G Edward Griffin - chemtrails come from commercial jets

In response to this letter on his website ,

CHEMTRAILS AT 11,900 FEET?
2012 Apr 20 from Gina
Hi Mr. Griffin,
Today I came across an old post of yours while searching the web for Plane Finders. I recently put the Plane Finder app on my iPhone, and the first time I used it, I ID'd a plane which was leaving a long white trail that came up as "unidentified." I thought I was on to something! But since then, most of the planes I have come across are simply commercial jets traveling to and from LAX- and some of them do have lingering trails.

Recently, I realized that some of these planes forming the trails are way too low to be doing so. I am attaching a few pages with some detailed info on a Virgin America flight today, which was leaving a thick bright white trail which was broken in some areas, but lingered about 30 minutes before disappearing. The problem is, it was only at 11,900 feet! (There have been some which were even lower leaving trails.) Additionally, it was hot and dry today where I live in Calabasas, so I doubt the conditions were correct, but nonetheless, the trail was clearly there. I have done a cut and paste of everything I could think of to document what I saw, including the weather report, the screen from my iPhone, photos of the trail, the flight status from LAX, and a calculation of what the temperature most likely was at the altitude of the plane.

My son (age 23) has done his best to try and convince me there is something going on - now I might agree. Could you look at my report?

Chemtrail guru G Edward Griffin has written -

REPLY FROM GEG:
Hello Gina.
Your comprehensive report is greatly appreciated. You definitely are on to something. We get similar reports from the Las Vegas area. We now know that most persistent trails do come from commercial jets. I suspect there is something added to the fuel that crystallizes at temperatures at around 30 degrees F. Your report will help a lot. Thank you, and please send us anything else that is in this category.

- From here - check for a submission from 20 April 2012

G Edward Griffin has previously asked for people to use programmes such as plane finder to identify chemtrail producing planes - from the wording perhaps he has enough data to now make this conclusion??

Also I note that he thinks there is something in the fuel - well that should be easy to find - buy some fuel, analyse it against the approved standard for Jet A1 - anything other than what is in that standard will be illegal interference with the operation of civilian aircraft.

If there is nothing out of spec in it then presumably "something" must be being added onboard - so that should at least enable chemtrail believers to narrow down their search to look for systems to transport, store and mix "something" onboard the aircraft, or perhaps of fuel trucks servicing them??

Either way it's got to be win-win for everyone right? No more need to run around looking at every scenario, no need to try to show that it's only military aircraft or some small "dedicated" subset of civilian aircraft? In short it should be possible to identify the culprits a lot more easily thanks to this information!

When I worked for the Guberment, we were testing synthetic fuel in our jet engines. It was a 100% synthetic jet fuel. i know alot of the airlines are doing a syn-fuel mix.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

I don't usually respond in chemtrail posts. I have more than a mild interest in the subject--but it's just so difficult to get a fix on. You might say there's not enough real information, and more than enough misinformation and disinformation on it. I'm always hoping someone will get a solid fix on it and break it wide open.

Anyway, I just wanted to say some encouraging words. Chemtrails are, I believe, more of a problem than most people can comfortably admit. I'm always looking forward to somone obtaining hard, undeniable evidence. And I think it's not far away. Thanks for you efforts, and here's hoping this is a productive line of inquiry....

reply to post by Jetman44


Yeah but synthetic fuel only differs from "natural" in its origin - if it meets the same specifications then the actual chemical makeup is the same.

So synthetic Jet A1 will still meet Def Stan 91-91.

And if it doesn't then that would certainly be a problem.

Otherwise they will need to introduce a new designation for the different makeup, or revise the standard to allow it. Either of these would be obvious.

So basically the article points to a, probably, mundane answer to the question.. something in the fuel that crystallizes forming persistent trails.. I will refrain from the term contrail OR chemtrail at this point..

I don't know how reliable this report is .. or the people mentioned.. but if correct, it points away from the idea of an intentional chemical spray with the intent of controlling the weather, our minds, or our health.. and it adds some sense to the notion .. the idea of chemtrails as normally proposed usually seems completely illogical to me because if it's for the purpose of controlling the weather, it doesn't do a good job of it at ALL .. and if it's for controlling our minds, well don't forget those same people spraying it have to breathe it ( as does their friends and family ) .. SO .. finally a rational possibility that rides the line of plausible and also not nefarious =) .. I'm on board .. if it can be proven.

If this line of logic holds true, I would expect it to be nothing more than a fuel additive or something along those lines..

If this is partly down to the low altitude at which the alleged chemtrails were produced,back in the 1970s on quite a few occasions I saw jet airliners making contrails as they took off from Gatwick airport at an altitude of about 200 feet AMSL.This only happened on days when it was at or below freezing but I can't remember if they persisted or not.

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


running out of bs aren't you

you know damn well it's from military and unregistered/unmarked private planes
otherwise weedwhacker-proudbird and his fellow commercial pilots would have slipped up
a loooooonnnng time ago, and given themselves away.

saaaay....you used to be a military pilot yourself weren't you?


sigh...

yet another "Aloysius the Gaul chokes the chicken using his mental powers" thread
destined to crash and burn

reply to post by DerepentLEstranger


Don't blame me - G Edward Griffin is a "big name" in chemtrail believers and has actually done some work studying the issue - if you have an problem with his data or conclusion go take it it up with him.

Originally posted by DerepentLEstranger
reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul

 

saaaay....you used to be a military pilot yourself weren't you?

nope. Where did you manufacture that idea from?

reply to post by miniatus

it's disinfo/muddying the waters
see my previous post

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by DerepentLEstranger

 

Don't blame me - G Edward Griffin is a "big name" in chemtrail believers and has actually done some work studying the issue - if you have an problem with his data or conclusion go take it it up with him.

never heard of him, if he says its commercial flights he is mistaken or lying

reply to post by miniatus


It's only an anecdotal report from the correspondent, and GEG doesn't actually say anywhere that I can see what his conclusion is based on - but as linked to in my OP he has asked for information about flights from all around the world for a year or so.

I'd be interested in the data if you can find it, or in any actual data (and not just outraged disbelief) that contradicts it.

Originally posted by DerepentLEstranger
reply to post by miniatus

 

it's disinfo/muddying the waters
see my previous post

So you are saying that GEG is a disinfo agent or something similar?


Based on what? That you don't like what he says, or some actual evidence??

reply to post by Aloysius the Gaul


as you, weedbird and other pilots have pointed out
too many people involved to keep it a secret

or are you calling your fellow contrailers liars?

you are playing a game here is all

and i'm not interested in playing

adieu

reply to post by DerepentLEstranger


Contradicting how??

I have posted a claim by a chemtrail believer because I think that credible and organised attempts to identify chemtrails are very important.

Why are you opposed to people knowing what is going on n the chemtrail community?

Why do you not want people to know this??

Chemtrails are real; they are not a hoax based on misidentification of normal contrails.

www.youtube.com...

Also, check out the website of "Weather Modification, Inc." at www.weathermodification.com...

The air over the US, and probably elsewhere, is being actively treated on a daily basis with chemicals. This is NOT the byproduct of jet-fuel combustion. End of conspiracy theory.

reply to post by draco49


You are right - the air is being "actively" treated by the output of millions of cars and factories as well.

Jet engines are a minor part of the "treatment".

But that said did you want to actually say something relevant to this thread??

Originally posted by draco49
Chemtrails are real; they are not a hoax based on misidentification of normal contrails.

www.youtube.com...

Also, check out the website of "Weather Modification, Inc." at www.weathermodification.com...

The air over the US, and probably elsewhere, is being actively treated on a daily basis with chemicals. This is NOT the byproduct of jet-fuel combustion. End of conspiracy theory.

In my world they're not real.That video (and everything else tanker enemy is connected with) has been debunked many,many times.The so called "nozzles" are the fairings over the flap hinges and the contrail that forms behind them (nothing is being sprayed) I imagine is water condensing in the low pressure area behind them and the colours are formed the same way a rainbow does,no chemicals other than hydrogen and oxygen mixed 2/1 is needed for this to happen.

Originally posted by Aloysius the Gaul
reply to post by draco49

 

You are right - the air is being "actively" treated by the output of millions of cars and factories as well.

Jet engines are a minor part of the "treatment".

But that said did you want to actually say something relevant to this thread?? :puz

I thought this thread involved the issue of whether or not chemtrails were real, or just the byproduct of normal jet-fuel combustion. If I was mistaken, I apologize. If you are saying that, like other fossil-fuel combustion (i.e. cars and factories), chemtrails are just the product of the same process (combustion), you are incorrect. Chemtrails are produced by the deliberate spraying and expulsion of chemicals, not related to the combustion and propulsion of the aircraft spraying them. It is a separate process employed to modify weather and possibly other purposes. The claim that chemtrails are merely a byproduct of jet-fuel combustion is just factually incorrect.

Originally posted by Imagewerx
In my world they're not real.That video (and everything else tanker enemy is connected with) has been debunked many,many times.The so called "nozzles" are the fairings over the flap hinges and the contrail that forms behind them (nothing is being sprayed) I imagine is water condensing in the low pressure area behind them and the colours are formed the same way a rainbow does,no chemicals other than hydrogen and oxygen mixed 2/1 is needed for this to happen.

LOL you're certainly free to believe what you want and live in whatever reality suits you. But in the 3 dimensions most humans exist in, chemtrails are caused by the spraying of particular chemicals (silver iodide). Contrails are the byproduct of jet-fuel combustion, and they dissipate rapidly due to the high moisture content; they do not linger in the skies in discernible patterns for hours after the plane has flown by. This is not a secret and it's not news. Again, end of conspiracy theory.

I have to say something, (believe it or not) once again on this subject. Let's start with approved additives in jet fuel. The ex-Dupont, (now a copyright of Octel Starreon) Stadis 450 is a static dissipator added to jet fuel, Stadis 450 contents are proprietory/aka/secret, as are other additive jet fuel products,and contains Barium. More unknowns, and organic materials, perhaps more Barium forms are being used in the other additives and lubrications. This brings us to the engine itself and the capabilty to produce yet more chemical reactions via the high heat and the fuel contents, some of which are unknown, which will have various exhaust chemistries at different altitudes, and those chemistries will also be unknown/are unknown unless the full range of ingredients are known, and even then it would take a whole heap of extrapolation in testing to get the big picture. I'm not too sure where the OP is coming from, but the title of the thread is correct, the context is debatable. Contrails are chemtrails in their own right, in a bigger way than just talking about exhaust gases.

reply to post by draco49

This is obviously something you need to read up on,cloud seeding as is suggested by the name implies the seeding of CLOUDS (big thick fluffy ones) with silver iodide to try to make it rain.They will not spray expensive silver iodide into a clear blue sky where it will fall harmlessly to the ground.
Am I allowed to also say "end of conspiracy" as I saw with my own eyes on many occasions back in the 1970s persistent contrails that lasted for hours and only spread out VERY slowly,and while watching the skies was told accounts by my dad of the same thing over the skies of souther England back in the early 1940s during the battle of Britain?