Why are there So Many Radical British Muslims?

reply to post by stargatetravels


There is a danger that we could bury our heads in the sand over this issue, but that will only give strength to the far right. If we keep ignoring there is a problem and not discussing it in the open, it only serves the far right propagandists.

There are preachers of hate in Mosques up and down the country intent on radicalising young people, if we ignore this, then we will see more atrocities that will only drive more people into the arms of the far right.

reply to post by ollncasino

Not sure why so few people have a difficult time understanding.

The United Kingdom's history is one which was so proud of all the nations they had attacked, invaded, conquered and subjugated, that they coined the term "the empire on which the sun never sets".

So after decades if not centuries of violence, the Brits are complaining about immigrants who have entered their country LEGALLY.

Seems like karma to me.

But in the interest of solving the issue, heres a proposal: they leave your country so long as you leave theirs, fair enough?

Guess what, you will NEVER leave the Middle East or any other nation which your government feels is strategically important.

Less than two years ago, the British government bombed Libya... So I guess youre just going to have to deal with it?

Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by stargatetravels

This is something that I find a worrying trend. In my short time on ATS I've noticed some truly troubling and poisonous posts and threads, masquerading as questions and intersting debates.

If we can put political correctness (which as served to stifle legitimate debate) aside, can we agree that polls by respected polling organizations show that many British Muslims hold opinions that can be best be described as radical?

Many non Muslim white brittons also hold radical views. What exactly is your point?

Originally posted by muse7
Not just hatred of Muslims, but hatred of immigrants in general. It seems that everyday we get a new thread whose sole purpose is to demonize immigrants. Its a really disturbing path ATS is going down

I think you will find that the days of you being able to shut down debate on legitimate issues of concern by simply yelling bigot or the like are a thing of the past.

On the other hand, I don't doubt for one moment that many British Muslims are normal people like you or I. But I also don't doubt that a significant proportion of British Muslims are radicals.

Why so many radical Muslims?

Because they want to take over the world. I even heard this sprouted from the mouth of a non radicalist Muslim on BBC yesterday, and even he said Islamic faith has a problem and must fight against itself.

He also said it was easy for people of the musilm population to become radicalized, due to the fact that many do not intergrate, they stay in close knit societies. He said they don't become part of British society, they go to the mosques and discuss things like Palestine and middle eastern affairs, instead of the country in which they now reside and the problems that they should get involved in here in Britain. They represent The middle east mostly and this is the problem, because it's all about integrating into the society in which you live.

Originally posted by woodwardjnr

There is a danger that we could bury our heads in the sand over this issue, but that will only give strength to the far right. If we keep ignoring there is a problem and not discussing it in the open, it only serves the far right propagandists.

Exactly.

Pretending that a problem doesn't exist with radicalization of Muslims in the UK is solving nothing.

reply to post by ollncasino

What can be stated is that there are a large number of radical Muslims in the UK. But why?

It's because the civilized world is too civilized to stop them from coming in. Religious freedom will have us all in chains within a hundred years.

Originally posted by gladtobehere

The United Kingdom's history is one which was so proud of all the nations that they had attacked, invaded, conquered and subjugated, that they coined the term "the empire on which the sun never sets".

Apparently there are few countries in the world that the UK hasn't attacked at some point.

On the other hand, Islamic imperialism has a long and aggressive history that predates the UK's formation in 1707 by some 1,000 years.

Muslim's are proud of their imperialist history. It was all in the name of Allah.

I don't really see what Muslim immigrants bring to our tables, either British or French. They're poor, ill educated, backwards. Maybe that's why they come here, to improve themselves. But they need to do that on our terms, not theirs. Some might say that the problem in France is even worse than Britain's, with predictions that 30-40% of the "French" population will be Muslim within only a generation, thanks to immigration, high Muslim birth rates and poor white French birthrates. As the French population ages, it means a majority of our young people will soon be Muslim and that change will work it's way through the demographics of our societies for the rest of the century.

Why do so many radicalise ? Idlesness, drug abuse, gang cultures, also a liberal culture amongst the public services which accords these people many rights with no responsibilities whatever. Radical preachers exploit all that, they carefully, ever so craftily get these people to do their bidding, to carry out atrocities that they are so keen to avoid doing themselves. These preachers tread a fine line, a line which needs changed to ensure that those who give moral support of any kind to murderers, even just the refusal to criticise their actions, that these preachers should be lose their freedoms in the same way they deny others theirs.

A politician Tebbit once proposed a "cricket test" for the non white community in England i.e. you had to make your choice between England, India, Pakistan, Jamaica etc and stick to it. No more "our lands" where you talk romantically about some godforsaken third world hellhole you haven't even visited let alone lived in.

The EU needs a similar test. Pass it, become as us and stay here as long as you like.

Fail it and get the hell out.

Originally posted by muse7
Not just hatred of Muslims, but hatred of immigrants in general. It seems that everyday we get a new thread whose sole purpose is to demonize immigrants. Its a really disturbing path ATS is going down

I think you're right, the islamaphobic posts are basically just a cover to bash foreigners and immigrants anyway.
These racists realise that people's opinions have change and the majority have no issues with immigrants and foreigners, so these groups and individuals have now moved on to 'legitimate' concerns and are just tapping into the fear and concerns many people have.

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin

We have had a Muslim population in the UK for longer than my grand-parents have been around to being Asian and Muslim is just as British as being white and Christian get over it.

"one swallow does not a summer make"

I am afraid that you are trying to rewrite history in claiming that we have had a Muslim population longer than your grand-parents have been around.

Before WWII, the Muslim population of the UK and in the West in general was so small as to almost not exist. Even up until the late 1980s and early 1990s, number were incredibly small.

Why do we have so many now?

Due to the mass immigration in the last decade.

Originally posted by stargatetravels
I think you're right, the islamaphobic posts are basically just a cover to bash foreigners and immigrants anyway.

These racists realise that people's opinions have change and the majority have no issues with immigrants and foreigners, so these groups and individuals have now moved on to 'legitimate' concerns and are just tapping into the fear and concerns many people have.

My partner is of another race and my son is mixed race.

Please taking your foolish accusations of racism elsewhere.

If you want to debate, then do so.

Originally posted by woodwardjnr
reply to post by stargatetravels

 

There are preachers of hate in Mosques up and down the country intent on radicalising young people, if we ignore this, then we will see more atrocities that will only drive more people into the arms of the far right.

Of course there are, there is a very real and serious problem with hopeless and impressionable young men being recruited by extremists.
Some mosques are absolutely polluting the minds of these men and radicalising them, nobody is denying this, I think most have read the reports, seen the footage.
That, however, doesnt mean that we all of a sudden have to start listening to the BNP or those like the OP.
They're not suddenly decent people with legitimate concerns, they're extremists who are masquerading as concerned citizens.

Of course there is a debate to be had and course there is a problem, but we're not now going to sit around and listen to Nick Griffin and ask his thoughts are we? Tommy Robinson? I hope not.
The OP? I really hope people don't take anything they say seriously.

Even if they were(and they're not) 100% right in what they're saying, their agenda and ulterior motives mean that we cannot forget why they are saying the stuff they are.
We have to be very careful and there really is a problem, I agree 100% with your, but we also must realise these right-wing extremists do not have the answer, nor do they have anything productive, constructive or worthwhile to say.

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
OP, do me a favour keep this rubbish for your EDL meetings, most of your statistics are based on a sample of 500 (one i noticed was a American report) ,

You appear to be somewhat ignorant of statistical sampling techniques and how surveys are carried out.

Here is a link that may enlighten you

Statistical Sampling - What Is Statistical Sampling

reply to post by ollncasino

Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by gladtobehere

The United Kingdom's history is one which was so proud of all the nations that they had attacked, invaded, conquered and subjugated, that they coined the term "the empire on which the sun never sets".

Apparently there are few countries in the world that the UK hasn't attacked at some point.

On the other hand, Islamic imperialism has a long and aggressive history that predates the UK's formation in 1707 by some 1,000 years.

Muslim's are proud of their imperialist history. It was all in the name of Allah.

You're proving my point.

People like you wont even admit the long standing tradition of your nation's imperialism. Just two years ago, your government attacked yet another so called "Muslim" nation, Libya.

Then you'll be complaining when Libyan immigrants start to pour into your borders.

Enjoy your karma?

reply to post by ollncasino

Radical British Muslims.........
Witch-hunting became a full time profession.
The accusers and prosecutors grew rich on the confiscated wealth of the condemned. Politicians, business competitors, and even jealous wives quickly learned that they could dispose of a rival with impunity with a simple accusation of witchcraft
Hatemongering against Muslims lies in a simple fact.
Like the ancient Christians.
Muslims forbid usury, or the lending of money at interest. And that is the reason our government and media insist they must be killed or converted.
They refuse to submit to currencies issued at interest. They refuse to be debt slaves.
When both the people and government refuse to borrow any more, that is when wars are started, to plunge everyone even deeper into debt to pay for the war, then after the war to borrow more to rebuild.
When the war is over, the people have about the same as they did before the war, except the graveyards are far larger and everyone is in debt to the private bankers for the next century.

So off to war your children must go, to spill their blood for the money-junkies' gold

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
Islam as a religion is not the problem the problem is the minority within the faith that have a twisted interpretation I implore you to stop with your hate of Islam.

I am not going to get into a debate with you i find your view truly disgusting and abhorrent, I hate them, I think this type of xenophobia you and other preach on ATS should be stamped out like Resists and homophobia. For you to say that “Islam is the problem” is just as hateful and wrong as saying “all black men rape little white girls”.

Its stupid

Just stop it.

I agree 100%. Like it or not, some religious people (of any religion) are extreme in their beliefs. Just as some non-religions people are. Religionist trash like this shouldn't be tolerated on ATS, IMO. I personally don't tolerate bigotry of any kind.

Originally posted by ollncasino

Originally posted by gladtobehere

The United Kingdom's history is one which was so proud of all the nations that they had attacked, invaded, conquered and subjugated, that they coined the term "the empire on which the sun never sets".

Apparently there are few countries in the world that the UK hasn't attacked at some point.

On the other hand, Islamic imperialism has a long and aggressive history that predates the UK's formation in 1707 by some 1,000 years.

Muslim's are proud of their imperialist history. It was all in the name of Allah.

Ofcourse there is some nations the UK never attacked, Islamic imperialism if you want to call it that was very similar to Christianic imperialism then wasn't it?

Afterall we in Europe were feudal in our ways of control and so was our nemesis of the day, to cherry pick my words I'd say that the Christianic empire was just as extreme and expansion based as the Islamic empire but that was ok because it was all in the name of Jesus, holy spirit, god.

On a different note:

Your polls on your OP are as bad as hair product advertisements on TV... 95 percent of women asked said they would use it again - read the fine print and only 50 women were asked. Hardly a good representation is it?

I do have a serious question for you though, After we send all the muslims (a lot british born muslims) to some other country because they are all extreme, will you be saying the same thing about those who hail from the republic of Ireland?

Because I know without any help from "polls" that the Irish have done more spouts of extreme based attacks than any follower of Islam has managed yet here in England/UK.

If you keep telling someone they're thick... eventually they will start to act like an idiot. I hope you get what I mean from this and stop what you are doing.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
I agree 100%. Like it or not, some religious people (of any religion) are extreme in their beliefs. Just as some non-religions people are.

Its the large proportion of British Muslims with radical beliefs that is worrying.

It isn't just British Muslims either

• Nearly Half of U.S. Muslims polled believe that critics of Muhammad should be criminally prosecuted

• 58% said criticism of their religion or of Muhammad should not be allowed under the Constitution.

• 1 in 8 American Muslims polled believe that Muhammad's critics should face the death penalty.

Link
Link

What is it that makes so many British and American Muslims so radical?

Could it be Islam itself?

reply to post by ollncasino


Well played...and from the time stamp, it only took you 4 minutes to shut me down.





Thank you for reminding me that Wit and Sarcasm are light weight attributes.


Karma much?


More than most chief...