If You Think the Water Crisis Can't Get Worse, Wait Until the Aquifers Are Drained

Now I realize that a majority of members don't believe that there is a "Water Crises" any more then you believe in Anthropogenic Climate Cahnge nor that this majority of which I speak will believe anything put out by "The Government" no matter how disguished the history of the body.

I have to make the effort to share this information, and that's what it is, with you all. The NGO article also speaks to how we do or do not perceive dangers in very plain and not threatening language.

news.nationalgeographic.com...

No matter what you believe the facts, on and in the ground so to speak, are that we (meaning humanity) are facing a desparate Fresh Water shortage.

The National Geographic summary:

Aquifers provide us freshwater that makes up for surface water lost from drought-depleted lakes, rivers, and reservoirs. We are drawing down these hidden, mostly nonrenewable groundwater supplies at unsustainable rates in the western United States and in several dry regions globally, threatening our future.

... and their analysis on why it's so hard for us to accept:

We are at our best when we can see a threat or challenge ahead. If flood waters are rising, an enemy is rushing at us, or a highway exit appears just ahead of a traffic jam, we see the looming crisis and respond.

We are not as adept when threats—or threatened resources—are invisible. Some of us have trouble realizing why invisible carbon emissions are changing the chemistry of the atmosphere and warming the planet. Because the surface of the sea is all we see, it's difficult to understand that we already have taken most of the large fish from the ocean, diminishing a major source of food. Neither of these crises are visible—they are largely out of sight, out of mind—so it's difficult to get excited and respond. Disappearing groundwater is another out-of-sight crisis.

The article goes on to explain "Aquifers" (ground water) and how they operate. It talks about the horrendous drought in the SW US which will negatively impact the rest of the State and the world.


It's not just California:

We are at our best when we can see a threat or challenge ahead. If flood waters are rising, an enemy is rushing at us, or a highway exit appears just ahead of a traffic jam, we see the looming crisis and respond.

We are not as adept when threats—or threatened resources—are invisible. Some of us have trouble realizing why invisible carbon emissions are changing the chemistry of the atmosphere and warming the planet. Because the surface of the sea is all we see, it's difficult to understand that we already have taken most of the large fish from the ocean, diminishing a major source of food. Neither of these crises are visible—they are largely out of sight, out of mind—so it's difficult to get excited and respond. Disappearing groundwater is another out-of-sight crisis.

And then there are industrial uses:

Scarce groundwater supplies also are being used for energy. A recent study from CERES, an organization that advocates sustainable business practices, indicated that competition for water by hydraulic fracturing—a water-intensive drilling process for oil and gas known as "fracking"—already occurs in dry regions of the United States. The February report said that more than half of all fracking wells in the U.S. are being drilled in regions experiencing drought, and that more than one-third of the wells are in regions suffering groundwater depletion.

Good article, well written for a general audience and links.

I don't think anyone can deny that we've overpopulated an area of our country that is dessert.

Nice condescending attitude. Just because I don't think we can affect overall global climate doesn't mean I don't think we can have serious regional impact - see the Dust Bowl.

Yes, one of the problems Californians are going to have is that they are draining their aquifers in the recent drought. There isn't enough refill. It has been speculated that part of the seismic activity in California recently is due to aquifer subsidence, meaning those aquifers will not refill even when the water comes back.

originally posted by: ketsuko
Nice condescending attitude. Just because I don't think we can affect overall global climate doesn't mean I don't think we can have serious regional impact - see the Dust Bowl.

Yes, one of the problems Californians are going to have is that they are draining their aquifers in the recent drought. There isn't enough refill. It has been speculated that part of the seismic activity in California recently is due to aquifer subsidence, meaning those aquifers will not refill even when the water comes back.

Yes I can be condescending (thanks for spelling it for me) at times. Thank you for pointing it out.

You think it's all California's fault (pun intended). Well CA is in a pickle and one we've been 'not dealing with' for decades. it's not just us any more, if you'd read the source material, it's many key areas around the world.

Find somebody to blame and move on. Good way to live - enjoy.

a reply to: FyreByrd
When you live somewhere and the environment isn't taken into consideration when designing cities this is what you get.

Do you think Vegas is an ideal location for so many living things?

a reply to: FyreByrd

The water isn't disappearing, it's just going elsewhere. We do not destroy water, it evaporates and condenses over and over again. Now, this isn't to say that water is no longer in regions it was before, this is known as climate change....

A lot of parts of the world were much different than they are today my friend.

Responding to myself about denial:



This guy is brilliant - not the greatest here - and he talks too fast. NOTE to self: listen again.

originally posted by: Hijinx
a reply to: FyreByrd

The water isn't disappearing, it's just going elsewhere. We do not destroy water, it evaporates and condenses over and over again. Now, this isn't to say that water is no longer in regions it was before, this is known as climate change....

A lot of parts of the world were much different than they are today my friend.

It's being polluted and so becomes unuseable. Some water leaves the hydrocycle each time though - basic law of thermodynamics - entropy. So 1) over geologic time (millions of years) we will lose H20 molecules. 2) Salt water where most of our grey water goes - is not useable. 3) Our ground water is being horribly polluted by industry and misuse. 4) the Ocean from which freshwater begins is becoming massively polluted much of which (radioactivity, isotopes, plastic crap) cannot be filtered out by the natural process of water filtration in the hydrocycle.

So tell me again how we "can't destroy" water. Please make a note of the difference between freashwater and saltwater.

Very good and truthful article. Many people do not believe we can run out of fresh clean water and waste it. They think our city just drilled two new wells, we have lots of water. Not thinking the last aquifer was depleted in ten years.

The underground water is not unlimited, sometimes it cannot replenish itself anymore because it was put there long ago and something sealed the ground long ago so it couldn't refill, usually a clay layer.

originally posted by: rickymouse
Very good and truthful article. Many people do not believe we can run out of fresh clean water and waste it. They think our city just drilled two new wells, we have lots of water. Not thinking the last aquifer was depleted in ten years.

The underground water is not unlimited, sometimes it cannot replenish itself anymore because it was put there long ago and something sealed the ground long ago so it couldn't refill, usually a clay layer.

Yep - those are called Fossilized Aquifers - the water quality in those isn't too good either - radioactive for one. Saudi Arabian was using fossilized aquifer water and has stopped because of the difficultly filtering it enough for irragation let alone human consumption. And, as you say, those sources do not replenish at all.

a reply to: FyreByrd

Water treatment and desalinization. Why these aren't built is beyond me. My first choice is water treatment. The byproducts can also be utilized as well. This is the lack of foresight by our illustrious politicians.

OP global warming or what every you choose to call it, isn't responsible for this. I know you didn't make a direct connection, but why put it in the thread to begin with?

there are so many ways to keep potable water, the problem is people will turn their nose up at certain ways because ... well I assume they are stupid.

Heard some folks in southern California got upset when they were told to use recycled sewage water to water their lawns.

I am originally form Florida, a rural county that was at the mercy of Pinellas county, during a decade long drought it took us more than a decade to win a lawsuit forcing Pinellas county to build a desalinization plant. But that court victory didn't bring back the ranches that went belly up because of all the water that was pumped out from under them.

Rain catchment systems are not expensive and can help offset the water usage.

New areas of the US could turn into desert in not too many years, decades.

I never knew this...and I bet most of us think the government of someone "fixed" the Dust Bowl issue in the Plains.
Nope.
Not fixed.
All they did was discover irrigation and for the past 70 or so years have been using the Ogallala Aquifer to keep the crops growing.
And that Aquifer isn't a bottomless pit of water.

The Ogallala was the largest underground body of fresh water in the world and it does not replenish itself. Twenty percent of US corn comes from this former 1930’s and 40’s dust bowl. The dust bowl ended when pumping equipment was developed to reach the Ogallala Aquifer. Most of the irrigation is done using flood or rotary systems which waste exponentially more water than plant’s use.
~~~
The Ogallala has gone from an average depth of 240 feet to an average depth of 80 feet in 50 years.

fixingourfood.wordpress.com...

a reply to: FyreByrd

For general information on desalination:

www.foodandwaterwatch.org...

It's another way for Big Business to rip off taxpayers. Money from the many to the few.

Do we really need to drink the ocean because our freshwater supplies are running low?
The corporations selling ocean desalination certainly want you to think that taking salt out of seawater is our best and only remaining water option. Yet research at Food & Water Watch exposes ocean desalination as an expensive and dangerous technology that policymakers consider at the risk of our public water supply.

We found:

Ocean desalination costs more than any other option
Ocean desalination uses more energy than any other option–which means bigger contributions to global warming
Desalination technology can kill marine life
Desalination creates water pollution
Desalination can fail to remove harmful chemicals from your drinking water
Desalination projects invite corporate abuse of your public water systems
Desalination is not necessary – we have other alternatives

a reply to: FyreByrd

So, what are the other options?

As big business continues to steal water from the Great Lakes and other fresh water bodies.....to bottle and sell...in many cases in other countries.

a reply to: FyreByrd

You're being intellectually dishonest. I already replied to another one of your threads showing that the technology has been developed by more than one company to make the cost of desalination 3 orders of magnitude cheaper than conventional technologies.

Your response was to compare the rollout of this tech to a jet-fighter, in how long it would take to go from concept to production.

I called this out as ridiculous.

Please stop making threads on issues that are solveable, and presenting them as if they are not.

Thanks.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

I am making an assumtion here. If you don't like my first citation, perhaps this is more to your understanding. (BTURAOM).

www.scientificamerican.com...

Due to its high cost, energy intensiveness and overall ecological footprint, most environmental advocates view desalinization (or desalination)‚ the conversion of salty ocean water into fresh water‚ as a last resort for providing fresh water to needy populations. Sourcing fresh water from streams, rivers, lakes and underground aquifers and adhering to strict water conservation measures are much more viable for both economic and environmental reasons in most situations, although some desert regions with thirsty and growing populations may not have many such options.

I also find this point of view very old and narrow thinking without thought to long term consequences. Might I remind members that short term thinking has led to most, if not all, of the trajadies of the last hundred years.

From the Conservative Rightist LA Times on another cheaper and more sustainable solution in Orange County, another Right leaning area of the state:

In fact, Orange County has a model water recycling operation down the road in Fountain Valley, where sewage water is purified in a treatment plant and then pumped to large ponds to percolate into the groundwater supply. This costs about $900 an acre foot and uses one-third the amount of electricity of a desalination plant, according to the Orange County Water District. And it reuses wastewater rather than sticking a straw in the ocean.

A better solution, not a best one, but better.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

Hey, I wish I could quote this whole article for you:

www.paua.de...

I'll just quote the main points, the specifics can be found in the article...

These are all areas of rational concerns on how desalination effects the ocean with it's waste brine but does not address the 'quality' of the resulting 'potable' water....

Salinity, temperature and density

Deaeration and oxygen scavengers

Chlorine

Heavy metals

Antiscalants

Coagulants and coagulant aids

Antifoaming agents

Cleaning chemicals

I had to learn over the years, that before going "Gee that sounds bitch'in, problem solved" that doing some basic research on the subject helps me avoid sounding like an idiot more often then not.

a reply to: FyreByrd

We are hardly at crisis levels, and if you're bringing up the law of thermodynamics, by the time this law has significantly affected our water supply we will have far worse things to worry about than our water supply.

It is possible to filter sea water and make it drinkable, it's how ever expensive and we would rather exhaust our fresh sources first.

Again, it is possible to filter our waste water and use it for drinking, as well as cooking we just don't.

All of the water on the surface of the planet, including the vapor from the air can be harvested as clean drinkable, potable water. We just don't do it on any sort of scale for the sheer fact it's unnecessary in almost all modern parts of the world.

You're overlooking human ingenuity, ability and technology my friend. No, we don't currently process sea water into drinkable water, it's costly, requires large amounts of energy and rain is an easier source to collect as well as filter.

Yes we pollute our waters at an alarm rate, but it's 100% to filter out even the worst of poisons/toxins, it's just not cost effective when we can pull up an already available, drinkable, potable source.

We are in no danger of running out of water, we are racing towards a time when water will be more expensive than gasoline, and that fancy stuff we enjoy from the bottle will be akin to fine wine, or spirits.

We will never go with out how ever.