Gen. McChrystal apologizes for new Afghan civilian deaths

KABUL — American-led efforts to avert civilian deaths in the war against the Taliban suffered a new blow over the weekend when a NATO airstrike in southern Afghanistan killed about two dozen civilians. U.S. Army Gen. Stanley McChrystal , the head of coalition forces in Afghanistan , sought to contain outrage Monday for the attack by delivering a personal apology to Afghan President Hamid Karzai . He conceded, however, that the attack Sunday was likely to shake public confidence in his pledge to minimize civilian deaths in Afghanistan .

Sunday's airstrike was the second in a week to kill Afghan civilians. A week earlier, U.S. Marines killed 12 Afghans during the ongoing offensive in the Taliban stronghold of Marjah in southern Afghanistan

Sunday's airstrike was the second in a week to kill Afghan civilians. A week earlier, U.S. Marines killed 12 Afghans during the ongoing offensive in the Taliban stronghold of Marjah in southern Afghanistan

There were conflicting estimates of the death toll. The Afghan Council of Ministers said that 27 civilians — including four women and a child — had been killed, while the local police chief said 21 had died.Two others were missing, he said.

news.yahoo.com...

I'm sure this will lower the amount of terrorists!! Who cares if we CONTINUE to repeatedly kill innocent people...and in the process bankrupt the entire country to do it!

We can apologize all we want..but it won't change what we have done and nor will the families that have lost loved ones ever forget.

No comments?

I guess everyone here approves of the deaths of innocent people. No problem.

Suppose the airplane bomber was suspected before he flew the plane into the IRS building. We figured, hell, let's just drop a bomb on his ass and hope we don't kill any innocent people....even though we've already done it countless times.

Would you be mad if someone killed one of your kids? Would you accept their apology?

OF COURSE NOT.

We are creating more hate towards us...and therefore the likelyhood of more terrorists.

Let's keep fighting a war that will never end...that is until it bankrupts us.

But go ahead...continue on about the deficit spending on social programs and ignore this.

reply to post by David9176


David, not being rude or mean, but how do you avoid civilian casualties in a war?

And why is it that every time US causes casualties, it creates threads. Yet, when the Taliban do it, it hardly gets noticed?

"Total estimate of civilian casualties as a result of fighting between pro-government forces and armed opposition groups (January –July 2009): 1,388." Afghanistan Index: Tracking Variables of Reconstruction & Security in Post-9/11 Afghanistan, Brookings Institution, October 2009
"Almost three times as many civilian deaths (68 per cent) were attributed to anti-Government elements activities than to pro-Government forces (23 per cent).

www.afghanconflictmonitor.org...

reply to post by jam321


I'm sorry jam...but I find it hard justifying that it's ok just because they are doing it as well. I guess if the guy who flew the plane into the IRS can kill people...then I guess ALL OF US can as well.

That's fine if people choose to ignore it...as they obviously are...the same ones who are whining and crying about deficit spending yet they ignore the trillions we have spent on this war....with thousands of soldiers and innocent people....children....dead....for what?

So we can bankrupt ourselves and have to pull back the troops anyway?

That's the road we are on.

reply to post by David9176

but I find it hard justifying that it's ok just because they are doing it as well.

Not asking for justification. I'm just wondering why this is always a one way street.

Are we on the verge of bankruptcy? If so, why pass a trillion dollar healthcare plan? Why continue to fund nonessential budget items?

It just isn't the war. But at this point, I agree it is time to bring our troops home. Let the hounds loose and let them fight the war on terror.

reply to post by jam321

Are we on the verge of bankruptcy? If so, why pass a trillion dollar healthcare plan? Why continue to fund nonessential budget items? It just isn't the war. But at this point, I agree it is time to bring our troops home. Let the hounds loose and let them fight the war on terror.

I agree...although i do believe something has to be done about healthcare.

Just making the point that this IS deficit spending. It's what helped us get in this predicament in the first place. People seem to ignore the war spending...and even the Glen Beck version of "libertarians"....the supposed strong man of the Constitution...supports an unconstitutional war.

There is hypocrisy everywhere.

NOT seen in ANY news broadcasts:

Radical (not all) muslims once again fail to apologize for, or do anything to try and minimize civilian casualties from any of their actions.

In fact, it seems that they go out of their way to MAXIMIZE civilian casualties, but that never gets publicized either.

No, all we ever see are a bunch of PC comments which do nothing but help the radical (not all) muslim's cause.

Every time they kill civilians, they are breeding more terrorist.

If your family gets killed for no reason, would you want revenge.

Dont be surprised when there are REAL terrorist attacks in the US.

Originally posted by Sean48


Every time they kill civilians, they are breeding more terrorist.

If your family gets killed for no reason, would you want revenge.

Dont be surprised when there are REAL terrorist attacks in the US.

You mean like the Christmas Day attempted bombing, the Ft. Hood shootings, and the arrests of the muslims in a plot to poison fellow soldiers at Ft. Jackson - just to name a few?

Oh, I almost forgot. To obama supporters, those are all criminal acts and not terrorist acts. To obama and his supporters, terrorists are Americans who don't support his far-left liberal policies.

Originally posted by centurion1211
Oh, I almost forgot. To obama supporters, those are all criminal acts and not terrorist acts.

Your statement doesn't make sense. Terrorism is a crime and is defined and dealt with as such under federal law, mainly Title 18 Chapter 113B of US Code.

To obama and his supporters, terrorists are Americans who don't support his far-left liberal policies.

I don't know about Obama and “his supporters,” but, to me, Obama doesn't even have “far-left liberal” policies, and Americans who disagree with his policies are Americans who disagree with the President. Last I heard that wasn't a crime, much less qualify as ‘terrorism.’

Originally posted by centurion1211
To obama and his supporters, terrorists are Americans who don't support his far-left liberal policies.

To call Obama "far-left" sounds to pathetic that it's disturbing.

So far he's squarely in the pocket of same forces that governed before, he butchered once-great ideas about healthcare on behest of insurance and pharma, he's all for torture and what not and essentially is Bush 2.0 - with far better reading comprehension and enhanced speech module.

Centurion, dude, you really sound a little delusional.

In answer to the previous two posters who have taken issue with my characterization of obama as far left, the reality of the situation is that obama only appears to be not far-left to people even farther left than he is. It is the nature of the political spectrum. Think it through.

Example: A KKK member would not think Cheney is "far-right" (because he's still to the left of them), but you probably do.

Class dismissed!



[edit on 2/25/2010 by centurion1211]

reply to post by centurion1211

I find your response to be, quite frankly, offensive.

Not only are you calling me, and other members, ignorant because I can't discern between centrist and far-left, you are calling me far-left because I don't agree with you.

The condescending tone doesn't suit you either.

Originally posted by centurion1211
In answer to the previous two posters who have taken issue with my characterization of obama as far left, the reality of the situation is that obama only appears to be not far-left to people even farther left than he is.

You know, it doesn't hurt to actually read others' posts.

Example: A KKK member would not think Cheney is "far-right" (because he's still to the left of them), but you probably do.

I don't even consider Cheney right, left, top or bottom. He did things that a leftist would find appropriate, at times. He's simply an evil individual.

Class dismissed!

Pompous, are we.

Originally posted by David9176
I'm sorry jam...but I find it hard justifying that it's ok just because they are doing it as well.

Hey, Gus, the US military isn't intentionally killing civilians "because the Taliban are". No one in the military is "justifying" the death of innocent civilians.

reply to post by jerico65

Hey, Gus, the US military isn't intentionally killing civilians "because the Taliban are". No one in the military is "justifying" the death of innocent civilians.

Hey GUS. I didn't state the were intentionally killing civilians. If you can find it...I'll give you a star.

No one in the military is "justifying" the death of innocent civilians.

Gus, didn't state that either. I said the number he posted of civilian deaths looked to be justification. (as they have killed civilians as well...both accidentally and intentionally).

But thanks Gus for completely changing my posts and making them into something they were not.

Originally posted by David9176

Let's keep fighting a war that will never end...that is until it bankrupts us.

But go ahead...continue on about the deficit spending on social programs and ignore this.

This one is hard. I mean it is really just beyond belief that we are still fighting in Afghanistan, a country that had no formal military.

I think it illustrates how broken our system really is.

If it is true that one man, Bin Laden, really orchestrated all of this, how happy he must be today.

Sad.

reply to post by Ace High

If it is true that one man, Bin Laden, really orchestrated all of this, how happy he must be today.

True, if he is still alive, he did exactly what he planned to do. The USSR knows how it works.

Yes! they unfortunately messed up this latest "SHOW" offensive for the American public, and sadly more Afghan children have now lost their lives.

Afghan Offensive ‘Aimed to Shape U.S. Opinion on War’

Washington Post Feb. 22, 2010: Gareth Porter writes for IPS News, “Senior military officials decided to launch the current U.S.-British military campaign to seize Marja in large part to influence domestic U.S. opinion on the war in Afghanistan, the Washington Post reported Monday.”

The Post report, by Greg Jaffe and Craig Whitlock, both of whom cover military affairs, said the town of Marja would not have been chosen as a target for a U.S. military operation had the criterion been military significance instead of impact on domestic public opinion.

The primary goal of the offensive, they write, is to ‘convince Americans that a new era has arrived in the eight-year long war….’ U.S. military officials in Afghanistan ‘hope a large and loud victory in Marja will convince the American public that they deserve more time to demonstrate that extra troops and new tactics can yield better results on the battlefield,’ according to Jaffe and Whitlock.
---
You want to be able to define your narrative, and we’ve had trouble doing that in the past,’ said Mark Moyar, who has served as a civilian adviser to U.S. commanders in Afghanistan. McChrystal is under pressure to show progress fast: President Obama has directed that U.S. troops begin to withdraw in July 2011.

In recent days, U.S. commanders in Kabul and Washington have gone to great pains to describe the Marja offensive as a new beginning. ‘This is the start point of a new strategy,’ one senior military official told reporters on Thursday. ‘This is our first salvo.’

Here’s another gem: “[I] n purely military terms, sending 11,000 U.S. and Afghan troops to defeat a few hundred Taliban fighters in Marja won’t change much in Afghanistan. The greater significance of the battle is in how it is perceived in the rest of Afghanistan and in America.”

www.veteranstoday.com...

So if this latest offensive is a very important PR stunt to influence domestic U.S. opinion on the war in Afghanistan, it makes me wonder, do these unfortunately killings get reported on in American TV news?

Or is it a propaganda show all together in your MSM news, does this filter through the censorship during this campaign and offensive?

Here in Europe, all these unfortunately killings during this offensive got quite a lot of airtime in the Television news so far.

It's so damn sad to see children losing their lives, even if mistakes happen!

Stop the Killing!!

Originally posted by David9176
Hey GUS. I didn't state the were intentionally killing civilians. If you can find it...I'll give you a star.

Easy, Gus. I didn't say you were. I just stated a fact: The US military isn't intentionally targetting civilians.

And you can keep the freakin' star.