I finally broke down and did it

OP....some of the posts of people that support your purchase to enhance your survival chances by owning a shotgun...

...ask them why they use the word Kill so often...

if that what's you bought it for and that's what it means to you...enjoy becoming a killer, i suppose.

but if that's what you are all about...why worry about survival? you won't survive like that..

...ask you new friends why they have continually used that word.


some of them might be killers themselves...and they know they aren't going to survive.

misery loves company.

reply to post by michaelbrux


Very true,no doubt because of my nature,but more important is the When where and why.I'm wired to defend by attack,when fired upon.

reply to post by michaelbrux


We use the word "kill" because in a survival situation you can "kill" animals to eat, You can "kill" anyone who attempts to harm your family or anyone you care about. You can "kill" anyone who threatens the resources you hold to provide for your family.

some of them might be killers themselves...and they know they aren't going to survive.

So only those with swords and body armor will survive then? What makes you think that we think we won't survive? Not a single one of us has said anything along those lines.

Just because you own a gun (even for survival) doesn't mean we are sitting around praying for things to kill. I know many people who own firearms and have never killed anything with them. Firearms are used for recreation as well as killing.

Me, I'm not worried about suvivaql at all. I have all the necassary skills for just about any situation I could find myself in.

Originally posted by usmc0311
reply to post by michaelbrux

 

We use the word "kill" because in a survival situation you can "kill" animals to eat, You can "kill" anyone who attempts to harm your family or anyone you care about. You can "kill" anyone who threatens the resources you hold to provide for your family.

some of them might be killers themselves...and they know they aren't going to survive.

So only those with swords and body armor will survive then? What makes you think that we think we won't survive? Not a single one of us has said anything along those lines.

Just because you own a gun (even for survival) doesn't mean we are sitting around praying for things to kill. I know many people who own firearms and have never killed anything with them. Firearms are used for recreation as well as killing.

Me, I'm not worried about suvivaql at all. I have all the necassary skills for just about any situation I could find myself in.

one thing the historical record reveals is that...if a survival situation emerges...the vast majority of you won't survive...i certainly will remain, and you probably can look upon me and realize this...but not you guys.

i've not read a single story were a society collapsed and was then successfully reestablished by people who know how to kill things.

its almost as if the universe has stacked the deck against the survival of things who's only skill is killing things.

history also shows clearly that men with armor and a small sword not only survive but thrive. probably because they don't think that being able or willing to kill is the key to survival.

guns are useless in the situation where society collapses and survival is your only concern. they require ammunition and anyone that has a surplus either won't sell it or will sell it at a price that's not reasonable. why would someone sell ammunition to a stranger when the stranger might decide to use that very ammunition against the person that sold it? you should really think about this.

the Constitution gives us the right to bear arms...Guns is just your interpretation. arms is subject to many interpretations.

I can see that some people embraced the gun with both arms...Arab rulers...and militants...how's that working out on the survival attempt?

the Soviet's invented the AK-47...how are things working out for them these days?

if I said...Soviet Union....to a young person today...

...is their likely response...WTF is a Soviet Union?

reply to post by Evolutionsend


22 is by sure fully ineffective beyond say 50 yards, why it couldn't put down a piece of cardboard right?

Or you could just google 22lr lethality and find many many wonderful videos on the reality of a long range 22.

Originally posted by michaelbrux
reply to post by HangTheTraitors

 

i'm convinced very few of you know about guns either and it would be upsetting to see people get too deep into things they know nothing at all about.

this type of behavior is rife these days...people running their mouths on and on about what they pretend to know. you know what i'm talking about friend?

maybe the OP is one of those people...considering that he bought it from Sears...i was thinking maybe he should consider spending his money on something that will actually be useful for him.

Actually, the weapon was not bought by him at sears, YEEEEEARS back sears had it's own line of firearms but does not anymore.
The gun would be a used gun which is fine as long as it was maintained, all that means is the OP will have no break in period.
I think I see now what you are saying about a sword and body armor, You are saying "don't get cocky" I believe.
But just the same I'll say don't get stupid.
Why arm yourself with the best the bronze age has to offer when everybody has moved into the information age?
So I say arm yourself with guns and information

Word of the day is IRONY.

reply to post by michaelbrux


well lets settle this here and now,
you bring your sword and armor
I will bring my 88 magnum.
what do you think.

lets do the tale of the tape.... 80lbs armor 40lbs sword Vs. 88 magnum

reply to post by rebellender


i have a better idea..

i'll stay where i am with my sword and armor and will do nothing at all to move against you.

you keep your weapon and search me out.

keep a diary of what you encounter on your path in search of me.

perhaps; i'll read your diary at the library at my leisure...but I have an idea what it will say.

Originally posted by michaelbrux
reply to post by rebellender

 

i have a better idea..

i'll stay where i am with my sword and armor and will do nothing at all to move against you.

you keep your weapon and search me out.

keep a diary of what you encounter on your path in search of me.

perhaps; i'll read your diary at the library at my leisure...but I have an idea what it will say.

Its the 21st century Mike, it goes a little like this,
FIRE MISSION, OVER.
GRID XY1234 OVER.
SEND 1 MARKER ROUND, OVER.
LEFT 40 ADD 100, BREAK
SEND HE, FIRE FOR EFFECT OVER

Originally posted by rebellender

Originally posted by michaelbrux
reply to post by rebellender

 

i have a better idea..

i'll stay where i am with my sword and armor and will do nothing at all to move against you.

you keep your weapon and search me out.

keep a diary of what you encounter on your path in search of me.

perhaps; i'll read your diary at the library at my leisure...but I have an idea what it will say.

Its the 21st century Mike, it goes a little like this,
FIRE MISSION, OVER.
GRID XY1234 OVER.
SEND 1 MARKER ROUND, OVER.
LEFT 40 ADD 100, BREAK
SEND HE, FIRE FOR EFFECT OVER

it is the 21st Century...

The Bissell Powerforce Bagless Vacuum cleaner I wield is far beyond anything you could put in the field.

Ashes to Ashes, Dust to Dust.

reply to post by michaelbrux


I fully understand what you mean when you refer to there being more to survival than firearms. Hence why I grow food, sort and store seeds, can find clean water the old fashioned way, ect... ect.... But firearms are usefull as well. I mean, that's what this thread is really about. Firearms used for survival. I have body armor and swords and knives as well. I also have many tools that would come in handy in a SHTF scenario.

i've not read a single story were a society collapsed and was then successfully reestablished by people who know how to kill things.

The American Revolution, American Civil War, ect...

guns are useless in the situation where society collapses and survival is your only concern. they require ammunition and anyone that has a surplus either won't sell it or will sell it at a price that's not reasonable.why would someone sell ammunition to a stranger when the stranger might decide to use that very ammunition against the person that sold it? you should really think about this.

Do you think we own firearms and no ammunition? I have enough 22lr ammo to last me a lifetime. And I have a stock of other calibers as well. I also shoot alot so I always have ammo on hand.

if I said...Soviet Union....to a young person today...

...is their likely response...WTF is a Soviet Union?

Fully agree with you on that one. Kids do not learn enough history these days. I must mention though that I love My AK-47.

And thank you for this great debate we are having.

Originally posted by usmc0311
reply to post by michaelbrux

 

I fully understand what you mean when you refer to there being more to survival than firearms. Hence why I grow food, sort and store seeds, can find clean water the old fashioned way, ect... ect.... But firearms are usefull as well. I mean, that's what this thread is really about. Firearms used for survival. I have body armor and swords and knives as well. I also have many tools that would come in handy in a SHTF scenario.

i've not read a single story were a society collapsed and was then successfully reestablished by people who know how to kill things.

The American Revolution, American Civil War, ect...

guns are useless in the situation where society collapses and survival is your only concern. they require ammunition and anyone that has a surplus either won't sell it or will sell it at a price that's not reasonable.why would someone sell ammunition to a stranger when the stranger might decide to use that very ammunition against the person that sold it? you should really think about this.

Do you think we own firearms and no ammunition? I have enough 22lr ammo to last me a lifetime. And I have a stock of other calibers as well. I also shoot alot so I always have ammo on hand.

if I said...Soviet Union....to a young person today...

...is their likely response...WTF is a Soviet Union?

Fully agree with you on that one. Kids do not learn enough history these days. I must mention though that I love My AK-47.

And thank you for this great debate we are having.

i've been on this site for less than a month. perhaps the OP is someone you are all familiar with and his purchasing a gun is just a small part of the other things he does to defend his own way of life...when I read the post, i assumed him to be someone that isn't well rounded and vulnerable to false counsel...so i chimed in.

my opposition is immediately confused for trolling...and not what it is.

all the things you know and have knowledge of...perhaps you are or will be one day...a leader.

i have a bit knowledge not only of the American Revolution and Civil War, but of the real reasons they were even necessary.

the things you fear today for the future...been there, done that...

this place, USA, will not be swept into the dustbin of history as all other have. in the remote future, perhaps, but not in this lifetime.

flame me, debate me all you like...

reply to post by michaelbrux

my opinion of the OP is he/she is a young person and very proud of their purchase due to its well rounded versatility.
nice to be talking about the OP again

I was talking to and about the OP the entire thread:

It would be a shame for him to being holding a shotgun and encounter a natural born killer.

reply to post by michaelbrux

my opposition is immediately confused for trolling...and not what it is.

I don't think that at all. I'm also not trying to flame you so sorry if it appeared that way. Actually I think we have been having a mature and rational debate, which seems to be becoming more rare here on ATS these days. I think the OP is just looking for thoughts and advice and he got views from multiple people with multiple views. Now he will keep in mind all of these views and opinions, I hope.

Personally, I believe survival, no matter what happens will be different for everyone. The most important tool we can use is our minds.

reply to post by usmc0311


but a man needs to know his own limits:



the video above is basically saying...I don't care if Jesus Christ is at the hot dog stand tonight...he's getting shot.

reply to post by michaelbrux


Very good example of the type who wouldn't survive.

Also, I believe it's movies like Meanace II Society that give people false realities of firearms. Now in that case they were just plain flat out killers. The sad part is that there are people who idolize that stuff and gain firearms for that purpose, I see firearms as a tool. Many uses both good and bad. It's also movies like that, that make me glad I live far from a large city. Cities will be the hardest to survive in during a SHTF scenario wether you are armed or not.