It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
originally posted by: Quadrivium
a reply to: Krazysh0t
I actually agree with some of that.
Government should have no place in marriage.
So your biggest problem is with Christians.
Lets look at it from an evolutionary stand point.......
If Christianity dies out something with fill the nitch. It will most likely be Islam.
Hmmmmm.....I wonder how some in that religion treat Gays or people who don't agree with them?
The word God on money offends you? That is what makes this "ALL IN YOUR FACE", sorry I don't buy it.
I will say this though, you will get what you want and it won't be much longer either. Maybe not in our life time but eventually.
I have read the Book and I know how it ends. And that is what all this is REALLY about.
originally posted by: MrConspiracy
I think if you read my comments at how disgusted I am with the greed you'll be well aware I know this involves the Vatican. It's disgusting and immoral. But these acts shouldn't overshadow the great things Christianity has done and teaches. Granted, it DOES overshadow these, naturally. But all I'm saying it.. GREED isn't the only thing Catholicism (in your case) has to offer.
Meh, dumb is a bit of a stretch. Like I said before, It's not all bad. But I agree that being run by man automatically makes it vulnerable to corruption. And I didn't "need" to hear it - It's 90% of everything I see on these kinds of topics.
Religion is in our faces? I've seen a complete denial of anything Religious in our faces for the past 20+ years. So maybe we're watching different TVs, reading different literature and hearing different things on the radio.
Give you what? Of course it SHOULDN'T be, that was the whole meaning of my post. It SHOULDN'T be corrupt... but it is. We don't live in a perfect world unfortunately.
All I was trying to get at is - People are SO quick to jump on the "lets hate religion" bandwagon and quickly become ready to take down every aspect of it. It's not ALL bad - It's produced some wonderful, helpful people, organisations and acts of kindness over the years. It's just such a shame these get overshadowed by the FEW in charge that decide to ruin it for everyone by making it seem like all religion offers is greed and child abuse. - That might sound deep, but that's what's happened.
originally posted by: one4all
a reply to: tsingtao
I am simply framing a belief system as what it really is, an agreed upon idea not a concrete reality.
Religons are not reality,and they do not carry any weight beyond that which any simple belief would carry,which isnt much beyond the individual or group subscribimg to it.
If you propogate an idea or a belief you are selling something to people that is not real,you are indoctrinating them into a reality which is not grounded.
The only way religon can be validated is when every human alive sunscribes to it.This means they all will try to sell themselves to you eternally,and this creates permanent human dischord and unrest.
When the ability to SELL belief systems is abolished them many religons will disappear through natural evolution.
You cannot use numbers and power and money and force to objectify an idea or a belief and then apply the rules of an object to that idea or belief system.
You can defend an object which is concrete in our reality but you cannot defend an idea the same way and religous people want to be able to do that in fact they NEED to be able to do that.
I dont care how many people you can get to buy into your illusion,if it is not concrete and real it carries no tangible weight or value.
If it carries no tangible weight or value then it cannot be defended as if it were in fact a tangible object.
To kill to support or propogate an artificially objectified idea is a Crime Against Humanity itself .
I believe that all religons are misinformed as to their correct histories,that the leadership groups are informed but are intentionally disconnected from the masses.
Religous leaders know very well that their doctrinal writings all originate from One True Humanitarian History,that they ALL have a common origin ,and that that origin DOES NOT subscribe to any diety of god ,NONE AT ALL.
The god concept and the diety concept was ADDED intentionally to Humanitys One True History.
If you read you bible or any religous doctrine from the major groups you will find the same accurate One True History of Humanity and there will NOT be any references to dietys or gods or anything not based in concrete univerdal natural forms.
Most religous people in general do not have the ability to seive through the contextual menings of their own doctrines and their leaders nurture and use this inability to tend their flocks.
Once you learn how to understand the dynamic structures of language and communication it is easy to decipher these doctrines and to glean from them ALL one cumulative symbiotic history ,ONE PARALELL TRUE HUMAN HISTORY,and it is definitively a History NOT a theological writing .
You could look at it this way,every single human who subscribes to the belief systems of any of the Major religons or their off-shoots is ON THE SAME PAGE,and is telling the exact same story,but they cannot see this quite yet enmasse.
Religous conflict is simply not possible ,the diety and god concepts are simply not possible ,BECAUSE WITHIN EVERY RELIGON RUNS A COMMON THREAD OR VEIN and this is Humanitys One True History which CANNOT be removed from them all,it simply is not possible due to the fractioning and varied evolutions of the original History over time and distance.
What I am teling you is that you can REMOVE the parts of every doctrine that is in existance that were put there or layered over time,there is a concise and accurate methodology with which anyone can do this with a book and a highlighter pen.
You can remove layer by layer the lies and adjustments to each of these stories or doctrines and break them all down to their specific origins or contextual DNA if you will.Even ater hundreds or thousands of changes over time the fabric of this One True History remains within each doctire,and this fabric CANNOT be removed unless you destroy ALL religons emanating from this One True History.
Now you see the problem I hope, the diety or god concepts were ADDED to major doctrines in layers over top of Humanitys One True Hostory and you CANNOT erase this evidence without eraseing the belief system and religon itself.So once you remove these layers that comprise the diety or god concepts then you immediatly disenfranchise the leadership of these groups and you immediatly disenfranchise the diety or god concept.You do not destroy these beliefs but you disenfranchise them from using Humanitys One True History for their own agendas.They must survive or not on their own true merits removed from a History they have no right to hi-jack and manipulate.
The evolution of Humanitys One True History has manifested within its interactions with all religons over time as the ultimate Trojan Horse like a virus.It cannot be removed.It has been carried from progrm to program to program over time hidden within the data.
originally posted by: Quadrivium
originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Quadrivium
Nope, don't see any of that nonsense happening.
4 big myths of Book of Revelation
Guess you got me on that one. We all know that the CNN Belief Blog is the leading authority on Bible Prophecy.
What was I thinking?
Elaine Pagels, née Hiesey (born Palo Alto, California, February 13, 1943), is the Harrington Spear Paine Professor of Religion at Princeton University. The recipient of a MacArthur Fellowship, she is best known for her studies and writing on the Gnostic Gospels. Her popular books include The Gnostic Gospels (1979), Adam, Eve, and the Serpent (1988), The Origin of Satan (1995), Beyond Belief: The Secret Gospel of Thomas (2003), Reading Judas: The Gospel of Judas and the Shaping of Christianity (2007), and Revelations: Visions, Prophecy, and Politics in the Book of Revelation (2012).
originally posted by: MrConspiracy
a reply to: Krazysh0t
I'm not going to quote every bit of what you said to reply, it's time consuming.
I'll sum up as effectively as possible.
You ask how something corrupt can lead you to the truth. But yet you ask that religion stays our of government. The hypocrisy is quite disturbing. Also, you look to Science for the truth, are you telling me there is no corruption in Science? Like I originally said, everything is corrupt - so don't blame us when we're trying to make the best of a bad job.
You also question God's intentions because Religion has become a corrupt mess. This holds as much merit as disproving God because a Tsunami hit. I'm bored of hearing the old "If God exists why would _______ happen" This world isn't perfect, it's a natural mess and we're at it's mercy... I can't see how Religion becoming corrupt means God doesn't exist. It's ran by man... What on EARTH did everyone expect? We were given free will, and it's been poorly utilized.
"Humans can do without religion" You tell me, in all honesty, what people would do if those in charge told everyone God didn't exist. The world would be in turmoil and everyone would do what they wanted regardless of any consequences. Religion has taught GOOD morals and kept people in check. And before you go on, the keeping "in check" has gotten out of hand in the past and once again I'd like to reiterate the fact that I KNOW religion has it's fair share of faults.
Religion or "faith" has contributed a lot to society and it's ridiculous to suggest otherwise.
originally posted by: th3dudeabides
You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.