Will The REAL Christians Please Stand Up?

Hellow fellow members of ATS.

I have a request, a small one, albeit an important one.

It's time for the "Christ" like Christians, you know the wonderful ones which exist all over the world by the millions, to stand up and retake your religion from these extremist morons who are making you look bad.

These people who justify book burnings, murder and all other kinds of behaviour by hiding behind God and the mighty Bible.

Countless threads about these topics, always cary the carbon copy reply of :

Well they aren't "real" christians, they misrepresent us, they are radicals,etc..

Well it's time for you all to show this to the world. The horrible stigma against religion is because of these people.

Like any group you must voice your opinions, especially considering the majority of Christians are the good ones.

Why do we allow a small minority to dictate to and represent the larger majority?

I wanted to open a discussion about how, purposely, religion continues to only be brought up in the most extreme of circumstances, and what good christians can do to retake what is rightfully theirs.

Thoughts?

~Keeper

reply to post by tothetenthpower

Well they aren't "real" christians, they misrepresent us, they are radicals,etc..

I couldn't agree more, the old No True Scotsman fallacy is a common one with Christians. They use to label extremists, people of other denominations they don't like, people that stop being Christians, etc. Many Christians just go "Oh those weren't REAL Christians".

Its time to take back your faith from those who have taken it far from its roots of love and spiritual rebirth into hateful or extreme places. The same should be said for Muslims and people of any faith that has an extremist group to call out the extremists on their BS.

Star and Flag.

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
I wanted to open a discussion about how, purposely, religion continues to only be brought up in the most extreme of circumstances, and what good christians can do to retake what is rightfully theirs.

They can become mystics.

"The Christian of the future will be a mystic or he will not exist at all." -Karl Rahner

It's a much larger problem with Islam. All we ever hear is that it's the extremists of the group and not average muslims and they are using bad translations of the Koran and why aren't the moderates speaking out. Everything you said is amplified times ten with Islamic radicalism but I guess we can't point that out because it might offend someone.

Originally posted by Mesmerizer
It's a much larger problem with Islam. All we ever hear is that it's the extremists of the group and not average muslims and they are using bad translations of the Koran and why aren't the moderates speaking out. Everything you said is amplified times ten with Islamic radicalism but I guess we can't point that out because it might offend someone.

I agree with you.

There's a reason for that though. There is a holy war going on, a mind holy war, between all the sects of religion.

It's much easier to invade middle eastern countries if you think they are all barbarians isn't it?

To divide the people is the point in this day and age.

They do the same with Christianity as they do with Islam, you just hear about Islam more because it's the flavor of the decade.

~Keeper

I'm a Christian, but I choose not to participate in "organized" religion, so I do not go to church. In the past I found some nice folks in the church, but mainly a lot of hypocrites, money-grubbers, politicos and weirdos who tell me I have to burn all my rock albums because it's "the devil's music"

Jesus never meant for his message of truth, life and salvation to be overshadowed by a mega-corporate "church" organization focused on cash-raising, empire-building and war-mongering.

Christians need to lead by attraction rather than promotion.


[edit on 24-7-2010 by Rockerchic4God]

From a Christian perspective... One of the main tenets of our faith is to watch for the Accuser of the Brethren, in all his forms.

www.1timothy4-13.com...

In this, we abide by each other and offer support when we fall short of the grace expected of us. We forgive not seven, but seventy-seven times. Matthew 18:22 We don't cut down each other, preferably not judging each other at all.

www.capalert.com...

Yet sometimes it becomes neccesary when sins, crimes become intolerable. We are also asked to expel the immoral brother from among us ... so that the shame of that expulsion will bring that person back to a moral and commendable lifestyle. When that happens, we are also exhorted to welcome them back without misgivings.

www.swapmeetdave.com...

Edit to add ... my sympathies to Doc Velocity & his wife for the misuse of this! I had no comment in that thread, so here it is. His account is a prime example of the potentially corrupt practices and the difficulty of facing them.

So far as "taking back our religion", I think it depends primarily on the micro- scope of matters, from parish to parish and church to church. It's one of those matters that depends on a healthy community, and with a grassroots approach the nonsense affecting the church becomes weeded out. The other option is to lead a decent life outside the physical church, as many do successfully. We know our brotherhood and sisterhood doesn't depend on our physical gathering, in fact, the greater part is our unseen connection with the Holy Spirit.

So far as ending the corruption within the church, money-laundering on large scales from certain unscrupulous evangelists, misused charities (whatever they might be), Jesuit infiltration into leadership positions, Luciferian individuals masked as men and women of the cloth committing crimes in-the-name-of, and all other manner of crimes in the heirarchy, I personally consider that Gods' domain. May those servants of the Lord in high positions find the means to deal with the evils they face, and may they have our prayers. Yet, many accounts I've read suggest that awareness is not enough, take the "superforce" in the Vatican for example, which Bishops have whispered about. Sometimes it's simply too well-rooted; it would be like trying to dismantle the Scottish Rite of Freemasonry. In other words, what do you suggest?

[edit on 24-7-2010 by Northwarden]

There's a crowd for every kind of Joe out there in society. Honorable ones, apathetic ones, and then the "bad apples"

In most civil cases, you can't really do much to educate the idiots out there. Some religious folk need to criticize someone just so they can sleep at night. I am a Christian myself fyi, honestly to me it's just like the old saying goes:
Do not cast pearls before swine

The so called fake Christians referred to would probably be the biblical equivalent of a Pharisee. Everyone should know of how hard headed those folk were?

Eh, what is there really to say. Christians shunning christians. Nothing really new. We seem to be in a age of "self" enlightenment lately rather than socail enlightenment.

All i know is that nothing can be obtained fully in a war like effort. That includes probably pickiting anarchy and the such. Just keep your mouths shut and keep carrying your cross. You have no other choice. Although, how far will this thread really go? were on the internet doing nothing, talking about ideas that may or may not exist. Does ATS even exist? Will this thread disappear into nothingness. Stand up for what? How can I stand up on a message board when i'm constrained into typing?

Hello there I have to say, I really like your post Keeper. It tells me that you are very open to finding new perspectives, unlike the usual, "Christians are hypocrites, and just a bunch of evil sheep who destroy the world." As a Christian myself; specifically a Catholic, I am also 16 years old (please excuse my poor grammar and spelling) and have much likeness in my faith. That being said, I'm also a guy who works to deny ignorance, and search for real truth, being an ATS Member.

You asked, "Will the REAL Christians Please Stand Up?", and I had no choice but to answer, and I'm here to defend my faith. I've read many threads and posts on this site bashing Christians, and calling them names, creating stereotypes, etc. I don't mind them though, because I know people have different mindsets and perspectives of us. I forgive them, because although I may not know them, I know they are part of my big family here on Earth.

Personally, I considered myself more of an atheist in the past. I never really bought into the 'magical story of God's creation, or a man named Jesus died for me 2,000 years ago." As a human being, we aren't robots with no ability to think for ourselves. We have a free will to decide based on our thoughts, feelings, etc. Going to Church was a real bore... I was half-asleep most of my time in Mass. Praying to God seemed a bit crazy, I could not honestly believe that it could really 'work' anything. With all of this in mind, I completely gave up on my faith. I lived on my own ideas and theories, did whatever I want, and felt really good.

After some time, I started getting hooked onto the world. The materialistic, pleasure-filled, God-less world. I listened to Rap, and watched movies, and got hooked to TV. At the same time, I was being influenced through the music I was listening to, to start doing drugs, sexual acts, filthy words. Television had a lot of influence on me, because I felt that it portrayed reality. I was 'asleep'.

When you start to look at the world, our country especially, there is a growth among greed, jealousy, drugs, adultery, recklessness, hatred for one another, violence, filth, you name it.
I started thinking in a different way.
Are there any animals in the world, who can act as horrible as we can?

Over the last few years, I thought about these things, and started taking my life in a new direction. God had blessed me with so many acts, I can not even explain with words. It's a feeling like none other. I've had a lot of miraculous experiences, in the most common ways. Here is just one of mine, I have posted before: www.abovetopsecret.com...

More importantly, I started to read the Bible and learned many lessons and life advice.
I'm a Real Christian now, and let me say that as Real Christians we are told to treat others the same way we want to be treated. We are told to love each other as brothers and sisters. We have to be humble, kind, generous, a good Samaritan, self-less, forgiving, righteous, the list goes on and on.
God knows we are all human and isn't an angry God that just condemns people to hell just because he likes to. He doesn't go around and say, "You are a very bad child, you disgust me.", or "You did this, you did that."

I realized God knows that we aren't perfect, we're human. I've been so horrible myself in the past, but still God gave me life. He doesn't care what I did before, and He forgave me for everything I did. He's an all loving God, don't matter if your Atheist, Muslim, Hindu, etc. He loves us all, unconditionally and He died for us. :]

I'm sure some of you might think I'm crazy now, but I also started to look at the complexity of human life. Let alone, the beauty of our planet we call Earth. We have carrots, spinach, broccoli, bananas, water, chirping birds, anything you name it! What separates us from everything else? We are the Rational Species.

I'm running out of space here so I'll continue on the next post!

Continued from my last post :]

To finish this off, as a Real Christian, I know that what you see portrayed of us on television, news, etc, are not always completely true.

Real Christians love one another, are selfless, humble, generous, kind, forgiving, accepting, and really Christ-like.

Real Christians base their actions on 4 words only:

What would Jesus do?

Although you have to realize that we all make mistakes, Christian or not. We aren't all perfect. But, Real Christians would act as Jesus would.

God Bless everyone, I enjoy having lots of intelligent conversations with people here, God has blessed everyone with lots of intellect and knowledge!

Thanks for the Post Keeper!

reply to post by tothetenthpower


Can do you define "Real Christian"?

I hear this term used by hundreds of different groups...

It's time for the "Christ" like Christians, you know the wonderful ones which exist all over the world by the millions, to stand up and retake your religion from these extremist morons who are making you look bad.

The first line could be sarcasm. I don't know who these morons are and you havn't pointed them out either.

These people who justify book burnings, murder and all other kinds of behaviour by hiding behind God and the mighty Bible.
Countless threads about these topics, always cary the carbon copy reply of

These people? No help with an ID.

Well they aren't "real" christians, they misrepresent us, they are radicals,etc..

Good, real, wonderful and kind Christians, like you speak of, would never talk from the side of there neck like this. Do you have evidence of this claim.

Well it's time for you all to show this to the world. The horrible stigma against religion is because of these people.

No it isn't really.
I think it's time for you to back up the claims you make in this thread Power.

[edit on 24-7-2010 by randyvs]

I think the most effective way Christians in this modern world to fight back is to point out that Christians are the last group to suffer intolerant behavior. I have a good example at the end of this post. It is pretty easy to point out the way Christians are attacked. We must speak out against the bashing and intolerance against Christians in this country.

It is always open season on Christians. But a very effective way is to change the focus of the bashing. A case in point: Why can someone place a crucifix into a jar of urine, call it "art" and get away with it? It was titled "Piss Christ"!!! It was placed on exhibition! Why can some people decide to paint a picture of Christ with sh*t splattered all over it and get away with it? It all gets exhibited under the guise of "Artistic Expression".

The answer is to suppose that if someone puts a picture or depiction of Martin Luther King, Jr. or Mohammed or Malcome X or Obama or a Jewish leader into a jar of urine and call it art? There would be rioting in the streets, violence against the "artist", social chaos etc.

Some people do not realize how offensive something is until you turn it around and show the offensiveness to them.

[edit on 24-7-2010 by Starbug3MY]

reply to post by Starbug3MY

Why can someone place a crucifix into a jar of urine, call it "art" and get away with it? It was titled "Piss Christ"!!! It was placed on exhibition! Why can some people decide to paint a picture of Christ with sh*t splattered all over it and get away with it? It all gets exhibited under the guise of "Artistic Expression".

What should be seen in the jar, is the exact reason, God has commanded
that we make no graven images of anything that is in heaven.

reply to post by tothetenthpower

I think I understand the intentions in your OP. But, consider this...

Why is it wrong for me to believe and say the following people were/are not Christians?

Jim Jones
David Koresh
Constantine
Albert Pike
David Duke
Oprah Winfrey
Timothy McVeigh
Marshall Applewhite
Inri Cristo
Matayoshi Jesus
Ariffin Mohamed
Laszlo Toth
Arnold Potter
Thomas Harrison Provenzano
Ahn Sahng-hong
John Nichols Thom
Sergei Torop
Ernest Norman
Hong Xiuquan
Sun Myung Moon
Jung Myung Seok
David Shayler
Mirza Ghulam Ahmad
Montanus
William W. Davies
Father Divine / George Baker
Georges-Emest Roux
Yahweh ben Yahweh
Iesu Matayoshi
Jose Luis de Jesus Miranda
Apollo Quiboloy
David Icke
Maria Devi Christos
Wayne Bent
Charles Manson



Many of the above claimed to be Jesus Christ. Some were mass murderers. Do you believe they are/were Christians?

reply to post by randyvs

It still is offensive to lots of people. It's a symbol with reverence to God, not a graven image because Christ is God.
And would you call all of the inspired paintings and sculptures graven images? You can't.


[edit on 24-7-2010 by Starbug3MY]

Originally posted by Starbug3MY
reply to post by randyvs

 

It still is offensive to lots of people. It's a symbol with reverence to God, not a graven image because Christ is God.
And would you call all of the inspired paintings and sculptures graven images? You can't.

I concur it is offensive.

Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth

You know, I am so happy to see you post this. I think it's worth mentioning that real Christians are fearful to stand up, even on this site because of what might be said about them. But I tell you, I am ready to stand up, even unto the death.

Jesus said in the end times, the world will hate you because you are mine. But I don't want to be the one to stand before the father and have to say that I failed him. We are so close to the end, now is the time to step up, not step back.

A time will come when we will all have to make a choice, are we for him or against him and will we accept the mark of the beast? My answer is no, I will never accept that mark, even if it means my life.

The Holy Spirit will guide you and show you what to say and do when opposition comes, so there is no need to fear anything.