Are chemtrails REALLY something 'relatively' new?

originally posted by: intrptr

I'm not breathing in this stuff anymore… done here.

I understand your point, but until a new, clean fuel source is used, or people stop traveling, I think this is going to be an issue.

But what are you going to do to avoid breathing this stuff? wear a mask, or stop inhaling?

a reply to: network dude

But what are you going to do to avoid breathing this stuff? wear a mask, or stop inhaling?

I meant the emissions directed to me on this thread.

ETA: Sorry , I didn't mean yours specifically. I agree with you and others here about the bogus mystery spraying and didn't see a point to arguing that with people that are also like minded. My "theory' about disinformation was moore a statement than a call to discussion about "the proof of toxins in jet exhaust".

a reply to: intrptr

I think you have a valid point, I just think that cars, buses and trucks are a much bigger problem then air planes in regards to pollution. As has been stated, the airplanes are much more efficient then our cars are.

An alternative fuel could solve most of the issues our ecology faces today. (providing it has less dangerous by-products)

a reply to: intrptr

I tend to agree and have posited several times on here, with no takers lol, that chemtrail theory manages to distract those most likely to make some sort of stand away from the real problem.

However I also think that aircraft are a much smaller part of the problem than many imagine. After all aircraft can be absolutely huge and travel round the globe, yes?

However when you look at the multi millions of road vehicles, factories and power stations etc emitting toxins constantly into the air, and also consider that the largest and most powerful of aircraft derive up to 90% of their power (50% plus for even the smaller types) cleanly from unburned bypass air (completely uniquely in any form of combustion engine), due to the specific way in which HBPR engines deliver their power, then I deduce that attacking air transport, at the expense of looking at other forms of pollution, is going to be very useful to some people.



Combustion occurs in the longer central 'core' of the engine, the shorter, wider part at the front is simply a huge compressor fan, like a ducted propeller. If it wasn't for this sort of design, large jet engines today would be truly horrendous. Apologies if that is oversimplified but geeky techno speak isn't for everyone. There is constant pressure from the airline industry to cut fuel costs by burning less and less fuel per pound of thrust in each new engine generation. The latest models of A320neo and 737MAX, both yet to enter service, see the introduction of a whole new generation of engines designed to burn 15-20% less fuel by comparison with current models. Are others making similar strides?

a reply to: waynos
to be fair there's plenty of pressure to reduce automotive fuel consumption too - hence electric & hybrid vehicles, the general demise of the V8 (waaahhh...but I'll have my 1976 one for a couple more decades I hope ), relatively massive increases in fuel efficiency from say eth 1980's - when I was a bit of a petrol head 30 mpg (imperial) was good for a "standard" family saloon - these days 45 is not untypical!

originally posted by: ThisIsMyRifle
...... something caught my eye at around 2:28 into this video. It looks like our modern day so called chemtrails, in a much earlier video. ....

Yep - well as others have pointed out, persistent contrail have been around since aircraft have ben able to fly high enough to get into conditions that allow them to exist - I call your attention to a book titled "Flight to Arras" by Antoine de Saint-Exuperry- French aviation pioneer & hero, killed in 1944:

The German on the ground knows us by the pearly white scarf which every plane flying at high altitude trails behind like a bridal veil. The disturbance created by our meteoric flight crystallizes the watery vapor in the atmosphere. We unwind behind us a cirrus of icicles. If the atmospheric conditions are favorable to the formation of clouds, our wake will thicken bit by bit and become an evening cloud over the countryside.

- published 1942, and still available on Amazon.

since he was killed in 1944 any conspiracy by "the powers that be" to hide chemtrails behind "contrail disinfo" has to be able to support itself back to at least this 1942 to account for his writing!!

As far as I understand, Contrails are mostly water vapor & disappear very quickly. If you see a very distinct line in the sky for an extended period, it's a chemtrail. They chemtrail the moon & sun constantly here in Southern California. I will upload some pics I have taken.

originally posted by: Eunuchorn
As far as I understand, Contrails are mostly water vapor & disappear very quickly. If you see a very distinct line in the sky for an extended period, it's a chemtrail.

Water vapour is invisible.......contrails are ice crystals, like cirrus clouds.

You should read page 1 of this thread, and consider what it is that allows cirrus clouds to hang around for hours.

I lol at this!

Vinegar Warriors
There are an intrepid group of people who have discovered the secret to removing chemtrails: vinegar. There are numerous groups dedicated to it, and despite the obvious stupidity of it all, they seem to believe it. The trick is as follows; simply evaporate a certain amount of vinegar each day in order to disperse clouds and chemtrails and to clear the skies. Depending on how crazy the person proposing this can be, the volumes range from a few liters per day (mixed with extra water) to simply spraying it into the air from a bottle. Yes, that's right, people believe that clouds and chemicals at 20,000 ft can be dispersed and neutralized by spraying a couple of milliliters of dilute acetic acid in their back yard (presumably the patches of dead grass you can see in the videos these people produce[21] are just a coincidence). For those who can't quite afford the increase in energy bills associated with boiling 5+ liters of water a day for no reason, other advice includes simply tipping it onto asphalt to let it evaporate naturally. Complaints from neighbors about the smell aren't usually mentioned.

RationalWiki - Chemtrails

Chemtrail theories were first brought to prominence in the 1990s by paranormal pusher and talk radio host Art Bell.

Why am I not surprised? I used to be a huge Art Bell / Coast to Coast AM fan. Started listening when I was thirteen or fourteen. I can definitely say I learned a lot from that show, about keeping an open mind if nothing else. Though in recent years (before I stopped listening) I've noticed a certain trend and vibe from C2C. I couldn't say for sure if the show itself changed, or my perception of it did. Now all it seems to be is a platform for pseudoscience to be treated as science, promoting debunked conspiracy left and right. Selling their books or their television programs. While thousands of listeners think they've won something against TPTB because the History Channel is talking about alleged ancient aliens. Shame on you George Noory!

Anyway my point is this. As long as there are mega popular platforms like C2C regurgitating the same or modified, easily debunked theories, in a serious "open minded", "discussion", chemtrail theories will be around for awhile.

I don't know science but I think the reason cars and busses are safer is because they're small. you can't fit the required tanks to them so they cant obviously spray the chemicales out and blanket the lower atmopshere.

thats why you never see them coming out of cars and trucks.

only planes because they're big and you can fit the big tanks inside them, and shoot terrorforming agents into the air.

See this is how they do it. I saw this on the internet and anyone who says this is not an agenda to kill us all is just a sheep.

a reply to: sn0rch

Baa, Baa. WakeUpSheep reporting for duty!

Physics of a Fighter Jet (Very cool read)

The image you posted is explained about halfway down that page.

When you have two regions of air touching each other, one with normal temperature and pressure and one with practically no air in there, something really interesting happens. The air rushes into the region with practically no air, and because it’s practically a vacuum, it cools tremendously! This ultra-fast cooling is so powerful that it can not only pull water vapor out of the air and turn it directly into liquid water, but it can immediately turn that liquid water into the special form of — you guessed it — hexagonal ice crystals!

The article itself is about a phenomenon called a Fire Rainbow. Super cool!

originally posted by: sn0rch
...anyone who says this is not an agenda to kill us all is just a sheep.

Keep in mind they breathe the same air. If you want a more likely depopulation conspiracy I would look into what's going on with food and drink.

a reply to: WakeUpBeer

Psssst... That whooshing sound wasn't a low-flying jet

originally posted by: sn0rch
I don't know science but I think the reason cars and busses are safer is because they're small. you can't fit the required tanks to them so they cant obviously spray the chemicales out and blanket the lower atmopshere.
thats why you never see them coming out of cars and trucks.

Except of course you DO see them coming out of cars and trucks sometimes - for example when it is REALLY cold and ther is high relative humidity - such as in Alaska or Antarctica.

Eg Here is a video of a C-130 leaving contrails at ground level in Antarctica.

At about 3.56 you can also see the exhaust from a truck leaving a relatively long trail.



Ice Fog is a relatively well known phenomena in Fairbanks!

originally posted by: Aloysius the Gaul
a reply to: waynos
to be fair there's plenty of pressure to reduce automotive fuel consumption too - hence electric & hybrid vehicles, the general demise of the V8 (waaahhh...but I'll have my 1976 one for a couple more decades I hope

), relatively massive increases in fuel efficiency from say eth 1980's - when I was a bit of a petrol head 30 mpg (imperial) was good for a "standard" family saloon - these days 45 is not untypical!

True, my little pug delivers 58 at present

a reply to: sn0rch

You had me for a while there, I thought you were being serious

BIOLOGICAL AND CHEMICAL TESTING ON HUMAN BEINGS

'Millions exposed' in 1960s experiments Radioactive gas was flung from Harwell During the early 1960s millions of people were exposed to clouds of radioactive xenon gas from the Harwell Nuclear Research Establishment, the BBC has discovered.
news.bbc.co.uk...

Millions were in germ war tests Much of Britain was exposed to bacteria sprayed in secret trials The Ministry of Defence turned large parts of the country into a giant laboratory to conduct a series of secret germ warfare tests on the public. www.observer.co.uk...

Porton Down used soldiers for Sarin gas tests in 1983 Servicemen were experimented on with Sarin, the deadly nerve gas, as late as 1983 at the Government's defence research centre at Porton Down, documents seen by The Telegraph reveal. www.telegraph.co.uk...& sSheet=/news/2002/10/13/ixhome.html

Records: U.S. did open-air biological, chemical weapons tests in Florida Associated Press 10/08/02: Matt Kelley Original Link: www.miami.com...

The United States held open-air biological and chemical weapons tests in at least four states - Alaska, Hawaii, Maryland and Florida - during the 1960s in an effort to develop defenses against such weapons, according to Pentagon documents. www.rense.com...

US admits chemical weapons tests BBC 10/10/02 Original Link:
news.bbc.co.uk...

The Pentagon has published previously secret information revealing that it carried out more extensive tests of chemical and biological warfare agents than had previously been thought.
www.prisonplanet.com...

US planes sprayed Wiltshire with Sarin London Times 10/10/02: Chris Ayres and Michael Evans Original Link: www.timesonline.co.uk...

CROPDUSTER aircraft flown by British and US military personnel sprayed deadly chemical weapons, including Sarin and VX, over the Wiltshire countryside in the late 1960s. News of the tests is broken in declassified documents released this week by the Pentagon. www.prisonplanet.com...

Vaccinia/Rabies Wildlife Bait Dropped From The Sky
www.rense.com...

Pentagon: Chem, bio tests involved U.S. troops The USS George Eastman decontaminates after a nuclear test. The ship was used to monitor nuclear tests in the 1950s and for chemical and biological warfare tests in the '60s. WASHINGTON (CNN) -- The Pentagon revealed for the first time Thursday that almost 3,000 U.S. military personnel were involved in Cold War-era tests involving actual chemical and biological agents. www.cnn.com...

Sailors: 'We were used' Vets exposed to toxic agents want answers, justice When Navy veteran Jim Brocklebank served as a radioman on the USS Power in the 1960s, he was intrigued by civilians in masks and body suits doing tests on his destroyer. www.floridatoday.com...

Sailors Skeptical of Chemical Tests
www.firebase.net...

Pentagon confirms Cold War program "Our government poisoned us," said Cast, who suffers chronic respiratory problems. "They should have given us a chance to opt out or tell us when we were doing (the testing)."
www.signonsandiego.com...

Sailors Sprayed With Nerve Gas in Cold War Test, Pentagon Says
www.nytimes.com...=1022817600& en=c569e031539ed222&ei=5009&partner=MSN_NYTHOME

Pentagon Program Promotes Psychopharmacological Warfare In The Futurological Congress (1971), Polish writer Stanislaw Lem portrayed a future in which disobedience is controlled with hypothetical mind-altering chemicals dubbed "benignimizers". Lem's fictional work opens with the frightening story of a police and military biochemical attack on protesters outside of an international scientific convention. As the environment becomes saturated with hallucinogenic agents, in Lem's tale the protesters (and bystanders) descend into chaos, overcome by delusions and feelings of complacency, self-doubt, and even love.
austin.indymedia.org:8081...=3278

The U.S. Government's Secret Testing of Radioactive, Chemical and Biological Weapons on Humans. As we travel through a period of increasing government secrecy, it is worth taking a second look at these books that document secret U.S. government radioactive, chemical and biological weapons testing on U.S. citizens.
www.mapcruzin.com...

U.S. conducted open-air tests of biological, chemical arms The United States secretly tested chemical and biological weapons on American soil during the 1960s, newly declassified Pentagon reports show.
newstribune.com...

Fuzzy Strands Fill Skies Over Texas City GALVESTON, Texas (AP) _ Galveston residents are still trying to figure out what caused the skies over their coastal city to literally be filled on Friday with floating strands of wads that looked like spider webs. apondemo.mm.ap.org...

The Biowarriors Richard Sanders, November 7, 2001 On dozens of separate occasions since the Second World War, biological weapons have been used against innocent U.S. civilians. These actions were perpetrated not by foreign terrorists but by the U.S. Army during secret "open-air" biowarfare experiments that used the American public as guinea pigs.
www.guerrillanews.com...

THE MUSHROOM POLICY HUMAN EXPERIMENTATION
Keep them in the dark and feed them b.s. I want to believe my government is good. However too often what we want to believe proves to be fantasy.
www.etherzone.com...

The 1994 Rockefeller Report Examining Biological Experimentation on U.S. Military During the last few years, the public has become aware of several examples where U.S. Government researchers intentionally exposed Americans to potentially dangerous substances without their knowledge or consent.
www.mindcontrolforums.com...

Army Aerial Spraying Tests Panic, Anger Florida Keys Residents
www.rense.com...

Of Microbes and Mock Attacks - 51 Years Ago, The Military Sprayed Germs on U.S. Cities
www.rense.com...

GERM WARFARE
The Hall of Shame The United States has a long history of experimentation, on unwitting human subjects, which goes back to the beginning of this century. Both private firms and the military have used unknowing human populations to test various theories. However, the extent to which human experimentation has been a part of the U.S. Biological Weapons programs will probably never be known. home.earthlink.net...

Still looking for the official us gov document that talked about chemtrails being found with various elements used in 3D/holographic technology. It takes a really long time to turn the entire sky into a projection screen before they can enact a full scale alien invasion or return of Jesus etc etc.

I like this idea better than them just trying to long term poison the population to lower the average death age.

Excerpt
It is important to distinguish between contrails and chemtrails. Contrails are streaks of condensed water vapor created in the air by jet airplanes at high altitudes. Contrails can exist in two forms: water droplet and ice crystal. Contrails typically become visible about a wingspans distance behind an aircraft flying at high altitude. The trail dissipates quite quickly, usually within a minute or so. Chemtrails, on the other hand, are visible directly behind an aircraft, with little or no gap between the aircraft and the start of the trail. Chemtrails are said to vary from contrails in their length of persistence. Chemtrails do not dissipate quickly; they tend to form into mushy clouds which can block sunlight.


Some people are reporting what they describe to be unusual activity in the sky, including jets leaving trails at low altitudes, spray lines creating X's, S's and parallel lines, lines that slowly spread to create a canopy of haze, and reports of unusual smells, tastes, and even illness related to the trails.


Also, a reddish-brown gel, dropped from low-flying aircraft, has been observed by people in the past and was even documented on Unsolved Mysteries. Samples of this substance have been alledgedly analyzed by Margareta-Erminia Cassani and found to be teaming with biological organisms. Other tests have shown that chemtrails contain more than 3 times the legal level of the toxic substance, barium. Chemtrails may also be one of the primary contributory factors in the collapse of honey bee colonies worldwide. Albert Einstein clearly knew the importance of the honey bee when he said: "If the bee disappears from the surface of the earth, man would have no more than four years to live."

There are currently three main hypothesis for the purpose of chemical spraying in the skies: weather modification, population control, and testing of biological agents on the general poplace.

Even if we assume that these trails have nothing to do with eugenics or weather modification, we cannot ignore the fact that our skies are being heavily polluted with aviation fuel emissions that contribute towards a host of different health problems. As far as Im aware, jet engines run on kerosene (paraffin). Up until the 1990s, most petrol-driven road vehicles used leaded petrol, which was not only harmful to the environment, but caused asthma as well as lowering of the IQ. The tetra-ethyl (lead) found in aviation fuel and its combustion products are potent neurotoxins that have been shown in scientific research to interfere with brain development in children. Leaded petrol has now been banned for use in motor vehicles. But for some reason, this law doesnt seem to apply to aircraft.

CHEMTRAILS DATA AEROSOL OPERATION CRIMES & COVER-UP
www.carnicom.com...

CHEMTRAIL WATCH
Are BioWarfare weapons being tested on the population, is it a form of vaccination, or population control? - or is it Mass Paranoia? Research the information and draw your own conclusions!
www.centrexnews.com...

Chemtrails Data Page
www.rense.com...

Chemtrail Illness Mycoplasma Links
www.geocities.com...

CANADIAN CHEMTRAILS
www.geocities.com...

CHEMTRAILS - ISLE OF MAN CHEMTRAILS AFFECTING THE ISLE OF MAN AND IRISH SEA AREA OF THE BRITISH ISLES chemtrails.iomonline.co.im...

MICHIGAN CONTRAILS AND CHEMTRAILS
members.tripod.com...

CHEMTRAIL EVIDENCE 'THE CAMPAIGN AGAINST CHEMTRAILS'
www.world-action.co.uk...

CHEMTRAILS ARTICLES Chemtrails Over Santa Barbara
www.rense.com...

Chemtrails outlaw The government says they don't exist, but Kucinich wants Congress to take action www.globalresearch.ca...

Space Preservation Act of 2001 (Introduced in House)
thomas.loc.gov...:H.R.2977.IH:

Rep. Kucinich's HR 2977Names Chemtrails As An 'Exotic Weapon'
www.rense.com...

Congress Admits Chemtrails Are Real After years of denial from government, military, and environmental agencies, the reality of the controversial issue regarding the covert programs known as Chemtrails has been acknowledged. www.indymedia.org...

CONGRESSMAN ACKNOWLEDGES CHEMTRAILS
www.rebfile.com...

Chemtrails: Delivery System For Dept. of Defense's Toxic Cocktails
www.geocities.com...

Chemtrails Campaign Adds To Air Force Woes
www.rense.com...

Military Said Behind Up To Four Different Chemtrail Programs
www.rense.com...
www.healthresearchbooks.com...

Air Traffic Controllers Concerned Over Chemtrails
www.rense.com...

Chemtrails A Field Guide to Chemtrails
www.ufos-aliens.co.uk...

Stolen Skies: The Chemtrail Mystery Jet Trails in the Sky Used to Disappear. Now they Linger www3.bc.sympatico.ca...

Chemtrails over America - Let US Spray!!
www.reformation.org...

a reply to: Eunuchorn

Here I am just going to leave you with a few things...









contrailscience.com...

science-edu.larc.nasa.gov...

cimss.ssec.wisc.edu...

and here's one about carnicom...

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Enjoy...

a reply to: Eunuchorn

What an appropriate avatar you have. Thanks for vomiting that load of fairy dust across the forum.