To all who believe in ghosts.. Let me put this myth to rest!

reply to post by Arnie123


Um... The OP has been a member longer than you have...

Krazysh0t
reply to post by GalaxyEyes

 

Have you read this book? Flatla nd: A Romance of Many Dimensions

It's about a 3d object (a sphere) interacting with the 2d world and how everything perceives it.

I've not, but I'll look out for it.
I'm not really into books though. I never seem to have the time and any free time I get is usually spent on music, internet or social activities.

What puzzles me is that from time to time, out of the corner of an eye, I'll see what I think is the ghost of a cat or dog, but I never catch anything that looks human, different 'wave' length?

br0ker
This should be extremely reasonable to most people. Yet I'm shocked how you can be so unscientific about the fact.

If a ghost should be able to move things, manifest itself to be viewed, or make sounds then it HAS to be a physical entity. A non-physical entity can not, in ANY way MOVE physical things. To be seen it needs to be physical as well, otherwise there is NO way to reflect light.

And most of all, to interact with you, it would need a brain. No physical entity=no brain=no mind and thought.

And the physical part of what you call a ghost is long gone and buried. It is only buried bones, if anything at all.

So, lets put this to rest. Unless you have some kind of scientific facts that would make all this mumbojumbo possible?

edit on 11-3-2014 by br0ker because: Spelling

Talk about a troll thread........What the heck I bite. I have only seen one ghost one time.



My ex-wife worked as a nurse with the dying elderly. She called one night from work and said she was going to be late because a patient had asked her to sit with her while she died. This ladies name was Ruth and her family did not want to be with her while she died. My ex was a good person and decided to sit with her in her last hours. My wife came home and life went on as normal and we turned in for the night.





In the middle of the night I woke up and noticed a gray shadow standing looking over my wife. I was not afraid and felt calm in the room as I watched I said wow and my ex said you see it to. Then my ex said it's ok Ruth go on up to heaven and the shadow just vanished.




I have never seen another one since. This is the gods honest truth. Ghosts are real.

br0ker
reply to post by woodwytch

 

I disagree and suggest that you read the OP again yourself.

I stand by my words.. there can be no such thing as a ghost, doing what it is defined to do. Something I made REALLY clear why can`t be done, both in my OP and throughout the thread. Read all my answers and you might get it.

And to those of you that think of energy like something without any mass.... I suggest you read up.

Trust me I read your OP twice because I couldn't believe anyone could be quite so adamant with such naivety the first time I read it

We seem to have reached a stalemate because I too stand by MY words ... however ... I am prepared to eat my words and make a public apology on this very thread if you can show me the evidence you have to back-up your claims made in your OP ... I did make this request in my earlier post but you must have missed it ... not a problem I will give you the benefit of the doubt and will assume that you just forgot to add it ... because for you to be so certain of your points you must have something you can show us or links you can offer to confirm your points.

It's fine to have a healthy scepticism if you have not personally experienced any form of the paranormal (specifically in this case ... 'ghosts) but it is a shame that you are so close-minded about the subject to a point of dismissing it out of hand and remember ... just because you say it doesn't exist does not make it so ... maybe you deny the possibility because of the old 'fear of the unknown' philosophy ... it makes me wonder how you explain other forms of energy e.g the wind and gravity (as another poster mentioned some pages back) because they are also invisible ?

I bet you don't believe in Witches either ... and yet here I am ... a practising Witch for 30yrs lol

Woody )O(

br0ker
reply to post by schuyler

 

Any real scientific facts or reasoning in it that would make it worth the read, or just more jibbrish and philosophies?

The Earth being round and not flat was nothing more than "jibbrish and philosophies" as well at one time... or more appropriately it was nothing more than a theory.

reply to post by br0ker


You see, that's the problem with people. They want to put everything in little boxes. Anything that doesn't fit inside a little box must be wrong, evil, nonsense, etc. etc.

Tell me, how many forms of energy are you aware of?

Let me help you out.
1 Mechanical energy
2 Kinetic energy
3 Potential energy
4 Mechanical work
5 Elastic potential energy
6 Surface energy
7 Sound energy
8 Gravitational potential energy
9 Thermal energy
10 Chemical energy
11 Electric energy
12 Nuclear energy

We can even subdivide them even further if you wish... We can also categorize them differently such as heat, thermal, intrinsic, radiant and so on and so forth. And we can go a different direction and describe endothermic and exothermic types of energy (reactions)...

Now take any one of those variants of energy as an example. Go back X amount of years and try to describe the energy to 10 random laymen on the street. How many of them would believe you? How many would think you are talking witchcraft or are simply crazy?
Let's take electricity - it's an easy example. You travel back 300 years. You get 10 random people from the street from all walks of life... You explain to them about electric potential energy. You tell them about volts and amps and joules and resistance and how it all works together to make a light bulb burn without an open flame. You tell them that you have seen this happen with your own two eyes.
Now ask yourself, honestly, how many of those people would believe you?

My point being that the age old saying is still valid:
You don't know how much you know until you know how much you don't know.

How long before yet another form of energy is discovered? Dark energy perhaps? Dimensional energy? The potential is unlimited. (Or perhaps limited only by your imagination?)

You think you know everything there is to know about "the rules of nature"? Has every single scientific fact been discovered?

If you are so convinced that science can explain every single thing, please delve into these and solve them as well:
The Paradox of the plankton. Is Gause's law not so much a law, but rather just some general guidelines?
What is the structure of water?
What is the long-term heat balance of Earth?
Do any odd perfect numbers exist?
It's raining but I believe that it is not raining. True or false.
Why did the universe have such low entropy in the past, resulting in the distinction between past and future and the second law of thermodynamics?
Why do we dream?
Can you describe navy blue to a born blind person?
Can you explain quantum entanglement, because it kinda breaks Einstein's laws of physics?
Can you draw a 3-dimensional picture of time?

I can go on and on, but I think the point has been made. We are insignificant insects in terms of the big scheme of things. We don't know squat. Just because we can't explain something doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Just because something doesn't fit into the little box marked - "Things I think I know" - does not make it "mumbojumbo".

reply to post by Gemwolf


Oh my, I cannot wait to read the OP's reply to Gemwolf's post ... should be interesting as it seems to concisely encapsulate what most of us have been trying to say throughout the thread.

Woody )O(

reply to post by Gemwolf

Oh wow. That' was beyond excellent. I wish 'we the people' at ATS had applause to hand out.
I think the OP has been 'out scienced' . Tons of common sense in that post. Awesome.

br0ker

alienreality

br0ker

GrimReaper86 reply to post by br0ker

 

So I don't suppose you believe in the wind or electricity or gravity either? All of which are non phsyical entities that have real phsyical impacts. Energy is force, and only energy is necessary to generate force or to impact the physical. So if a ghost is a form of energy, they can likely find ways to generate force as well. Especially with electricity, and our brain; is a collection of electrical impulses. So a non phsyical floating entity with the power to manipulate electricity may infact have some level of intelligence. Also, I've seen a ghost. In person. Even for someone who claims to have a scientific way of disproving ghosts, you sure do have a narrow view of what science is capable of.

Better go back to the books mate! You need some kind of mass to create energy and you need mass to contain energy. Wind is gas in motion by pressure. Gravity is excerted by mass and space, and electricity is electrons contained. That is also is the case with "force", for example mass in movement. So Sir, what contains your ghostly "energy", for it not to diccipate or change?

Photons have no mass.. and they are energy ... so there is one of those flaws you wanted me to point out..

Stop using your own version of science to support your claims..

I'll play.. Ok, so how would you create photons from NO MASS?
So your ghosts are photons flying around everywhere or do you contain them by your quantum mech?
Lol

Never said photons were what ghosts are made of. And why would I need to create photons in the first place?

First you totally lose an argument and prove not only your own ignorance, but now you are replying with complete gibberish...
LOL? Were you you also laughing at yourself? Well, they say that the best therapy is being able to admit when you are sick..
Perhaps not all is lost for you after all..

By the way, this is just a troll thread since you can't debate in any logical way except to begin with ad hominem style replies when you are proven wrong.

xavi1000

You remind me of Putin, but hey, that's ok.. Who am I do stop you from expressing yourself.

alienreality

br0ker

alienreality

br0ker

GrimReaper86 reply to post by br0ker

 

So I don't suppose you believe in the wind or electricity or gravity either? All of which are non phsyical entities that have real phsyical impacts. Energy is force, and only energy is necessary to generate force or to impact the physical. So if a ghost is a form of energy, they can likely find ways to generate force as well. Especially with electricity, and our brain; is a collection of electrical impulses. So a non phsyical floating entity with the power to manipulate electricity may infact have some level of intelligence. Also, I've seen a ghost. In person. Even for someone who claims to have a scientific way of disproving ghosts, you sure do have a narrow view of what science is capable of.

Better go back to the books mate! You need some kind of mass to create energy and you need mass to contain energy. Wind is gas in motion by pressure. Gravity is excerted by mass and space, and electricity is electrons contained. That is also is the case with "force", for example mass in movement. So Sir, what contains your ghostly "energy", for it not to diccipate or change?

Photons have no mass.. and they are energy ... so there is one of those flaws you wanted me to point out..

Stop using your own version of science to support your claims..

I'll play.. Ok, so how would you create photons from NO MASS?
So your ghosts are photons flying around everywhere or do you contain them by your quantum mech?
Lol

Never said photons were what ghosts are made of. And why would I need to create photons in the first place?

First you totally lose an argument and prove not only your own ignorance, but now you are replying with complete gibberish...
LOL? Were you you also laughing at yourself? Well, they say that the best therapy is being able to admit when you are sick..
Perhaps not all is lost for you after all..

By the way, this is just a troll thread since you can't debate in any logical way except to begin with ad hominem style replies when you are proven wrong.

Ok sir! Sure, you won! I surrender! You're the big winner of the arguments.

But just a reminder, this thread is about ghosts and the reasons I gave why they can't exist. So if not about ghosts, why are you talking about photons?

Why don't you just give me the best possible scientific explenation as to what your ghosts are, since I alteady declared you the winner

reply to post by Gemwolf

Really, nice to see all the work you put into saying that science have been proven wrong, and science keeps expanding. A simple "everyone used to think the earth was flat and the sun had orbit around Tellus, would suffice.

With that said, I wont start breaking down your post on my crappy Iphone 5. Lets just say that it all is totally meaningless if you cant relate it to how ghosts can exist and what you believe they are.

Now I'd like you to take your wide perspective, and consider how many of the energy forms and scientific extrapolations you mentioned have their basis in fundemental rules of physics and laws of nature. Now think of how they fulfill eachother. Sure, you mentioned a couple there we haven't fit in the pussle yet. But, the basics will live on, they might change a bit with the frame, but they will still be fundamental pieces.

You can't build a house without a good foundation. And the universe, if you consider everything we've learnt so far, isn't built without it either.

As for what we don't know, we still put it into our framework. It isn't standalone pieces.

reply to post by MrWendal

Once in a while one in a billion theorys are proven to be correct. If we follow your saying here we would also put our trust in the 999 999 999 gibbrish ones as well. Is that what you do?

And it was never PROVEN that the earth was flat. It was just a common belief and misconseption. Flock theory if you will..

Now, I feel it's time I asked all of you a question. Since I cant say that I've seen any working theories here with any kind of basis except belief, faith or the flat out "I've seen them, so yeah!"

And what are the most common explanation to how they can appear and disappear? And how can they be seen or exist in our physical world?

When you answer. Remember the common constraints that usually follows the "ghost label". Like people saying the ghost looks like an old man that slams the doors in the house.

I'm looking forward to the answers. Who knows, maybe someone here can blow my mind and make me adapt a reasonable possibility!?

br0ker
reply to post by MrWendal

 

Once in a while one in a billion theorys are proven to be correct. If we follow your saying here we would also put our trust in the 999 999 999 gibbrish ones as well. Is that what you do?

And it was never PROVEN that the earth was flat. It was just a common belief and misconseption. Flock theory if you will..

So why can't ghost existing be one of those? It has not been PROVEN they don't exists, that is just a flock theory ...

brOker, your arguments are so limited that you remind me of someone. I am not trying to put you down, rather I would like to help you to expand your mind to see the realms of possibility.

Many people have given first hand accounts of that which you declare can't be real.

Science is about expansion of knowledge, not about dogmatic adherence to a set belief system.

You are limiting your understanding, limiting your potential by dogmatic views.

You could be trolling for fun. You are not going for stars and flags although your opponents do well in this regard.

So, I will give you a truism of REAL science.

YOU CANNOT PROVE THAT SOMETHING DOES NOT EXIST!

That notion is central to science. It is central to all forms of logic.

All you can do is to say, I cannot sense this thing, I cannot measure this thing.

At any point in the history of scientific discovery, there have always been people laughing at individuals for their efforts. In fact many huge awards are given to people who have discovered something in spite of the science community. Madame Curie is one of the famous ones. The Nobel Prize is sometimes given out as an "We are sorry" award.

Here you are, with the wealth of knowledgeable people on ATS, arguing the impossible.

Many, many people in science tend to believe that science has all the answers.

Hell, they can't even tell you what causes gravity, one of the most fundamental forces of the universe.

YOU CANNOT PROVE THAT SOMETHING DOES NOT EXIST!

P

reply to post by Gemwolf


Pwned.

Sremmos80

br0ker
reply to post by MrWendal

 

Once in a while one in a billion theorys are proven to be correct. If we follow your saying here we would also put our trust in the 999 999 999 gibbrish ones as well. Is that what you do?

And it was never PROVEN that the earth was flat. It was just a common belief and misconseption. Flock theory if you will..

So why can't ghost existing be one of those? It has not been PROVEN they don't exists, that is just a flock theory ...

edit on thThu, 13 Mar 2014 19:59:17 -0500America/Chicago320141780 by Sremmos80 because: (no reason given)

I'd say you might very well be wrong on that one. 1 in 5 was it? Say that they've seen a ghost. I really think that more than half believe in ghosts. Going out on a limb here, don't have any research to back up the numbers. But if I'm right then the flock is the believers. Just look at this thread.. 99% believe..

As for proving something doesn't exist, thats a fools argument. And there are plenty of people that have gone into "haunted" houses with film/audio/temperature recording equipment and come back with z e r o after weeks of research. Maybe some random static. No film of a transparent guy.. So I guess ghosts are really smart(even without a brain) or just terribly camera shy. So I feel it really is somewhat documented that they do not exist where everyone say they do.