A thread designed to prove or disprove God once and for all.

When the first single celled microorganism emerged on Earth, it emerged already ready to survive, thrive, and grow. Its as if they knew before they were born, that when they emerged, they were going to need to survive, grow, and thrive.

I think proof of life before life-form exists in the answer to the question, "How did the first life form emerge already equipped to make copies of itself?" To be able to make copies of yourself, you need to have the equipment to do so. For the first life form, that equipment emerged with it. How does that happen? Procreation is also based around survival, but also based around the form itself's equipment. So this, not the previous one is the big question: "Which came first, (A) the concept of survival, or (B) the physical mechanisms of survival?"

If you answered (A), then answer, "How is there a concept of survival before the first life form existed to be able to conceptualize?"

If you answered (B), then answer, "Why would the first life form emerge with survival mechanisms, if there wasn't a prior need to survive?"

Now you might think of some better questions to ask, and you might not know for certain the answer to the above questions, but just answer them to the best of your knowledge. I think these questions can prove or disprove God.

Bible says not to partake in idle debates. One can't "prove" the existence of an infinitely all power being through discussion by and infinitely flawed organism. Were that not the case, faith wouldn't be a requisite of entrance into heaven. It is for each man to decide and sadly most people have the arrogant mindset that man is the greatest thing since sliced bread and that even though we admit to not knowing 1% about the universe, we somehow feel we know enough to stand up and say "There is no God, because if there were He would come and prove himself to me, a literal nobody, with less importance than a fleck of sand in the expanse of the universe, that doesn't believe in Him anyway."

The arrogance of humanity is unfounded but we are hard headed and stubborn. No amount of typing is going to convince anyone here that there is a God.

reply to post by smithjustinb


Procreation is not about survival as you say it just appeared from nowhere. IT produces life with life inside it. A baby girl is born with every egg (ovum) she will ever have.
Life lives.
Survival is a man made concept that produces fear.

Originally posted by smithjustinb
When the first single celled microorganism emerged on Earth, it emerged already ready to survive, thrive, and grow. Its as if they knew before they were born, that when they emerged, they were going to need to survive, grow, and thrive. think proof of life before life-form exists in the answer to the question, "How did the first life form emerge already equipped to make copies of itself?" To be able to make copies of yourself, you need to have the equipment to do so. For the first life form, that equipment emerged with it. How does that happen? Procreation is also based around survival, but also based around the form itself's equipment. So this, not the previous one is the big question: "Which came first, (A) the concept of survival, or (B) the physical mechanisms of survival?


If you answered (A), then answer, "How is there a concept of survival before the first life form existed to be able to conceptualize?"

If you answered (B), then answer, "Why would the first life form emerge with survival mechanisms, if there wasn't a prior need to survive?"

Now you might think of some better questions to ask, and you might not know for certain the answer to the above questions, but just answer them to the best of your knowledge. I think these questions can prove or disprove God.

Damn, with this thread been on ATS' n all, I genuinly thought this was the thread that will end all debate about god. But it doesnt, its just another question, the title is pretty false. Maybe it took millions upon millions of attempts by different microorganisms to achieve ability to survive. More than likely it was one attempt out of many that sparked the 'survival gene'

Back to your title:

We do not have the ability to prove or disprove god, its never ending debates on stances people are taking on the basis of their own knowledge - which varies from person to person, city to city and country to country, then onto other religions and so forth.

I don't see how this thread is going to prove or disprove god - To me, what I got from this thread is a question of whether or not the first microorganisms had the survival gene and my answer to that would be no, as above.

reply to post by smithjustinb


I do not believe you will be able to do so. Just from a standpoint of someone who is religious, look at it this way. Religion is based upon what? Faith. Faith that out there is a creator watching over us, and waiting until we join him again. If there was indisputable evidence that he did exist than faith would no longer be required. One would just know he exists. I am sure if we had a way to tear apart the fabric of this dimension and see God on the other side churches would be full every Sunday. I however do not believe this will be possible. If seeking out God requires you to have indisputable scientific proof than so be it, but prepare to wait a very long time.

When the first micro-organism arrived, being the first and having no environmental problems per Se, It probably flourished unrestrained. The first problems it encountered were probably mutations of itself. I don't see your point.

Originally posted by smithjustinb
When the first single celled microorganism emerged on Earth, it emerged already ready to survive, thrive, and grow. Its as if they knew before they were born, that when they emerged, they were going to need to survive, grow, and thrive.

I think proof of life before life-form exists in the answer to the question, "How did the first life form emerge already equipped to make copies of itself?" To be able to make copies of yourself, you need to have the equipment to do so. For the first life form, that equipment emerged with it. How does that happen? Procreation is also based around survival, but also based around the form itself's equipment. So this, not the previous one is the big question: "Which came first, (A) the concept of survival, or (B) the physical mechanisms of survival?"

If you answered (A), then answer, "How is there a concept of survival before the first life form existed to be able to conceptualize?"

If you answered (B), then answer, "Why would the first life form emerge with survival mechanisms, if there wasn't a prior need to survive?"

Now you might think of some better questions to ask, and you might not know for certain the answer to the above questions, but just answer them to the best of your knowledge. I think these questions can prove or disprove God.

I am not sure about those questions, and, that is not where i would even start.
Until you have attempted to truly discover what you are, you cannot even begin to foment the questions asking where you are from, or anything else and expect to provide anything like the right answer.
I have tried to discover exactly what i am, i discovered that within us there is literally a metaphysical flower that is connected to our finer and subtle enrgetic body that is founded upon our chakras.
They are real, and when aligned, a Flower bud breaks from the base of your skull stands upright, and unfurls a flower, the 1000 pettaled lotus, over your head.
It is a physical happening, i would begin by asking, is the creative energy that designed us to have this inside us, the same creative energy that created the universe and everything in it.
My guess is yes, based on experience, their is a God force, and either way it would mean, their is a "Human" God force that has created us, or, there is a God force that created the Universe and us, Either way its a positive outcome, their is a God.
Until people make the effort to do more than say, "I'm blind, i see nothing, but i know nothing exists because i don't see it", existence will never hold anything but the wrong answers for them.

reply to post by smithjustinb


I don't think those answers can prove or disprove god. The universe is big and the odds are not in favor of those microorganisms being developed here. How do we know whether or not these mircoorganisms weren't created by another intelligent life form that isn't god? But, did god create the other intelligent life form?

I beleieve the thread type you just created is called "Highway to the danger zone. Ride into the danger zone"

.

First what is Everything ?

Energy Right ?

Second are you Conscious ?

If you answer yes then Consciousness is part of the fabric of the universe .

Consider ... if Consciousness is Energy and part of the field of Energy that we call the Universe .

Couldn't this collective field of Consciousness be referred to as God ?

That's as close to proof as you will get ... and You're It

.

reply to post by smithjustinb

When the first single celled microorganism emerged on Earth, it emerged already ready to survive, thrive, and grow. Its as if they knew before they were born, that when they emerged, they were going to need to survive, grow, and thrive.

I think proof of life before life-form exists in the answer to the question, "How did the first life form emerge already equipped to make copies of itself?" To be able to make copies of yourself, you need to have the equipment to do so. For the first life form, that equipment emerged with it. How does that happen? Procreation is also based around survival, but also based around the form itself's equipment. So this, not the previous one is the big question: "Which came first, (A) the concept of survival, or (B) the physical mechanisms of survival?"

Slow down, partner! First, you have to define "life."

Originally posted by R0CR13
.

First what is Everything ?

Energy Right ?

Second are you Conscious ?

If you answer yes then Consciousness is part of the fabric of the universe .

Consider ... if Consciousness is Energy and part of the field of Energy that we call the Universe .

Couldn't this collective field of Consciousness be referred to as God ?

That's as close to proof as you will get ... and You're It

.

If we use this kind of logic to prove things then damn we may as well all start believing in leprechauns, unicorns and 50ft dragons.

reply to post by smithjustinb


Your hypothesis assumes that life originated on Earth. I highly doubt that Earth is the first planet to exhibit life and it's highly likely that life arrived on earth. Maybe through the intervention of a comet or asteroid or maybe Earth is the scientific project of a civilization trying to propagate itself

At any rate, you haven't proven the existence of a creator god to me.

Originally posted by Watts
Bible says not to partake in idle debates. One can't "prove" the existence of an infinitely all power being through discussion by and infinitely flawed organism. Were that not the case, faith wouldn't be a requisite of entrance into heaven. It is for each man to decide and sadly most people have the arrogant mindset that man is the greatest thing since sliced bread and that even though we admit to not knowing 1% about the universe, we somehow feel we know enough to stand up and say "There is no God, because if there were He would come and prove himself to me, a literal nobody, with less importance than a fleck of sand in the expanse of the universe, that doesn't believe in Him anyway."

The arrogance of humanity is unfounded but we are hard headed and stubborn. No amount of typing is going to convince anyone here that there is a God.

I think this is a very good post, save for a couple of quick things. One, the assumption that we know even 1% about the infinite universe is, IMO, wrong. We understand so much less than that. Also, I wish that you wouldn't denegrate humanity so much. I understand your position, I do, but to reduce humanity also reduced God. We are special, infinitely so...and He loves us. We deny that, and that is the arrogance of which you speak, but that arrogance doesn't apply to God. He doesn't view us as flecks of sand, He loves us each as children. Peace my friend...

"A thread designed to prove or disprove God once and for all."


i51.tinypic.com...

.

reply to post by n00bUK



If you don't like science then stick to religion .

Fact is Consciousness is part of the universe since we can validate this for ourselves there is no need to look for proof ..

.

reply to post by smithjustinb


Wow, you REALLY limit your views don't you?

Why only "A" and "B" as choices, how about the infinate alternative possibilities?

btw, things were living and reproducing WAY before they "emerged" from the sea on earth so how can you not take that into consideration in your O.P?

Is it because you then cannot define something that doesn't fit your preconception and belief and dismiss and ignore it out of fear of revelation?

Very poor concept.

Originally posted by R0CR13
.

First what is Everything ?

Energy Right ?

Second are you Conscious ?

If you answer yes then Consciousness is part of the fabric of the universe .

Consider ... if Consciousness is Energy and part of the field of Energy that we call the Universe .

Couldn't this collective field of Consciousness be referred to as God ?

That's as close to proof as you will get ... and You're It

.

How could the consciousness be collective if you are only conscious of yourself? Are you aware of every human at every time? Highly unlikely.

To the OP, I would rather ask this question:

Which is more apparent, that there is a god or there isn't a god?

.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope


How is it collective ?

Because All Energy is part of the fabric of the universe .

I'm not saying that Individuals are God .

I'm saying the collective consciousness makes up God .

You are part of this field of energy as an individual but you reside in a dimensional construct called reality .

So we are Multidimensional Beings .. existing within a dimensional construct

Just as time /space exists within our shared reality it is contained by dimensional aspects .

Consciousness on the other hand permeates everything and contains everything .

The fact that we cannot access all of it is a dimensional constraint .

This will become evident when you die .

.

"God" is such a poorly defined concept that it can be neither proven or disproven, and it's pointless to try. Those who believe do so without bothering with logic and reason, or what would be the point? Those who do not don't care.