Doomsday prepper father accused of plotting to kill federal agents and stockpiling guns and explosiv

Federal agents this week searched the Florida home of a 'doomsday prepper' they alleged had stockpiled over 50 high-powered assault rifles and several explosive devices buried around his property as 'booby traps'.

However the warrant showed up little more than barrels of food.

Martin Winters, a father-of-three from Valrico, surrendered to police on Wednesday following a widespread two-day hunt.
...

Winters had been under government surveillance since October, after he was indicted on four counts of building destructive devices.

Winters also said he had at least 40 men that were willing to participate in his 'last stand', officials said.

Doomsday prepper father accused of plotting to kill federal agents and stockpiling guns and explosives for the 'end of days' ... only for FBI to raid his home and find only food and five legal firearms in safe

I came across this DailyMail article from today, however the whole story has been unfolding over the past 48 hours-ish.

Seems to be fairly important to those in our prepper community (and any prepper community) that you may be approached by undercover agents, if you haven't already.

The article suggests that he was dangerous and made dangerous remarks. I'm not sure how truthful it actually is. There is a huge difference between 50-60 assault rifles and the 5 they found locked in a gun safe.

In the DailyMail images you will notice he appears to have signs in his front yard:
1. Free Produce
2. Fresh Eggs

Other relevant news reports:
Channel 10 News, article + video (Tampa Bay)

WFTS - ABC, article + video (Tampa Bay)

T he Blaze

He sounds like a horrible guy (sarcasm). I'd hate to live near him having free produce and fresh eggs. I do fear that he may have been coerced into making the remarks that they claim he made. As for the 4 counts of destructive devices, I haven't found specific information as to what those devices actually were (see below).

Here's a link to the actual indictment:
Winters Indictment (PDF)

It appears the "4 count" of destructive devices are guns as defined by the indictment. I believe they are claiming they were "unregistered." Though, I don't know much more than that as I don't know Florida firearms law or what specific types of guns Winters had.

a reply to: WCmutant

Odd that he did soo much illegal crap to prep for his Last stand and didn't make one.

originally posted by: Antipathy17
a reply to: WCmutant

Odd that he did soo much illegal crap to prep for his Last stand and didn't make one.

Obviously the guy knew he was clean, so he knew it was not time.
But I'd bet you would say all people who prep are nuts.
Either that or you just don't examine all the angles...or at least the obvious ones.

I keep advocating sending Cheney, Bush I and II (and III and IV) to the Hague, and that various and sundry people deserve to be creatively executed, if not jailed without possibility of parole.

I wonder how long before they come for me?

And no, no free eggs or produce, sorry.

And in all seriousness, be aware that 'they' can now fill your hard drive with child porn or other goodies and disappear you forever without so much as a warrant, indictment, trial or any of that good stuff. But it's a FREE country and we have fireworks to prove it every Fourth of July.

a reply to: signalfire
IF you run windows, at least use a decent firewall like comodo. Yes, it is annoying as hell, hearing the air raid siren every two seconds when something tries to pass your firewall in or out, but the alternative is even worse. Being locked in some cage forever or having the feds come and shoot your ass for "resisting" or whatever other tricks are up their sleaves.

Been posted before, we talked about it on this week's ATS Radio show.

If the firearms had their serial numbers removed, or if they didn't meet NFA guidelines or did not have the proper tax stamps they would be illegal, but there is NO firearms registration required in Florida. In fact, per State statute, it is illegal to compile and store lists of firearms owners and their info...

a reply to: GoOfYFoOt

I am really a novice firearm enthusiast, so I will be the first to admit that my limited knowledge is based on my own personal guns and situation. That being said, aren't tax stamps only for fully auto guns or imported guns? Not that this is some argument for why this was unjust or anything, I am just curious about this statement in particular and would love if you can clarify for me for my own knowledge.

Here is a short story for you that still boils my blood. 6 years ago I was arrested in KS for misdemeanor marijuana and paraphanelia possession. It landed me in jail, for a gram of grass. In any case in my home state I recieved my purchase permit for hand guns, bought and registered my handgun with the city police department. A year later I went back to purchase and register another hand gun. I was told that I can never,ever, EVER register a handgun in that county for as long as I live due to that misdemeanor, and that they incorrectly registered my original handgun and was forced to relinquish it or sell it immediately for threat of arrest.

First off, that is so ridiculous I can't even put it into words. I can buy "Assault rifles" and shotguns all day long, but nope on a hand gun. Second; How can the city police be so incompetent to register a handgun for someone that supposedly wasn't supposed to have one in the first place? Now I have to pay the penalty for their incompetence.

Luckily I moved about 15 miles west to a new county, where I don't have to register any firearms what so ever and can open carry without being held at gunpoint. Words can't describe my fury. I won in the end though. Dick heads.

a reply to: sputniksteve
Consider there are a lot of places to live where you don't have to go through that BS. Then consider that it should be that way in every state, every county, every city. There are certain places that you have to lick salty nut sacks to the government to have your rights. Screw that. I refuse to be a part of that salty nutsack licking system, if that makes me a criminal, so be it. Come take me in.

a reply to: sputniksteve

I am really a novice firearm enthusiast, so I will be the first to admit that my limited knowledge is based on my own personal guns and situation. That being said, aren't tax stamps only for fully auto guns or imported guns?

Tax stamps do apply to Title II firearms such as full auto or select fire weapons, but also to short barreled rifles and shotguns, suppressors, and AOWs. AOWs, or "Any Other Weapon" is a catch-all catagory that applies to items that can be carried on the person and used to fire a projectile by means of an explosive, such as wallet guns, cane guns and pen guns.
NFA Title II definitions

I hope this helps and sorry about what happened to you in KS!

a reply to: GoOfYFoOt

Thanks for the clarification I appreciate it.

Yes I am also sorry for what happened. But like I said I won in the end by moving 15 miles to a much more accomodating county. Nebraska over all is pretty pro 2nd ammendment. However the city of Omaha/Douglas county is the embarrasment of the state in general. Honestly it is down right corrupted if you ask me. I appealed the decision and proved that I was a responsible gun owner that since that incident have had zero infractions on my criminal record, and still only 1 out of 5 board members agreed with me in my case. I left that hearing more angry than I have been in a long time.

I just still can't believe they acted so incompetently in issuing the first registration. What if I was a violent criminal and thay made that mistake? Pisses me off to this day.

a reply to: WCmutant

In some States it only takes the word of one person and no evidence to lock you up. You can be Baker Acted. This is supposedly because some lunatic pushed someone in front of a train and it was determined many people who are a harm to themselves or others are out there, running lose. Like this is news.

That said, this was a mistake but to act like the guy should not have been checked out is delusional. Once you get a tip on someone these days you almost HAVE to check it out because if the person goes on to be a mass murderer and you knew he was deranged and up to no good, you're responsible by default.

Better to be safe than sorry.

At least that's the tact we've decided to take when we are all boarding an airplane and WE ALL have to be illegally searched, and our water and lotions unconstitutionally seized.

Freedom? Innocent until proven guilty?
Oldfashioned and outdated concepts, done away with by The Patriot Act.
If you are a Patriot, you are expected to suffer these indignities proudly and without complaint, to protect your country.

I know, I don't agree with them either.

I'm so glad this guy turned himself; he hasn't really done anything. It's not uncommon to believe the "end times" are now, although I do not share this belief. Being a "prepper" is not a crime! Making explosives and deploying booby-traps is illegal, however, the raid didn't find any evidence of that. This just goes to show how running your mouth can cause our intrusive government to take an interest in someone. It's funny, because I started talking to guy whom I didn't know, who matter-of-factly explained that he had a dozen assault rifles and a stockpile of ammunition. Why? Who knows. But there have been no cases of any "preppers" being a danger to anyone.

originally posted by: Parthin
I'm so glad this guy turned himself; he hasn't really done anything. It's not uncommon to believe the "end times" are now, although I do not share this belief. Being a "prepper" is not a crime! Making explosives and deploying booby-traps is illegal, however, the raid didn't find any evidence of that. This just goes to show how running your mouth can cause our intrusive government to take an interest in someone. It's funny, because I started talking to guy whom I didn't know, who matter-of-factly explained that he had a dozen assault rifles and a stockpile of ammunition. Why? Who knows. But there have been no cases of any "preppers" being a danger to anyone.

I'm more concerned this guy was coerced into those statements...
Agent to Winters - "what would you do if those dirty federal agents came looking for you?"

Or something similar. You get the picture. Once you approach someone and pretend to be "like-minded" it's not hard to eventually get them to say things you WANT them to say in order to search their home/property.

As many have already pointed out, it really doesn't take much these days.

Well, after reading all of the links in the OP, I still can't find a specific law that has been broken and spokespersons on the govt's behalf have not cited any specifics, either.

Winters' own attorney did say that "four so-called destructive devices" were sold by Winters to the undercover agent. But the Media posted a copy of the indictment which is claiming that Winters and a co-defendant named Michael Keith Bonta "aided and abetted one another, did knowingly make firearms, to wit: five destructive devices, which are weapons...the barrel of which has a bore of more than one-half inch in diameter...without obtaining approval from the Secretary of the Treasury...as required by Title 26, United States Code, Section 5822".

So, apparently this upstanding gentleman is being held without bond in Federal custody, because he and an "accomplice" built a handful of potato guns...

It stands to mention that the spokesperson did state that more information will be relesed in the near future, regarding the charges being levied against the two men. But, I guess they have to come up with it first...!

originally posted by: sputniksteve
a reply to: GoOfYFoOt

I am really a novice firearm enthusiast, so I will be the first to admit that my limited knowledge is based on my own personal guns and situation. That being said, aren't tax stamps only for fully auto guns or imported guns? Not that this is some argument for why this was unjust or anything, I am just curious about this statement in particular and would love if you can clarify for me for my own knowledge.

Here is a short story for you that still boils my blood. 6 years ago I was arrested in KS for misdemeanor marijuana and paraphanelia possession. It landed me in jail, for a gram of grass. In any case in my home state I recieved my purchase permit for hand guns, bought and registered my handgun with the city police department. A year later I went back to purchase and register another hand gun. I was told that I can never,ever, EVER register a handgun in that county for as long as I live due to that misdemeanor, and that they incorrectly registered my original handgun and was forced to relinquish it or sell it immediately for threat of arrest.

First off, that is so ridiculous I can't even put it into words. I can buy "Assault rifles" and shotguns all day long, but nope on a hand gun. Second; How can the city police be so incompetent to register a handgun for someone that supposedly wasn't supposed to have one in the first place? Now I have to pay the penalty for their incompetence.

Luckily I moved about 15 miles west to a new county, where I don't have to register any firearms what so ever and can open carry without being held at gunpoint. Words can't describe my fury. I won in the end though. Dick heads.

I think thats crazy that a bit of weed can stop you from getting a handgun.

But also i think its crazy that a convicted criminal who is not allowed to have a hand gun in one county can just move a few miles to another county and then legally get a gun.

"plotting to kill agents" is another way of saying "contingency plans are in place".

If we find planning from the DoD on how to quell an uprising, do we pursue charges against them for "plotting to kill American citizens"?

I think that somewhere in the hysteria of the last 30 years we have forgotten how detestable "thought crimes" really are. Somewhere along the way it became criminal to think in certain ways by being called "conspiracy" and "plotting".

Anyone who goes gunning for any other human is an idiot. But someone who makes contingency plans for various events is quite simply a "prepper".

a reply to: PhoenixOD

No its crazy that people who are using something that is naturally growing and being put in jail for it. Its just another case of government wanting their cut and then when they dont get it they toss you in jail.

Also I loved the way you called him a criminal. WHen in reality its the government that are the true criminals. You were trolling on him and should be ashamed for such a cheap shot.

Sputnik you need to get your record expunged. Its a bit of a pain but since it was a misdemeanor it should be no issue.
Then no one can call you a convicted criminal again and if they do you can sue for slander.

originally posted by: yuppa
a reply to: PhoenixOD

No its crazy that people who are using something that is naturally growing and being put in jail for it. Its just another case of government wanting their cut and then when they dont get it they toss you in jail.

Also I loved the way you called him a criminal. WHen in reality its the government that are the true criminals. You were trolling on him and should be ashamed for such a cheap shot.

Sputnik you need to get your record expunged. Its a bit of a pain but since it was a misdemeanor it should be no issue.
Then no one can call you a convicted criminal again and if they do you can sue for slander.

I was not trolling on him at all , i stated i thought the crime he committed and was convicted of was ridiculous.

As for suing for slander , you can only do that if a public statement made against you was false.