol.

Just take your time and watch couple of MemriTV videos, they making pretty good PR lol

a reply to: daaskapital

ISIS?

I'm pretty darn sure they're not the only Islamic extremists spewing hateful rhetoric.


Just the most recent.

ETA: Never mind beheading

The comparison between the US and the Natzi's is right on target. I was born in 1957 in Tennessee and grew up there in the 60's and 70's. The changes to America in my life time are staggering. We have become an armed camp, through fear mongering and intimidation provided by the very Government that is suppose to protect and defend us. The very Government that is suppose to give us a shot at, "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."

After 9/11 the process of intimidation accelerated. They openly use Natzi terms like, "Homeland Security" and "Travel Papers". You person and your belonging are searched on daily bases and without due process, each time you travel or enter a public building. If go into my local city hall to pay my taxes, I have to be screened like at the airport. And I am weary of terms like, "Why not let me search you, or search your car, are hiding something?"

What in the hell happened to my world? When I was a child my Mother told me,"If you get lost or in trouble go to police man and they will help you. "I am a white guy and I feel if I had the need to flag down a patrol car, for something, I will either get hassled for interrupting their day or get a ticket for something stupid like standing in the road, or perhaps even shot.

I find most of the fault for this distrust mainly with the Federal Government. If we have a conservative administration such as G.W. Bush, the FED's scream from the mountain top, "Be afraid, be very afraid, it's the terrorist, or it's domestic terrorist. So stay home, work hard and pay your taxes. Under the current liberal administration, it's arms the cops with M4's, black body armer and no knock warrants, and prepare for insurrection, or a epidemic. Again all civilians should stay in your homes, work hard, and pay your taxes. See a trend here?

I have never been arrested in my life and I see a no knock warrant as a clear and present danger to my life, and the well being of my family. Maybe I feel a little like one of those German Jew's in the thirties with Natzi's in black uniforms at the door. No wonder Americans are buying MRE's and guns and ammo at a record pace. We already have theft, murder, and home invasions. Where I live, to be served with a no knock warrant, at night, is an invitation to an instant gun fight. Only an idiot would want that.

Maybe I am just another old guy remembering when the policemen on the corner was my friend, instead of a storm trouper in a black suite.
May God help us all, as no one else seems to care.
Nick

a reply to: ltdan08

So because we're fighting an ideal, it's ok to lump an entire faith together, even though the vast majority reject it?

a reply to: SLAYER69

And once again with ISIS we have seen universal condemnation by Muslims leaders in the United States and abroad. For example, the two biggest Muslim-American groups, ISNA and CAIR, unequivocally denounced ISIS. CAIR’s statement notes in part: “American Muslims view the actions of ISIS as un-Islamic and morally repugnant. No religion condones the murder of civilians, the beheading of religious scholars or the desecration of houses of worship.”

In the United Kingdom, 100 Sunni and Shiite Imams have joined together to condemn ISIS. Muslim leaders in Indonesia and Turkey did the same. And the head of the Arab League stated that the league “strongly denounced” ISIS and its attacks on Christians in Iraq.

Despite this avalanche of condemnations, it’s clearly not reaching—or not persuading—many of my fellow Americans. In fact, a Zogby poll released just last month found alarmingly that the favorability ratings for Muslims in the United States had fallen from 36 percent in 2010 to 27 percent.

www.thedailybeast.com...

originally posted by: ltdan08
a reply to: TechniXcality
To the OP: if you please, throw out your thinly veiled policitcal correctness. You can't lump me in with Nazis. I find that incredibly offensive and it shows that you have little knowledge of these subjects.

Oh believe me, I understand the subjects very well.

There is no "thinly veiled political correctness" here - or in anything I've posted.

Maybe you should re-read the OP and try and comprehend it again?

a reply to: kitzik
Russia, 150 million people. Isis, 2000 members (according to CNN last week). Even at the highest estimates, 15,000.

Currently hated by the entire world, including arabs, including muslims. UAE is even bombing them. As I said in another thread, hell the Canadian Forces could take them.

Fearmongering, plain and simple.

a reply to: Zaphod58

even though the vast majority reject it?

I don't see this vast majority.
I haven't seen even one small demonstration denouncing ISIS from those 1.7 billion moderate muslims.

Even in Russia they had anti-war demonstration recently, but 1.7 billion muslims are mostly silent.
Official statements are for official use, I want to see 1 billion muslims condemning ISIS, at that time I
may allow mosques in Europe back. Lol

originally posted by: kitzik
a reply to: Zaphod58
I don't see this vast majority.
I haven't seen even one small demonstration denouncing ISIS from those 1.7 billion moderate muslims.

Here, let me help you.

www.google.com...:en-GBfficial

a reply to: neformore

Show the crowd like this

youtu.be...

a reply to: neformore

You are comparing the Jewish people in post WW1 to modern day Muslims. You are comparing a peaceful and non radical group that was used as a scapegoat for fascists to a group that does have a popular radical base and IS engaged in active war efforts on several fronts.

I am sorry this is just retarded.

Of coarse we should avoid generalizations. We shouldnt avoid seeing reality though.

Muslim radical groups have been engaged in active conquest of several countries and you want us to have pity on them?

No. History will also show you that radical Muslims invade and force convert anyone they can. I dont care about a muslim family in NY trying to live their lives. I DO care about the millions in the ME that kill daily, behead, rape and torture. I care about the millions who come to our countries so as to organize our people and those peaceful Muslims into a fighting force that can hurt our countries and our people.

I am an american. My ancestry is Spaniard. We have been scarred by invading Muslims who conquered our people for 800 YEARS. 800 Years of rape theft and murder. Greece recently lost part of their country to invading Muslims. There have been many Asian countries who have had violent encounters with radical Muslims. You want us to just forget?

F that.

When there is an active, honest and wide spread dialogue from moderate Muslims against radicals I will think differently. When their own people stand up to them like ours would against our own radicals I will think differently.

Until then I will be thankful that the fight is over there in their house and not here out of complacency and weakness on our part.

Radical Muslims should die. I have no issue with that statement because history has shown my people that if they do not, WE DO.

So again, F that.

a reply to: kitzik

How about we show them this instead?