Secret FBI, CIA Documents and Sex Video Tapes Found At Egypt's Terror Police Headquarters

reply to post by DuneKnight


The insuation is present though, which is why I made my argument. The article itself links the 2 together without actually showing any evidence. The OP article has the US in the title, then it goes into what Egyptian security forces did, up to and including the surveiliance and locking people up.

To answer a seperate post - I am not a cheerleader for the CIA in any way shape or form. I take exception to arguments that lays all the evils of the world on the US or an agency within the US, whicle ignoring everything and everyone else.

You can lead a horse to water....

Every country the US deals with is sovereign, and run their own internal and external affairs, just as the US does. Do we have influence in other countries? We sure do, just as those other countries have influence on the US (Middle East / Canadian / Venezuela Oil, stratregic metals from China and South Africa, etc).

Is the US an angel - Nope, but neither are any other country. Even Switzerland played its part with Nazi collaberation during WWII (money / valuables).

There is nothing wrong with holding the US accountible. It just needs to be done in a matter that places the accusations in context and has evidence to support it. Simply saying because the US sells tear gas canisters / weapons / tanks / intelligence cooperation / training to Egypt, that we are responsible for the deaths of the Egyptians.

The Muslim Brotherhood started Egypt down the road of Mubarik, not the US. The US is not the only country in the world who has given money, equipment, training or specific expertise to Egypt.

Yet, as always, people ignore that information because it does not support their argument towards the US and its actions. Its like the people who say Bush was responsible for 9/11 because of his policies towards the Middle East, while at the same time ignoring the fact that we had the first attack on the WTC in 1993, 2 embassies attacks in 1990's as well as an attack on the USS Cole - all while Clinton was in office.

In the end its the person who gave the order and who carried it out.

reply to post by Fractured.Facade


Dont suppose you would care to give us names of the people the US kidnapped and sent to Egypt, including evidence as to why the US did this.

Originally posted by Xcathdra

It as much of a fact as the other side of this argument is. Care to show where the US had issued orders to Egyptian Security forces to torture egyptians and kill them? They dont take orders from us, and we dont take orders from them.

The article in the OP is misleading to put it mildly. How was the US directly involved in what the article is talking about.

They certainly don't take orders from US now.

But they did, and the very last thing the US, and in particular the CIA and FBI want made public are records of (not only Egyptians) being abducted and taken to Egypt under "extraordinary rendition" where they could have ANYONE transfered to the Egyptian authorities and "security officials" with orders to extract specific information (using torture and extreme methods not available in the US) and eventually kill person(s), incinerate the bodies and evidence, following the extraction of needed information, where the agencies would then erase that person from existence.

They think all of those records, evidence and witnesses have been eliminated, but they are mistaken... Badly.

Originally posted by Bonified Ween
This thread is full of win. I am really curious to see if those recent tweets are legit or not. I did a translation on the original article from that tweet and this is what it said:

Hani Barakat wrote: security expert said Khaled Mattawa that the state security apparatus is a technical sense of internal security and there is no state without internal security apparatus with a different Tzmyate. And defines its powers of parliament and therefore, the State Security in Egypt has become an organ is rejected popular and must establish an internal security concepts different after the parliamentary elections after that there has been discontent with much on the security of the state and the direction of revenge for revenge as a result of any practices unconstitutional that took place in the former regime through this device. And indicates that for the recent events it must know that there are hidden hands with interests in undermining security in Egypt. And whether the state security apparatus to burn himself to get rid of old files he wrought out that this device paralyzed since on January 28 did not hear about his ability or carrying out any arrest of any of the militants in any direction or trend since that date and if the protesters who stormed the buildings, claiming that the state security officers who executed the documents, why they burned the headquarters of the governorates and the existence of this Maiwkd hands hidden. He wrought that there is a beneficiary of the destruction of the Internal Security Agency and the insistence on humiliating and paralyze the ability of the police are represented in the top of the code of symbols Police during the earlier era, pointing out that this security vacuum, which preceded the political vacuum and vacuum-Parliamentary may lead to a state of chaos and if the in this direction is the following stage of sectarian strife and sedition are not on the level of religions, but only on the political level also, which may result in the secretion of seven to nine communities.

edit on 8-3-2011 by Bonified Ween because: (no reason given)

heres the english version of the article: english.ahram.org.eg...


Egyptians are planning their revenge against State Security thugs, it seems to be taken as a fact now that SS is behind all the attacks on copts and women.

twitter.com...

twitter.com...

twitter.com...

They dont trust the army, they so far have only shot in the air to disperse protesters but never do anything to the thugs who throw Molotov cocktails at people. Could the revolution have all been for nothings? That they are facilitating for the coming dictatorship gov that will continue to do the same thing and crack down on people?

Originally posted by DuneKnight
Politics isnt about giving orders, its influence and mutual interests. The language might be different but it holds same implications. Plus can you say that US wasn't cooperating with that government fully knowing what was going on? We don't know nothing though, all this is superficial, all I know is that US benefited from Egypt's services and vice-versa.


btw, where did they get that electric shock torture device from? :

edit on 8-3-2011 by DuneKnight because: (no reason given)

The US deals with China, politically as well as militarily, technology, resources. Are we then responsible for all the people the Chinese government locks up, kills, makes them disappear etc?

We deal with N. Korea, and for a long time we supplied them with heating oil and food, so are we then responsible for the people the N. Korean government killed?

We had close relations with South Africa during the cold war because of their supply of strategic metals, so are we responsible for their aparthied policies and murders?

We had diplomatic relations with the Soviet Union / Russia - are we responsible for the death of millions of people under Stalin, Breshnev, Gorbachev, Putin, Medev?

Where does the US gets its oil from?
Where does the US get its strategic metals from?

I can go to the store and by a hammer that was made in Mexico. I can then take that hammer and go kill a person. Is Mexico responsible for that murder because they sold the hammer to a company who sold it to me?

Japan manufatures automobiles here in the states. If I buy one of their cars, take it to the highway and bury the needle, resulting in a fatality accident, is Japan responsible for that death?

If we buy a fork set from bed bath and beyond, which was made in France, and I use that fork to go kill a person, is France lible for that death?

Its not the item itself, nor is it the country where it comes from. Its how that item is used by the person, or entity, who purchased it.

reply to post by Fractured.Facade


While I understand the argument you are making, and im not trying to be an ass or anything, but can you show us the documents that support your claims?

I have no doubt the CIA worked with Egyptian security services, just as the Soviets did during the cold war. My argument, again, is the Egyptians are responsible for their actions, not the US.

Egypt is not a democracy, they dont have the same protections as our US constitution, and place a different value on life than what Isreal, China, N. Korea, Russia, South Africa, Sweden, etc etc etc does.

Again, we have diplomatic relations with almost every single nation on this planet. Are we responsible for their actions towards their own citizens?

reply to post by Xcathdra


You should just stop you sound like a dis-info agent its obvious the US collaborated with Egypt in many ways. You are extremely ignorant. My fellow hope you see the light in the darkness someday

reply to post by Xcathdra


Your point of view is basically US has kept a fine line well according to you it must be a very very fine line. btw, Egypt gov only became evil and inhumane only after bridging relations with america and israel, ever since that treaty and the rise of islamic fundamentalism played a role then too.

Arent you guys weirdened out by how MSM ignored the storming into SS HQ and all that stuff? It didnt make the news at all especially considering the stakes involved. Normally I wouldnt complain because Libya is obvious priority but msm are reported on the women's protests that ended badly yet they didnt say anything about the sectarian violence, SS documents and the thugs who are out in the streets.

here is what egypt looks like now after the battle that I believe was created by State Security/NDP:

twitpic.com...

Not to mention go on the site Liveleak or TheYNC.com and watch the videos yourself all the SS scum are on the roof trapped and the building is burning payback for all those cruel acts they committed upon people. This is it folks the world is coming to tribulation this is just the beginning of the END

The video is showing the SS building up in flames with alot of people jumping off or out of windows and the rest trapped on the roof. ITS HAPPENING GET READY FOLKS

Could State Security have manifested this recent wave of chaos and violence on protesters for revenge and martial law? This blogger fears this might be the case:

egyptianchronicles.blogspot.com...

The most interesting information here is the sex tapes secretly recorded in hotel rooms. It sounds awfully familiar to what the CIA starting practicing, and quickly got the hang of, in the 60's. It's easily one of the most effective forms of blackmail and is probably much more common than we think.

Just to give you an idea, this is an excerpt of Claudia Mullen's testimony in court about her experience as a victim of MK ULTRA experiments:

The CIA kept hotel rooms in two of the best hotels in New Orleans,
and year around, they kept a suite. It was unique in that it had two bedrooms and one bedroom was where they kept the hidden cameras and I was actually shown the hidden cameras by three men who handled that part of it. They called him Captain George White - he was formerly a doctor. He used to be in the narcotics squad in California and then he became a doctor, and joined the CIA. And then there were two other men who worked with him. They would put me with the subjects who would be filmed (the men) and then when the men would come into town -- I am talking about local politicians, government officials -- anybody who they needed to possibly get something on, keep on file for future reference -- should they need to coerce this person into supporting the projects. Senators, congressmen, anything like that -- if they were in town, they were given this room. They had no reason to think there was anything strange about the room. It didn't look any different than any other room -- it was just one of the better suites in the two hotels.

For further research, this is an excellent article on sex tape blackmail operations.

Heres one case of the US using Egypt for a torture camp.

www.guardian.co.uk...

In Italy, a judge is deciding whether there is enough evidence to try 26 Americans, most believed to be CIA agents, and six Italians in connection with the 2003 kidnapping of Hassan Mustafa Osama Nasr, known as Abu Omar.

The Muslim cleric, freed last week from a prison in Egypt, wants to sue the former Italian prime minister Silvio Berlusconi for damages, his lawyer said this week.

A Munich court last month issued arrest warrants for 13 suspected CIA agents accused of kidnapping Khaled el-Masri, a German national of Lebanese descent.

news.bbc.co.uk...

EU endorses damning report on CIA

The EU report said the US had operated 1,245 flights
The European parliament has approved a damning report on secret CIA flights, condemning member states which colluded in the operations.
The UK, Germany and Italy were among 14 states which allowed the US to forcibly remove terror suspects, lawmakers said.

The EU parliament voted to accept a resolution condemning member states which accepted or ignored the practice.

The EU report said the CIA had operated 1,245 flights, some taking suspects to states where they could face torture.

reply to post by Epiphron


The use of sex - ie - "Honey Traps" is one of the oldest espionage / blackmail methods in the world. Its even in the Bible in the story of Sampson and Delilah among others.

Ever wonder why so many celebrities are so "pro-Cuba". Its not just because they like the cigars....

Former Cuban Intelligence Official: Celebrities Often Blackmailed Into Supporting Castro

Aside from Cuba, Russia has been using Honey Traps for ages..

U.S. Protests Russian 'Sex Tape' Used to Smear American Diplomat

They really are quite popular...

The Spy Who Said She Loved Me Are "honey traps" real?

I'm sure the US uses them as well. I'm sure some of the LEO's here would argue the point but it could be argued that a type of "Honey Traps" are even used by them in various prostitution / obscenity type cases. Of course, I'm sure the CIA often goes for the full monty so to speak.

In any event, I have no problem believing that either Mubarak's gov. and/or the Egyptian Army would be quite capable of thinking of and doing "Honey Traps" all on their own without any help from the US. I mean, most every country since time began has used them - why not Egypt?

"More worrying for the US government—unless they find some video of Hillary doing naughty things in her hotel room"

Now I wish I hadn't read this topic. There's an image I'll never get out of my mind now. If they have that tape, forcing someone to watch it probably helped extract information. Talk about cruel and unusual punishment...

Originally posted by XRaDiiX
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

You should just stop you sound like a dis-info agent its obvious the US collaborated with Egypt in many ways. You are extremely ignorant. My fellow hope you see the light in the darkness someday

So once again, info that people disagree with, sound logic on the overall issues, and you resort to calling me ignorant and a dis-info agent.

Funny as it is, you never bothered to answer any of the question.

Whats worse than a person who blindly follows the government, are people who are so blinded by theiur own paranoia they see conspiracies in everything, and beleive nothing.

reply to post by Frogs


Thanks for the additional info. I had never heard of that Cuba thing, that was pretty interesting.

It's almost sad the lengths some people will go to for power... but on the other hand, I have to admit the life of a spy or a top intelligence official sure does sound exciting...

Originally posted by DuneKnight
Your point of view is basically US has kept a fine line well according to you it must be a very very fine line. btw, Egypt gov only became evil and inhumane only after bridging relations with america and israel, ever since that treaty and the rise of islamic fundamentalism played a role then too.

My view is not the fine line but Egypts actions towards its own citizens. The argument peple make lays all the blame at our doorsteps, while ignoring the Egyptian actions. Go back and read the rebuttals to my argument so far in this thread, and what you will see is focus on the US, not egypt.

Egypt was having issues long before they were an ally of the US. Prior to that they were supported by the Soviets, which was very evident during the wars they fought with Israel.

President Anwar Saddat was assasinated because he signed a peace treaty with Israel, and Mubarik, who was VP at the time, was wounded. The assasination was carried out by the Muslim Brotherhood.

Originally posted by DuneKnight
Arent you guys weirdened out by how MSM ignored the storming into SS HQ and all that stuff? It didnt make the news at all especially considering the stakes involved. Normally I wouldnt complain because Libya is obvious priority but msm are reported on the women's protests that ended badly yet they didnt say anything about the sectarian violence, SS documents and the thugs who are out in the streets.

here is what egypt looks like now after the battle that I believe was created by State Security/NDP:

twitpic.com...

edit on 8-3-2011 by DuneKnight because: (no reason given)

With the attack on western journalists can you blame them for paring back their reporting of events?

reply to post by JBA2848


The article out of Italy is not new. The problem is how the charges came about. Italian agencies not only knew, but assisted the CIA in that operation. The Judge launched an investigation, and low and behold only the Americans were charged. The charges against the Italians were dropped.

Originally posted by Xcathdra

While I understand the argument you are making, and im not trying to be an ass or anything, but can you show us the documents that support your claims?

Not here, not now.

I have no doubt the CIA worked with Egyptian security services, just as the Soviets did during the cold war. My argument, again, is the Egyptians are responsible for their actions, not the US.

The United States of America does not torture.... It used a proxy that does. The Egyptians are responsible for atrocities ordered by the CIA and FBI. You can figure that out, and/or reconcile that however you wish.

Egypt is not a democracy, they dont have the same protections as our US constitution, and place a different value on life than what Isreal, China, N. Korea, Russia, South Africa, Sweden, etc etc etc does.

Exactly, and billions of US dollars bought and paid for the Egyptian alliance and obedience.

Again, we have diplomatic relations with almost every single nation on this planet. Are we responsible for their actions towards their own citizens?

Few relations have been as entirely evil, covert and corrupt as those between the USA and Egypt.

Dirty deeds don't come cheap.