I am the Patriarchy

a reply to: Dark Ghost

After all the links I posted to REAL research and the TRUTH about the GLOBAL GENDER GAP, which exists and is INTERNATIONALLY RECOGNISED and is being addressed in HUMAN RIGHTS ACTS and INTERNATIONAL TREATIES, in addition to all the stats showing earnings inequality in the US and just about everywhere else, all the rape stats etc and you are still denying the existence of any issues and taking offense at FEMINISM which is truly for GENDER EQUALITY and accusing feminism of victimising men and being a sham and some sort of international anti men conspiracy.

You need to reeducate yourself, if those are your own opinions you need to review how you perceive the world and if you got such ideas from others you need to ditch their theories fast.

Here it is again, the truth, feminism is about gender equality, fact!

originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
a reply to: redhorse


Women are capable of misogyny also, I was brought up by a female misogynist.

As for the psychological analysis of you, it wasn't, it was a parody, I was mocking your rash psychological analysis of the alleged human being /woman of the thread writers first post on the thread.

I was making the point that such rash and illogical ''instant analyses'' are best avoided, I made this clear after the mock analysis of you.

You assumed I was a man while accusing me of making assumptions.

You know. I admitted you had a point and you won't give an inch here. You assumed I was male and this affected your response to me, and yet you will not acknowledge your mistake. That is interesting. I am aware that you were couching a "mock analysis" and yet you were trying to get your digs in with it. I don't buy the "but I didn't really mean it..." defense very often. It's usually a sneaky justification for crappy behavior, and your demonstration of it was no exception.

Usually it is my experience that men in general and certainly MRA's (which the OPer likely is) are the ones who are caustically aggressive and completely incapable of civil, rational discourse when it comes to women's rights and feminism but this time it is the other way around. Why are you still so defensive and frankly angry with me? If it is because of the morally questionable assertion about the women with the door (which was your original rant aimed at me) then I admitted it was wrong. I'm not advocating men's rights over women's rights. I am advocating equality and pointing out that there is a vocal minority within feminism that encourages disparaging attitudes toward men. If the problem is not acknowledged it won't be addressed. Like it or not, you are doing a very good job of proving the OP's point and justifying some of that "vitriolic writing style" he spoke of.

I don't like the philosophy many Men's Right's Activists espouse. Their strategies are often more about perpetuating bitterness toward women that for some of them borders on psychopathic or sadistic. Now before you get your feathers ruffled over another internet psych eval. you should go see for yourself how often they speak of rape, mutilation and murder on some of those forums, especially on some notorious subreddits and even on A Voice For Men. It is unfortunate and telling that the OP is recommending that place, as hard as he is trying to be civil here. Although, I must say he has been more fair and reasonable in his interactions and assessments than you, which is exactly how they justify such hatred in the first place. In fact I do believe that the Southern Poverty Law Center has identified A Voice For Men as a hate site. And yet... This guy and those defending him here are presenting a more rational, reasoned perspective than you are.

I am a feminist. If you would call yourself one as well I am appalled and ashamed by your behavior here.

I couldn't care less if you are miffed about my opinion of which gender you are, I never stated any gender and frankly don't care, I never even considered it.

I was offended about the things you said about the alleged woman of the thread's topic, you called her ''unhinged'' etc, you don't know her or if it even happened, do you understand how ridiculous your presumptions of her were /are, I pointed out to you that I could make all manner of assumptions about you, I chose extreme examples, just as you did for the 'alleged woman' to prove a point.

I don't know you, I wouldn't post an actual psychological evaluation of you based on a post on a thread on ATS so if you don't like the extreme psychological analysis examples, perhaps you should refrain from dishing them out yourself.

Here's how I reminded you that such rash evaluations based on less than hearsay is offensive:

Now from your post I could say a whole load of stuff about you, I could call you ''psychologically damaged, narrow minded, egotist, harbouring delusions, hatred for women and an Oedipus complex''. Would you think that as okay, you know forming strong opinions of others based on, well a post, in a forum, or perhaps because you were mentioned in a post on a forum, you know in the style you just did, let's call it: ''instant psychology by conspiracy forum - get your analysis here'' .

here's your opinion of a woman you don't know, based on less than hearsay about a few words she allegedly said (in a calm and rational way), that you read about on an ATS thread:

If this happened to you then there was no reason for her to speak to you this way and frankly her oversensitivity is a little unhinged. If this is how she goes through her life, haranguing men who open doors for her, she must be psychology disturbed and frankly, exhausted. I don't think it is something I would do, but letting the door close on her was appropriate; although I don't know why she would laugh (guffaw), it just seems like she manifests an off-kilter response to pretty much everything. I don't know if it is logical or even appropriate to use a one-off with a clearly chemically unbalanced person as a lead in for why feminism as an ideology is bad.

OP,what the hell you try to change the mind of nazis?
Most of human(more than 70%) just believe what they want to believe.
Can't change them ,but troll them is okay.

a reply to: theabsolutetruth

Where exactly did I deny that women around the world face issues? Stop putting words in my mouth.

I said that feminism was not about equal rights, but rather women's rights. So far, you have shown nothing that counters that assertion.

Feminism is about GENDER EQUALITY, fact!

Those that can't see that aren't worth talking to or spending time trying to educate. Go argue amongst yourselves, I have better things to do.

originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
Feminism is about GENDER EQUALITY, fact!

Those that can't see that aren't worth talking to or spending time trying to educate. Go argue amongst yourselves, I have better things to do.

How about woman who disagree with feminism and agender and androgynous people ?

0.0

a reply to: redhorse

I have been victimized in ways that tell me that patriarchy does exist and some men do these things and get away with it; so no, I can't agree with the OP that the patriarchy doesn't exist. Nor can I agree with many of his own assumptions and conclusions that he comes to because of them. He leaps pretty far and lets resentment, anger and fear color his judgment.

Here’s my reasoning, and I hope we can discuss it.

First, my resentment, anger and fear are not apparent nor admitted in any of my writing, and such a diagnosis is founded on nothing but the same assumptions and leaps of faith you speak of. So we’ll leave each other’s emotions as inconclusive for the moment, unless of course you were to ask rather than assume my state of mind. But if you get tired of assuming, as we all do, I will gladly forthcoming in regards to my emotions whenever asked.

I think anyone can agree that suffering, subjugation, oppression, tyranny and social hierarchy isn’t limited to one gender; and both men and women, regardless of gender, age, race and class get away doing “these things” (whatever that may be) to other individuals. If we can look beyond the point of view of all human beings then the problem is far greater than any gender specific subordination. If equality is to be promoted, limiting services to gender-specific cases isn’t going to cut it.

If there is a patriarchy, the male isn’t the only one to blame for its persistence. %50 percent of the world’s population has as much to do with defining, designating and fulfilling 100% of societal roles as the rest of the 50%. The positions of oppressor and oppressed are open and filled by all genders. Anything less than that is sexism. Generalizing men into oppressors and women into the oppressed is utter sexist propaganda, group-hatred, which demonizes an entire %50 of the world population, most of which have never harmed nor oppressed anyone in their lives. No one is innocent nor guilty according to their gender.

a reply to: theabsolutetruth

Feminism is about GENDER EQUALITY, fact!

Those that can't see that aren't worth talking to or spending time trying to educate. Go argue amongst yourselves, I have better things to do.

Please stick around. Your insights are valuable to this discussion. Let's justify our ideologies. We'll both be better off.

I just want to understand. What rights do I have that you don't? I'm not necessarily an advantage seeking individual and may have missed my opportunity.

a reply to: candlestick

How about woman who disagree with feminism and agender and androgynous people ?

Yes. It could be argued that there are more genders, who would be the forgotten ones in this whole debate.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope

I never see feminist care the gender equality of genderqueer people...

originally posted by: theabsolutetruth
Feminism is about GENDER EQUALITY, fact!

Those that can't see that aren't worth talking to or spending time trying to educate. Go argue amongst yourselves, I have better things to do.

I came to this same conclusion. I also laughed out loud at myself for arguing with an angry man about what feminism is! LOL For what it's worth, Les Mis, I think the title of your post is very correct. You are advancing and supporting the patriarchy.

Have a great time, guys.

When, i, as a male, going to benefit from this so called Patriarchy that is existing now?

Men only college benefits? cant let them get any smarter.
Men studies? Who needs these, we have great TV role models.
Men rape support groups? forgot, men cant get raped.
Men dying for the sake of industry and country since start of humankind? they are meant to be disposable.

If a real patriarchy is at work, men can go in, do w/e they want to women, and not get jailed for it. But it seems the opposite is true.

Wanna beat your husband knowing he can't beat you bask in this patriarchal world? don't worry police wont take their complain seriously.

yeah, the infamous patriarchy at work.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

I came to this same conclusion. I also laughed out loud at myself for arguing with an angry man about what feminism is! LOL For what it's worth, Les Mis, I think the title of your post is very correct. You are advancing and supporting the patriarchy.

For what its worth, I find your sexism deplorable and highly irrational. I'm allowed an opinion. But, then again, you're just a bitter woman, aren't you?

Good luck!

a reply to: luciddream

Because it occurs only in the dreams of feminists, while real suffering goes unchecked and unnoticed.

I'm disappointed to think I gave anyone the impression I was angry or upset. Anger is pointless in these discussions. I am here to assist others and myself in attaining a greater understanding of this world, ourselves, and our relationship with it and each other. I am not here to cut anyone down, whatever the gender. As I said, I am animist, which means I support the well-being of all life, and to that end, I will defend the rights of all creatures.

However, seeing as how this thread appears to be drawing inexorably towards its close, I will take my leave and hope that when we meet again, there will be no hard feelings.

a reply to: LesMisanthrope
There are two bits from the OP that convinced me there wasn't a real discussion to be had in this thread - the first is this:

Feminism, by name, excludes me. Why? I don’t have a feminine bone in my body, and as such, I cannot be a feminist. There’s no room for me in any feminist theory, except that I am allowed to play the part of the oppressor in their fantasies, or that I should be a feminist, so that I can, like them, promote one gender at the expense of my own.

LesMis - you seem like you have a pretty good grasp of the English language - and yet you don't seem to understand what the word feminist means. Surely the concept of male feminists is not something you're unable to comprehend - how amusing is it that you'd rather appear ignorant for a moment and hope that moment passes quickly so you can make a point you can't really defend and have this thread take the course you set for it?

Well, it's very amusing :-)

While I have some doubts that the scene you described in the OP happened exactly the way you said it did, I have to say that the second thing that convinced me there's nothing here to discuss is this:

In apology for my oppressive act, I let the door go and it closed on her mid-stride, thereby allowing her to struggle with her shopping bags. I walked away in silence as she guffawed and shook her head in ironic indignation.

For shame...You are no feminist - that much is true. But - neither are you a gentleman

Fomenting discord - tsk tsk tsk

Undoubtedly we will all learn a valuable lesson about exclusion towards the end of this thread - after a confession

Me thinks

:-)

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

lol did you just reply by saying, he is at fault for holding the door and he is also not doing the right thing for letting the door slam at the person?

Man ... boy ... Damn!, there is no winning is there?

a reply to: luciddream

Not in this thread - no winning - no reasoning. It's nothing but playing on people's emotions that keeps things moving forward

:-)

I believe in taking responsibility for your beliefs, philosophies - ethics and being true to your own self. It's about integrity

If you are the sort of person that would let a door slam on someone because you were miffed - it seems to me you're the sort of person that doesn't do things because they're the right thing to do: you do them for effect

Simple

So, yes - coming or going he's shown his true nature. He doesn't have to support feminist ideals (that he clearly doesn't understand anyhow), but - he's demonstrated (if what he's said is true) that he's childish and petty at best, calculating and manipulative at the other end of the spectrum

I'd love to hear him defend himself though

Yeah - always up for that

:-)

My biggest hang-up with feminism has been beautifully articulated in this thread in many different ways but there is one point of contention that I feel has not been addressed yet and would likely never be especially by any self proclaimed 'feminists'.

The Patriarchy is real. There is no denying that fact. The issue with me is feminists seem to think that simply because you have male genitalia that you're auto-sent your membership card and welcomed in like a long lost brother! Couldn't even type that with a straight face!

The reality is that beta males and below are the FAVORITE target of oppression by these males in power. Those of us males who don't have power or net worth or influence are the slaves of the patriarchy. So many of us males who lack these things have no choice but to be under the thumb of our alpha male masters. And the biggest issue here is that we are LOWER on the ladder than you ladies! Think about it! You ladies have more power than any low ranking male out there. We are the most abused, least thought of, least cared for demographic on earth! But of course you ladies don't give a damn about anyone's plight but your own. Which is where this thread came from if I had to guess.

Just a view from a different perspective ladies. I FULLY expect it to be ignored or at the very least misinterpreted.