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Canada: Prostitution is more than a labour rights issue

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posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 10:42 AM
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In 2007, a case challenging Canada's prostitution laws as unconstitutional resulted in the Supreme Court of Canada throwing out the laws criminalising pimping, communicating for the purposes of prostitution, and running a brothel. The federal government was therefore tasked with generating new laws and drafted Bill C-36, the Protection of Communities and Exploited Persons Act.

For the Record: C-36, The Protection of Communities and Exploited Persons Act

In short this new bill say's Prostitution would be decriminalised, unless they are caught offering sex for sale near a playground, school or daycare.


While the topic of prostitution is complex, the debate among progressives is divided along relatively simple lines. That is to say, on the left, there are two obvious camps: One argues that prostitution is primarily an issue of health, safety, and labour rights as it is, after all, work, and the other argues that prostitution exists because of deep inequality and systemic oppression and will never be "safe" or, simply, "a job like any other".


The two factions in there are the "sex work is work" faction, who argues that if prostitution is made legal, it can be regulated and therefore made "safer".

Then we have The Conservative government who I personally feel is right in their proposal to target the exploiters, (pimps) in their proposed legislation.


Aboriginal women only make up 2-4 percent of the population in Canada, they represent 70 percent of those working in street prostitution on Vancouver's Downtown Eastside


The 'sex as work' faction argues that if it's made legal, it will offer sex workers full labor rights and the same protections under the law that any other worker is entitled too.

However even in a city like Amsterdam where the sex trade is legal.

the red light district is said to be run by organized crime, and violence against the women working in the windows, continues.


Whether or not you agree or disagree with either faction at this point is pretty much irrelevant. One way or the other, this will become the new law of the land before this year is over.

The proposed bill has passed both first and second readings before the House of Commons and will return to the House for third reading in September before going to the Senate. Canada's current laws expire in December 2014 and the government has pledged to pass Bill C-36 by then.


Which also means I will not be taking my daughters to visit Canada anytime in the foreseeable future.

Look I get it...Prostitution is a huge problem... but making it legal will not solve anything.
Better education, access to decent jobs and more opportunities for woman seem to me like a better option.
this feels more like a cop out...rather than attempt social change and responsibly, they intend to pass a few feel better about themselves laws... and just ignore what's really going on---"Exploitation"---




posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 10:49 AM
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originally posted by: HardCorps
Then we have The Conservative government who I personally feel is right in their proposal to target the exploiters, (pimps) in their proposed legislation.

What you seem to have missed is that Steve also wants to criminalise the johns as well. Fact is, the initial challenge was about safety for the women in the sex trade. The way the law read, if a prostitute hired a minder, a phone service...hell, an accountant...all of those individuals could - and would- be prosecuted for "living off the avails..."

Steve is running a thinly-veiled theocracy. I don't care what the Bible says about prostitution. Further, there is talk of crowdfunding to sponsor a program that will pay prostitutes to 'out' their politician johns. I think it's a great idea.

I don't think you need to worry about visiting with your daughters, though.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 10:51 AM
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And how would you suggest we deal with it?? I need to be clear I have never and will never pay for sex but the reality is legal or not it is going to happen. the least we can do is protect the people who make this questionable life choice by regulating it. Perhaps at the same time getting social workers in there to help them get out of that job at the same time, if they want. This should not deter you from visiting by the way.
edit on 7-8-2014 by Shepard64 because: (no reason given)

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edit on 7-8-2014 by Shepard64 because: (no reason given)

edit on 7-8-2014 by Shepard64 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 10:57 AM
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a reply to: Shepard64

As I said Better education, access to decent jobs and more opportunities for woman seem to me like a better option....
did you read the part where 70 percent of those working in street prostitution are Native American...

Surely creating better and more economic opportunities for them, giving them a choice for a better future... Do that and I bet they jump at the chance.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:01 AM
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the debate makes no sense.
a "pimp" to a prostitute in a country where it is legal is simply called a manager or agent.
A person running a porn company is not a pimp, they are filmmakers, managers, producers, etc.

Prostitution is a job like any other physical job. because someone may moan makes it irrelevant..a massage therapist is similar yet nobody flips out and calls managers of MTs a pimp..its a shock nonsense word that is best forgotten. Oldest profession in the world needs to have some safety and regulation, it will never go away, but it can be made more safe, and something that is controlled, taxed, and monitored for protection and safety between both client and worker.

As far as legal prostitution set up in controlled safe environments allows for violence against women still..erm..ok, so what, them risking it in secret motel meetings and in rough areas of town on the street is totally safe?

Never legislate moral decisions on what you choose to do with your own personal self and another consenting adult...the only thing you are doing is removing a inherent liberty, self determination, and strictly for the purposes of your personal views on how others should act/think.
If nobody died, then its not your concern.

and on a fairly weird note..what is the daughter thing about? are you afraid if she goes there, she will run away to become a prostitute?
...

weird statement you made.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:01 AM
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a reply to: HardCorps

Yes I agree with you but what about the women who have been in it for years and feel that they are stuck and have no where else to go. If we regulate it then we can help them get out and educate younger women also. However there will always be the select few who I wouldn't say enjoy the job but believe the money is worth it and that we cannot change.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:06 AM
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a reply to: HardCorps

Get the government out of people's lives.

It's the worlds oldest profession for a reason and before the Victorians poisoned the well, it was doing fine.

Puritans can lock their kids away behind closed doors for all I care. Won't change a thing, but go for it.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:07 AM
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originally posted by: HardCorps
a reply to: Shepard64

As I said Better education, access to decent jobs and more opportunities for woman seem to me like a better option....
did you read the part where 70 percent of those working in street prostitution are Native American...

Surely creating better and more economic opportunities for them, giving them a choice for a better future... Do that and I bet they jump at the chance.


Gotta pay the bills, maybe it being legal, safe, and with proper benefits may allow them to eventually move out of their trade and into something more respected by you?

Anyhow, if a politician could simply "give them better jobs", then sure..sign every country on earth up for that option...but the government doesn't make jobs..they only allow or hamper business models from competing.

They have access to decent jobs as much as anything else. there is no law on the books in Canada forbidding NA women from filing applications, it is simply a cultural inherent inequality that sucks but is the norm in most societies (one race or another getting the short stick). Short of government literally giving every NA person 300k, there is nothing that really can be done much that doesn't destroy the idea of equality.

And again, why is it your business what two consenting adults choose to do that effects you or their neighbors in no way at all?



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:07 AM
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originally posted by: HardCorps
a reply to: Shepard64

As I said Better education, access to decent jobs and more opportunities for woman seem to me like a better option....
did you read the part where 70 percent of those working in street prostitution are Native American...

Surely creating better and more economic opportunities for them, giving them a choice for a better future... Do that and I bet they jump at the chance.

Well of course...but the same can be said for society at large these days. Meanwhile, should it be made even more difficult for those in the trade to be safe? This is no simple fix.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:22 AM
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a reply to: HardCorps




Look I get it...Prostitution is a huge problem... but making it legal will not solve anything.


Making it illegal hasn't solved anything either.

Who cares if two adults agree to have sex for money, I just don't understand that mentality? At least if its legal it can be better regulated and the women have a better chance of working for themselves as self employed.




Better education, access to decent jobs and more opportunities for woman seem to me like a better option.


Why can't you have prostitution and those things as well? Maybe their are adults who prefer to be prostitutes for what ever reasons than to work a 40 hour plus work week. Why shouldn't an adult decide how they should run their lives as long as it doesn't force others to participate?



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:32 AM
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a reply to: HardCorps

Touchy subject.

I am all for legal prostitution. There, I said it.

For many reasons. To start, for many, it's a job. The whole environment surrounding prostitution seems to be the problem; drugs, pimps, crime, unhealthiness and sexual medical illness.

Legalizing it would help minimize those surrounding problems by having it stay within safety nets under regulated law. Better hygiene, better regulated medical check ups all the while keeping an eye to disintegrate the drugs, pimps and crimes problems. As it's now, it's just the law of the jungle and the prostitute is the one paying the price.

This will never go away. Give everyone a chance at a better education but ultimately, it's their choice. It will always be.

Might as well making it safe. Just my opinion.



edit on 8 7 2014 by SonoftheSun because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:40 AM
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Well, want all the pimps in jail, primarily. And their handlers, the black ops.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:48 AM
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I think using the Netherlands as a reason not to legislate is erroneous. The Dutch have gone about it the right way ie. segregating the sex industry from the regular businesses, but fail to keep the criminal element away from the workers. That is not the workers fault but the authorities. Regulating the industry, and it is an industry, would give the workers much needed security that at the moment they are not getting. No one should be under any allusion that legalising it would be a magic wand to clear the criminals out or make for better working conditions but it would be a start in the right direction. As anyone EVER thought to ask the women and men(yes there are male prostitutes) what they want and how to provide the best rules and laws to protect them?



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:53 AM
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Since when does the federal gov't know more about this trade than those that work in it? THEY don't want this. They say it going to make the trade go underground and make it more dangerous. This is just Stevie pushing his small agenda on the rest of the country. Hell, you've even got clergy coming out against this:


Many religious groups in Canada, especially Catholics and Evangelicals, have been enthusiastically supporting the government’s new prostitution bill, Bill C-36, which aims to eradicate the sex trade by criminalizing those who buy sex, not those who sell it. The House of Commons justice committee heard testimony this week in praise of the legislation from a handful of Christian groups, such as the Evangelical Fellowship of Canada and Defend Dignity.

But dozens of Anglican clergy say the proposed law is immoral and endangers sex workers, and they are urging the government to withdraw it.


www.macleans.ca...

And since when do we call liberals "progressives" in Canada. The only progressive I know was the Progressive Conservative and they were hardly progressive.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:55 AM
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a reply to: crayzeed


As anyone EVER thought to ask the women and men(yes there are male prostitutes) what they want and how to provide the best rules and laws to protect them?


I think the picture in the OP is giving us a clue...

Sex work is real work. Human Rights. Labour Rights.




posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 11:58 AM
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The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.


originally posted by: HardCorps
Prostitution is a huge problem... but making it legal will not solve anything.

It solves a lot of problems. Legalizing it brings it out of the shadows and makes it safer for everyone. It takes power away from abusive 'managers'. And it means that prostitutes won't have to worry about being beaten up and not being able to report the abuse.

Legalize it. Regulate it. Tax it. Everyone comes out ahead.

But of course it's not my country so they can run it as they wish

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 12:01 PM
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a reply to: FlyersFan

It IS our country and they aren't running it like we want. 15 more months. 15 more months......



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 12:02 PM
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originally posted by: intrepid
It IS our country and they aren't running it like we want. 15 more months. 15 more months......

Going to be perfect timing too. The PC's are at an all time low in their bastion of strength...out west.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 12:02 PM
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a reply to: HardCorps

I support college students and single moms.
Whats your issue?

Please don't come to Canada...we don't need American idiocy up here,stay down there please.

I highly doubt you know anything about this issue or the people involved in it but I am sure you feel good spouting your opinion about it....so carry on.



posted on Aug, 7 2014 @ 12:26 PM
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a reply to: HardCorps




Which also means I will not be taking my daughters to visit Canada anytime in the foreseeable future.


lol. Huge country, small population. You can go a lot of places without seeing visible prostitutes.
I don't think I've seen any for years.

I'm guessing there's a few in the US as well, as it is the oldest profession.

I'm not for prostitution, but it's not going away, so I'm all for making it safer.




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