Historical data shows vaccines are not what saved us

reply to post by ArchAngel_X


It comes down to the laws of similar and the laws of exact. When vaccines started they would use similar disease strains but ones that had no possibility of human illness. EG: Smallpox and cowpox, where a person was injected with cowpox to elicit a response that built natural antibodies to fight off small pox. Now we are using laws of exact, we are inoculating kids in some cases before they get the first breast milk ( hepatitis) before the immune system is strong enough to handle it. They over whelm the immune system with diseases now one right after another. Our immune systems does not work that way. Then you look at the manufacturing of these shots et al... In 1992 they were outsourced to India and he UK, since then autism has went from one in 500,000 to 1 in 7 in 2010. Last year the Italian Supreme court ruled that Inoculations have a direct link to autism, and right after the FDA came out and said that they get a lesser quality of shots than we do here in the US. All shots worldwide are manufactured at the same facilities.
TPTB do not care, because if a child has bad side-effects then he is destined to be on prescription drugs the rest of their lives. I wander why so many just blindly follow and get shots because they are told to....The ones that are pro inoculations, do you even know what a shot contains? They are shooting it directly into the bloodstream bypassing most of our defense systems. Just keep blindly following when you turn into a zombie, the rest of us will say man, that was a good shot......

tigershark1988
reply to post by MichaelPMaccabee

 

Provided vaccines worked most of the time and were completely safe, I don't think there is a high enough incidence of rabies in most western nations to merit vaccinating yourself against it. You just go and get checked if you are bitten by a racoon, bat, dog, ect. Not dangerous if caught early.

You are aware that the treatment for rabies is vaccine, right?

Sure, you could go the Milwaukee Protocol route, and play the odds (less than 50% survival rate), or you can take the vaccinations, with survival rates much higher.

To date, only 3 people in the world have survived without treatment of rabies.

bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

As a member of Rotary, I can attest to how effective the polio vaccine is. The last haven of polio is in India, where distrust of vaccinations has prevented the populace from being completely vaccinated. There are people who go house to house trying to sell people on the vaccine.

India was declared polio-free by the WHO in 2012 or 2013. Polio is endemic in Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Nigeria, where there is religious and conspiracy-theory based objection to the vaccine.

MichaelPMaccabee

tigershark1988
reply to post by MichaelPMaccabee

 

Provided vaccines worked most of the time and were completely safe, I don't think there is a high enough incidence of rabies in most western nations to merit vaccinating yourself against it. You just go and get checked if you are bitten by a racoon, bat, dog, ect. Not dangerous if caught early.

You are aware that the treatment for rabies is vaccine, right?

Sure, you could go the Milwaukee Protocol route, and play the odds (less than 50% survival rate), or you can take the vaccinations, with survival rates much higher.

To date, only 3 people in the world have survived without treatment of rabies.

edit on 2-11-2013 by MichaelPMaccabee because: (no reason given)

The chance of catching rabies is about as good as you winning the lottery.

FurvusRexCaeli

bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

As a member of Rotary, I can attest to how effective the polio vaccine is. The last haven of polio is in India, where distrust of vaccinations has prevented the populace from being completely vaccinated. There are people who go house to house trying to sell people on the vaccine.

India was declared polio-free by the WHO in 2012 or 2013. Polio is endemic in Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Nigeria, where there is religious and conspiracy-theory based objection to the vaccine.

Those countries you listed are some of the poorest in the world, its not lack of vaccine that polio is endemic far from it, its poor sanitiation, dirty food and water, lack of education and unhygeine that contribute to the high numbers of polio, vaccines have nothing to do with preventing disease.

breadinspector

MichaelPMaccabee

tigershark1988
reply to post by MichaelPMaccabee

 

Provided vaccines worked most of the time and were completely safe, I don't think there is a high enough incidence of rabies in most western nations to merit vaccinating yourself against it. You just go and get checked if you are bitten by a racoon, bat, dog, ect. Not dangerous if caught early.

You are aware that the treatment for rabies is vaccine, right?

Sure, you could go the Milwaukee Protocol route, and play the odds (less than 50% survival rate), or you can take the vaccinations, with survival rates much higher.

To date, only 3 people in the world have survived without treatment of rabies.

edit on 2-11-2013 by MichaelPMaccabee because: (no reason given)

The chance of catching rabies is about as good as you winning the lottery.

That doesn't speak to the effectiveness of the vaccine treatment, nor does it makes the vaccine ineffective.

reply to post by MichaelPMaccabee


www.cdc.gov...
That might.

beta.dawn.com...

tigershark1988
reply to post by MichaelPMaccabee

 

www.cdc.gov...
That might.

beta.dawn.com...

It helps to read the conclusions too.

There are several possible explanations for the observed failure of HDCV and HRIG to protect against rabies in these cases. Although the timing of vaccine administration was similar to the recommended schedule in both cases (2), vaccine was given in the gluteal area. A reduced antibody response has been shown when hepatitis B vaccine is administered in the gluteal area instead of the deltoid (3). Presumably, subcutaneous fat in the gluteal area may interfere with the immunogenicity of HDCV. Moreover, only saline solution was used to flush the Thai patient's wounds. Cleaning bite wounds with saline alone has been shown to be less effective in decreasing the risk of rabies than cleaning with anti-viral solutions, such as soap and water (4). Finally, persons with severe bites to the head and digits, sites of rich innervation, are more likely to develop rabies than persons bitten elsewhere (5). Inoculation of rabies virus near or into the peripheral nerves might bypass the protection conferred by rabies immune globulin and vaccine, both of which are ineffective after the virus invades the nervous system. Evidence did not indicate immune deficiency in these patients or decreased immunogenicity of the vaccine lots. Also, HDCV has been shown to be stable even when exposed to high ambient temperatures for up to 11 weeks (6).

Approximately 18,000 persons receive rabies postexposure prophylaxis in the United States per year (CDC, unpublished data). Severe attacks by rabid wild animals and dogs like that suffered by the Thai patient are rare in developed countries. No treatment failures have been reported when the recommended postexposure prophylaxis regimen of wound cleaning, HRIG, and 5 doses of HDCV have been strictly observed (2). Although the reasons these two patients developed rabies are unknown, proper wound management and proper administration of HRIG and HDCV might have prevented disease. Wounds inflicted by animals suspected or confirmed to be rabid should be immediately and thoroughly cleaned with soap and water. If anatomically possible, up to half of the HRIG dose should be infiltrated around the wound and the rest given IM in the gluteal area or lateral thigh. For postexposure prophylaxis, adults and children should always receive HDCV IM in the deltoid. Infants can be given the vaccine in the anterolateral upper thigh.

2 cases of it not working? Woo…

Immune Globulins usually have a success rate of 70,000/1

If 70,000 are treated and protected, but 1 person isn't does that make it a failure?

The answer is no.

In this case, the treatment was not performed under perfect conditions, nor in the recommended way. We don't even know what the exact circumstances are. We do know however, that failures are regularly investigated.

What was your point again?

tigershark1988
reply to post by MichaelPMaccabee

 

Provided vaccines worked most of the time and were completely safe, I don't think there is a high enough incidence of rabies in most western nations to merit vaccinating yourself against it. You just go and get checked if you are bitten by a racoon, bat, dog, ect. Not dangerous if caught early.

You realize there are a dozen diseases that have a 48-72 hour window to treat and the treatment is Immune Globulin and vaccines right?

I know, one of them saved my life (or drastically improved my future prospects.)

Rabies being one of them, see post above.

reply to post by breadinspector


Quite so!

One doesn't always die of what one is told is going to kill you.

Been there. Got the T shirt!

Fifteen years on still alive and kicking.

FEAR is a tool used in many 'industries'.

Buy our deodorant otherwise the women won't fall at your feet!

Have our vaccine........or you'll die or be left seriously disabled!

Same old game.

Having said that, I am still very pro vaccine for those who WANT vaccine, just don't force people who do not want them is my only objection to those who are adamant about having the vaccine that they are offered.

breadinspector

boncho

tigershark1988
reply to post by MichaelPMaccabee

 

Provided vaccines worked most of the time and were completely safe, I don't think there is a high enough incidence of rabies in most western nations to merit vaccinating yourself against it. You just go and get checked if you are bitten by a racoon, bat, dog, ect. Not dangerous if caught early.

You realize there are a dozen diseases that have a 48-72 hour window to treat and the treatment is Immune Globulin and vaccines right?

I know, one of them saved my life (or drastically improved my future prospects.)

Rabies being one of them, see post above.

So millions of people get autism and other severe reactions to vaccines including death yet coincidently you who most likely is a pharma shill, has his life saved, yeaahhhhh surrrreeee and im the queen of england.

High possibility your lying just to prove a point, but lets say for a moment you were really in life threatening position which you clearly werent, whos to say you would have survived anyway without the vaccines? Theres a highly likely chance you would have survived anyways.

edit on 11-3-2013 by breadinspector because: (no reason given)

The disease I was exposed to cuts 20-30 years off most people's lives. I also came down with pertussis as a child and nearly died, it was shortly after I received all of my immunizations. I have neither developed autism, nor have I developed any of the diseases I was immunized for.

As I mentioned before, can you please give me the autism rates for the 1800s? Thanks. For reference, and This post.

Link

reply to post by breadinspector


You seem to be very ready believe that anyone who dares to contradict you is a liar. Desist.

breadinspector

FurvusRexCaeli

bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

As a member of Rotary, I can attest to how effective the polio vaccine is. The last haven of polio is in India, where distrust of vaccinations has prevented the populace from being completely vaccinated. There are people who go house to house trying to sell people on the vaccine.

India was declared polio-free by the WHO in 2012 or 2013. Polio is endemic in Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Nigeria, where there is religious and conspiracy-theory based objection to the vaccine.

Those countries you listed are some of the poorest in the world, its not lack of vaccine that polio is endemic far from it, its poor sanitiation, dirty food and water, lack of education and unhygeine that contribute to the high numbers of polio, vaccines have nothing to do with preventing disease.

Tell that to India. Tell that to Bangladesh. Tell that to Liberia. Go find a list of countries ranked by per capita GDP and start at the bottom ... no matter how poor or unhygienic the country is, it will not have endemic polio, except for Nigeria, Pakistan, and Afghanistan. You'll also find an outbreak in the Somalia, derived from the Pakistan/Afghanistan strain. All four countries have something in common that you didn't touch on: Islamic terrorists are actively trying to prevent vaccination, issuing fatwas and killing international health workers. One might draw a conclusion from that.

When the polio eradication campaign began in 1988, there were 350,000 reported cases. In 2012, there were 223. This is not due to sanitation, education (?), or hygiene. They did not install giant Brita filters in the Ganges or deploy construction crews to build sewers in 120 countries. They sent health workers all over the world to vaccinate children. That's it. A crippling disease is very nearly extinct in the wild, and it's happening right now, in your lifetime. Isn't that exciting?

www.polioeradication.org...

bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by PplVSNWO

 

Some do.

However, the same happens in Mexico and many other countries. yet they don't have polio.

Take Uganda, for an example. They drink water from dirty puddles in the street. Yet no polio.

Really? Because a quick google search for polio outbreak Uganda comes up with many results for polio outbreak being declared in Uganda, around 2010.

reply to post by PplVSNWO


True. See below for some reasoning behind that outbreak (quoted from above on this page):

FurvusRexCaeli

bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by Wrabbit2000

 

As a member of Rotary, I can attest to how effective the polio vaccine is. The last haven of polio is in India, where distrust of vaccinations has prevented the populace from being completely vaccinated. There are people who go house to house trying to sell people on the vaccine.

India was declared polio-free by the WHO in 2012 or 2013. Polio is endemic in Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Nigeria, where there is religious and conspiracy-theory based objection to the vaccine.

When people are vaccinated, they don't get polio. That was the gist of my argument. Do you disagree?

Yeah ok I guess smallpox just decided after thousands of years that it just didnt want to live anymore and kill itself ok

I also suggest looking at rabies.

If you are bitten by a rabid animal and you dont get the vaccine with 10 days you are dead 100% of the time, be you well fed or in good hygeine. There is no exception you get a horrible slow painfull death.

Get the vaccine and your fine.


So yeah.....

By the way Im a microbiologist who spend a number of years on the production line. I know how they are made, tested and what goes in them.

O and as for flu and HPV vaccine yeah I agree they are a waste of time.


But MMR,Menigitis B, Polio, Tetnus, Heb B, Yellow fever, TB I would very very recomend them were needed.

Dont listen to the anti vaccine crowed they will get you killed.


As I say to most of the Anti Vaccination crowed.
Whats your education or work Background?

Are you a Doctor?
A Immunologist?
A microbiologist?
A nurse who deals with vaccines?
Someone with any Bioscience qulifications what so ever?

If not one should not be giveing medical advice.

MichaelPMaccabee
reply to post by breadinspector

 

Millions of people have gotten autism or died from the MMR vaccine?

Do you have -any- kind of evidence to support this, because I am seriously very interested in this claim and would love to see the evidence.

At univirsity we had to exmain this claim.

There was one study (where the rumour came from) that could not be repilcated, contained numerous missing sourses and suspect data as was basicaly a 3rd rate study that if some dimwit in the press didnt get hold of on a slow news day would never have been published and forgotten on the heaps of science rubbish.

But alas a tabloid ran with it and now we have every morom and dimwit takeing it as gosbal.

Wrabbit2000
. After all, this isn't Cholera we're talking about

I know but to the Anti vaccine crowed (normaly uneducated or mentaly ill) they cant tell the diffrence between a viral or bactria infection let alone what infections are sanitation based, what ones are zoological and what ones are living in the enviroment natrually. To then one is all the same.

breadinspector

Hi mate my intel are private sources within the medical field and government.

I call hoax.

HOAX!!!!!!!


I have not only worked in the medical industry but also know many that do, all have been vaccinated (except for a few like me who snub flu shots) all my lectureres at university were vaccinated.....so yeah....your talking rubbish.

I think your sources are in your head.