The Porno Deciet that could jail millions...

A couple years ago a group of pedophiles threaded to spread encrypted kiddy porn across the internet.

These were to be sent in a way that if you downloaded a photo or other materiel that was completely legal these encrypted photos would tag along and be stored on your computer without your knowledge.

There idea was that if the government started finding the kiddy porn on everyone's computer. that at first they would try prosecuting them till they found it was a setup then they would not be able to prosecute anyone.

Then the pedophiles would be free to collect photos because the government would be unable to tell who was being setup or who was not.

Most pedophiles no longer keep there collections on there computers.
with the high capacity flash drives on the market today and programs like Truecrypt.
With a 64gb USB flash drive and truecrypt and the invisible partition you can put on a flash drive with it you can hide a lot of data,
And no small town or city cops have the training to even find it or even know its there , It would take a state or federal forensics lab to find and recover the data

Originally posted by juzchilln
For those of you who are honest, you will admit that at one time or another you have browsed the net for adult material. It doesn't matter if you condone or agree with this practice, the point I have still remains.

Every once in a while, on a seemingly trusted porn site, you might have come across a video containing a young woman in a sex act. You click it, however there is no age verification legal notices or any particular trusted site source watermarked on the video. You soon realize that the girl in the video may or may not be 18 years old. So you click out of the video.
Most men and women fail to realize that those videos often remain in your Temp files. In other words you still retain ownership of that material.

Now, there are 10's of millions of people in ,United States alone, who could possibly have child porn video stored in their computer's Temp files. We're talking millions of illegal videos here.

The conspiracy I have thought of is this. If Law enforcement and DHS were to tag and track those transfers, then they could potentially have legal charges against most of it's citizens. Something they could keep on file should the time come when you start to misbehave.

This is a scary reality which could very well be happening. I can't help but recall the increasing number of high profile people torn down with charges of illegal child porn.

Any thoughts? And BTW, I'd don't really care if you like porn or not so this thread isn't about your views on internet porn. I'm just bringing up a concern so take it easy!!

[edit on 11-9-2009 by juzchilln]

I recently deleted any porn I had on my computer for this very reason and have thought of this on many occasions and it does scare me....

there really is no age verification on any pics or videos.........We trust they are at least 18........but to be honest now that I think about it, we never really know...


However.......If there is nothing within the information stored on our computer that says she is under 18, then how can they charge somebody with that when they didn't even know the age ......

The only real way to know the age of somebody is if they tell you in person or it is documented for others to see......


The only thing I ask, is that if they start charging others, then anyone involved in the case be is policement or lawyers , judges, or whoever, also be checked for any criminal activity......or any similar things such as those they are trying to charge people with...


I would be willing to bet, that the leader of that agency who is trying to catch you for something you knew nothing about is more than likely doing or has done something far worse....


It's the control factor.............The instincts of humans are enough to control and police ourselves......no we have everbody lobbying and controlling this and that...

It's all a bunch of douche bag controllers who will ruin somebody else's life just to take a baby step in the right political direction.....

Here's something to watch out for.

A friend of my ex-husband received a visit from the FBI a few months ago. The agents confiscated all his computers and computer equipment.

The problem came in the form of underage girls sending clad pictures of themselves via myspace... sent to his 16 year old son!

The FBI crawled up his colon till they were sure the stuff was indeed sent to his son, and not him pretending to be his son. Double and triple-checking.

I understand this kind of procedure, and so did the man who had to contend with the invasive, metaphorical proctological exam.

When it comes to teens, anyone anywhere can have anything on their computers, which can in turn bite them hard on the backside. So, those of us with kids have to sleep with our eyes open, and police what they're sending - and receiving - on the computer.

I have a few older computers that were either given to me or garbage picked. It hadn't really dawned on me that these might have these hidden files and pictures etc. on the hard drives. I suppose anyone who garbage picks these computers can be prosecuted for something in their possession.

I f the government convicts people based on flimsy evidence, than wer're all guilty that use the internet and or have computers.

I have been on the internet since it was started. Yes I am talking about when you got slip access and you had not much more than email and usenet and a few government systems long before the web.

I do not really care much for porn as it's downloads slow down internet traffic as a whole and provides a reason for government intrusion into my file space.

I do use a few things just in case I am searching for something that might turn up some search returns that might put me on adult sites. For one I use firefox and go into private mode when I do searches that have parameters that might land me in some adult area, the second thing is that I also run File Shredder which is a reliable open source bit of software that removes files completely from my system not just deleting them which as most of you know just removes the first few bits from the file name.

Running this file shredder software after dumping the cashe of the broswer eliminated the content completely.

I don't see how this is such a concern. The fact is, there is a fine line between 17 and 18, and even 16 in some cases. A whole lot of the stuff you find online at the popular pron sites are amateurs. If YOU can't tell the difference between 16-18, chances are neither can anyone else, unless it's a studio production in which case the producer should be checking.

I've been worried about this at times, but I think that if a site were suspect it'd be shut down. They look for stuff that is OBVIOUSLY illegal, abusive or violent. I think the greater concern should be that there is no age verification on many sites for the person WATCHING the stuff.

Internet porn laws are so behind the technology anyway. And I've heard of no plans in the works to get them up to speed. I think it's such a huge area that no politician will even approach it. How do you regulate something so international in nature, when every country has very different laws?

It's a mess.

I go on like the 'tube' porn sites, and they have disclaimers that say everyone is over the age of 18 and will remove videos if they don't think they are. Just the fact that the site said they are over the age of 18 will make you innocent and the site guilty. Good day.

Good afternoon All,

As a computer guy, and an ISP I have a particular knowledge on this kind of stuff that I would like to share.
First off, three simple concepts need to be satisfied in order for you to be convicted of a crime of this sort.

They are:
1) Care
2) Consent
3) Control

If these three points cannot be satisfied, you will not be convicted. You may still be charged, but you will not be convicted unless your lawyer is the dumbest PD on the planet.

In example, any person who has early clips of Tracy Lords on their computer, may not be aware she was under 18 at the time. These clips are freely available on the net. So if you download one from what you believe is a trusted source, then you do not satisfy the Consent component.

If you receive a popup that contains an image of an underage girl in a compromising position, you do not satisfy the Control aspect. You did not request the 3rd part advertisement, nor did you have control over its appearance.

If you happen to be going through your computer, and find a schwack of underage porn, it's likely that your system was compromised by some kiddie porn group, and you are a patsy. Generally you can find out if your system has been used in this fashion by clicking Start >> run >> cmd>> enter in the dos window type netstat -an >> enter. the left side shows you the available open listen ports, the right connected users to those ports. Some ports are normal the format is 0.0.0.0:port number where the 0.0.0.0 represents your IP address.

Just because your system isn't open on ports 20,21 does not mean you don't have an ftp running on your system. My suggestion would be to download and run the free process explorer utility by Sysinernals which can be grabbed Here

Now, the next logical question is why don't these ISP's get arrested for hosting this stuff. Again the 3 points need to be satisfied. Care, consent and control. Since the ISP can claim they are unaware, they do not satisfy control, UNTIL notified. If the ISP fails to act once notified that this material is present they can be charged and convicted.

Drive protection. Encryption works. North American produced encryption does not work. All N. American encryption has a back door built in. This is required by law. So no super computing required to hack into it. If you are going to use encryption to protect yourself, there is an algorithm called IDEA produced in Finland. A 256 bit encryption idea key is equal to a 256 byte rsa key, to give you an example of strength. IDEA has no built in back door, or didn't the last time I checked.

Your best bet to protect your old drive when you are done with it, is to take a drill and perforate the drive platter. If the material is not there, there is no drive recovery. There are other ways to protect your self, but the very best way is to become educated. A few simple steps will help protect you. Always use a hardware based firewall/router, keep anti virus up to date, and be aware of what windows update is actually updating. Norton isn't the only company to be caught with their hand in the cookie jar..*cough.Apple..*cough..

Thanks for reading.
..Ex

Originally posted by v3_exceed
Your best bet to protect your old drive when you are done with it, is to take a drill and perforate the drive platter. If the material is not there, there is no drive recovery. There are other ways to protect your self, but the very best way is to become educated. A few simple steps will help protect you. Always use a hardware based firewall/router, keep anti virus up to date, and be aware of what windows update is actually updating. Norton isn't the only company to be caught with their hand in the cookie jar..*cough.Apple..*cough..

All this is very insightful, thanks for your expert input. What does Apple have that can compromise your PC? Whenever I do a reformat, it seems like problems start when my wife reinstalls i-Tunes. I always make sure to switch off any auto updates, and I get rid of that Bonjour service.

Anything else i-tunes/Quicktime installs that I should take care of?

Originally posted by mblahnikluver
When I saw the title I thought, damn Im going to jail

well this is interesting. I have always been told that you cant really erase anything off your computer, someone will always be able to retrieve it. I know many watch porn but if you didnt know they were underage why should you be in jail? If there is no disclaimer then should you be jailed for not knowing? no! Shouldnt they worry about who filmed it and made it?! Anyways.....there goes more privacy.

My sentiments exactly. How are we to be jailed but not the creators of the website? Don't websites go through atleast 1 screening process? How is it they are allowed to upload and share this with the masses but we're the ones that get in trouble for it? I'm not sure their case would hold up in court. Unless of course it was obvious the person was underage, there's no excuse for that.

Originally posted by -NewSense-
My sentiments exactly. How are we to be jailed but not the creators of the website? Don't websites go through atleast 1 screening process? How is it they are allowed to upload and share this with the masses but we're the ones that get in trouble for it? I'm not sure their case would hold up in court. Unless of course it was obvious the person was underage, there's no excuse for that.

It wouldn't hold up in court. Besides, usually sites have disclaimers saying that you cannot post 'this this this or this' or your material will be removed and it says that all actors are 18 or older. How can you be accused of child pornography when you go on a site that says this? The website would be in trouble, you were just an innocent victim to their lies. But like I said, I go on TUBE porn sites...not like real ones. So I am speaking from a tube perspective...

Originally posted by -NewSense-

Originally posted by mblahnikluver
When I saw the title I thought, damn Im going to jail

well this is interesting. I have always been told that you cant really erase anything off your computer, someone will always be able to retrieve it. I know many watch porn but if you didnt know they were underage why should you be in jail? If there is no disclaimer then should you be jailed for not knowing? no! Shouldnt they worry about who filmed it and made it?! Anyways.....there goes more privacy.

My sentiments exactly. How are we to be jailed but not the creators of the website? Don't websites go through atleast 1 screening process? How is it they are allowed to upload and share this with the masses but we're the ones that get in trouble for it? I'm not sure their case would hold up in court. Unless of course it was obvious the person was underage, there's no excuse for that.

I think this is related to how out of touch politicians are with the nature of the internet and other technology. If they knew how easy it were to find porn (the majority of the web is porn), and how little verification is done on either side I would HOPE they would jump on regulations...

If porn were so accessible when I were just hitting puberty, I would be a raving deviant right now. The fact that I had to fight for porn made sure my hormones were tempered.

Originally posted by El Davicho

All this is very insightful, thanks for your expert input. What does Apple have that can compromise your PC? Whenever I do a reformat, it seems like problems start when my wife reinstalls i-Tunes. I always make sure to switch off any auto updates, and I get rid of that Bonjour service.

Anything else i-tunes/Quicktime installs that I should take care of?

Apple was found to be installing a "root kit" onto pc's in a stealth manner. A root kit is a resource that allows an outside person to have "root" or system access to someones computer without their knowledge or consent. These kinds of resources have their own security levels and protections, but aren't very secure. This part was supposed to be removed fro the software, but was it? Or was it just better hidden? Another good reason to run a program that shows you what connections your system is listening for. Visiting Iana.org will show you port assignments for application. (google Iana port assignments)

I also do not use auto update except for anti-virus (using free avast) and I wait for service packs for operating system updates. Although I keep firefox updated as best i can and use the adblock addon. (tools >> addons>> see all addons >> search for adblock

I tunes works well on a fast computer with a large amount of ram. Older slower computers, tend to crash a lot with itunes. (just an observation)

Regards
..Ex

Originally posted by v3_exceed

Originally posted by El Davicho

All this is very insightful, thanks for your expert input. What does Apple have that can compromise your PC? Whenever I do a reformat, it seems like problems start when my wife reinstalls i-Tunes. I always make sure to switch off any auto updates, and I get rid of that Bonjour service.

Anything else i-tunes/Quicktime installs that I should take care of?

Apple was found to be installing a "root kit" onto pc's in a stealth manner. A root kit is a resource that allows an outside person to have "root" or system access to someones computer without their knowledge or consent. These kinds of resources have their own security levels and protections, but aren't very secure. This part was supposed to be removed fro the software, but was it? Or was it just better hidden? Another good reason to run a program that shows you what connections your system is listening for. Visiting Iana.org will show you port assignments for application. (google Iana port assignments)

I also do not use auto update except for anti-virus (using free avast) and I wait for service packs for operating system updates. Although I keep firefox updated as best i can and use the adblock addon. (tools >> addons>> see all addons >> search for adblock

I tunes works well on a fast computer with a large amount of ram. Older slower computers, tend to crash a lot with itunes. (just an observation)

Regards
..Ex

Can I block the ports they are going through, and still use the software?

Originally posted by El Davicho
Can I block the ports they are going through, and still use the software?

Good Afternoon,

You cannot block the communication ports of software that requires these ports to communicate for their operation. Itunes will go to the net, to download cd covers..album covers etc. If these aren't important then you may be able to block aspects of the communication.

The easiest way to find out would be trial and error. Block a port, see if the app fails. Just make a list of what you have done, so you can undo it. After a bit of familiarity, you will know which work and which don't.

If security is important to you, i would suggest at the very least you have a router or hardware based firewall. Software based firewalls look like they are working even when they are not, so cannot be trusted. beyond the firewall; which will stop unrequested inbound attempts, would be knowing what is on your computer and what it is trying to do. A little education goes a long way to protecting yourself. In truth, you are already taking steps to protect yourself just by asking questions and researching answers.

Regards
..Ex

Originally posted by v3_exceed
If you happen to be going through your computer, and find a schwack of underage porn, it's likely that your system was compromised by some kiddie porn group, and you are a patsy. Generally you can find out if your system has been used in this fashion by clicking Start >> run >> cmd>> enter in the dos window type netstat -an >> enter. the left side shows you the available open listen ports, the right connected users to those ports. Some ports are normal the format is 0.0.0.0:port number where the 0.0.0.0 represents your IP address.

Just because your system isn't open on ports 20,21 does not mean you don't have an ftp running on your system. My suggestion would be to download and run the free process explorer utility by Sysinernals which can be grabbed Here

So, I don't want this thread to turn into a tutorial, but I like learning new things about my PC. And I like to keep it clean. So, I need to ask, I ran that CMD and lots of IPs show up in the right column. How do I know if they are 'bad' or compromising my PC? Also, what is the purpose of the process explorer? Seems to do much the same thing as task manager...

Use linux... avoid all those issues altogether.

My son used to go to those porn sites, and we got a load of
Trojan Horses from it. Somehow those places are nests of viruses etc.

It cost me to get the computer cleaned up, and they are now forbidden territory.

Originally posted by getreadyalready
reply to post by jeasahtheseer

 

You can never erase things from your harddrive!! NEVER! I have a friend in computer tech for the FBI!

Then your friend never told you about 3x overwriting.

I perform forensics for a living, and although yes, there are files you delete that are still there, they CAN be overwritten. When you delete a file, you don't erase it from disk, you merely remove an entry from a table which was linked to the data. The data will stay there until such time that the space is needed for a new file, at which time it will be overwritten.

Now there are, what we used to call "FAT TRACKS", Which is why FBI standard for erasing drives is 3 times overwriting.

Your assertion is simply false.

reply to post by El Davicho


Good evening,
Attempting to not make this into a tutorial, however to further my previous posts on this issue, here is an example of a netstat out put.

TCP   192.168.1.104:54319    96.17.8.40:80   CLOSE_WAIT
TCP    192.168.1.104:54320    96.17.8.40:80    CLOSE_WAIT
TCP    192.168.1.104:57922    206.33.55.126:80    CLOSE_WAIT
TCP    192.168.1.104:57923    206.33.55.126:80    CLOSE_WAIT
TCP    192.168.1.104:63337    65.55.15.125:80    CLOSE_WAIT
TCP    192.168.1.104:63413    96.17.8.19:80    ESTABLISHED
TCP    192.168.1.104:63425    96.17.8.81:80    ESTABLISHED
TCP    192.168.1.104:63427    75.126.76.151:80    TIME_WAIT
TCP    192.168.1.104:63433    75.126.76.151:80    ESTABLISHED
TCP    192.168.1.104:63435    75.126.76.151:80    ESTABLISHED

The first column is protocol. in this case. TCP.
The second column is my local system. ip:port
The third column is the foreign computer. ip:port
The last column in this example is the state of the connection.

TCP 192.168.1.104:63448    66.150.7.226:80   ESTABLISHED

This shows I'm connected to a machine, on port 80. thats HTTP or "hypertext transport protocol" Meaning I'm viewing a webpage and the connection is established.

What you are looking for is if people are connecting to YOUR machine on low ports. (less than 1000)

So, if in this example the ports were reversed that computer would be connecting to a webserver on MY machine. Which would be ok if I was aware of running a webserver. If I wasn't, then I've probably been hacked at some point and am serving up files for who knows what.

TCP    192.168.1.104:80  66.150.7.226:63448   ESTABLISHED < webpage
TCP    192.168.1.104:21  66.150.7.226:63448  ESTABLISHED < FTP
TCP  192.168.1.104:20  66.150.7.226:63448  ESTABLISHED < FTP data

If it were to look like this, then I have a webserver and an ftp program running. All of which would be bad without my consent.

What all of this shows is essentially that just visiting a webpage that has porn on it will not get you convicted of an offense. There are rules that the police need to follow and the court follow to ensure that those people who have been taken advantage of are not put wrongly into jail. There is tons of disinformation online about the person who didn't know their network was being used..or who didn't know they were hacked who ended up in jail, but that simply isn't accurate. It was..many years ago, but these days Very unlikely unless you have a retarded PD.

Now here is what is really scary. These days, when you take your computer into a repair facility, the person repairing your computer will troll through your files. If they find child pornography, or anything they suspect is child pornography they will report you to the police for it.

These repair technicians are in many cases BARELY COMPETENT in the first place. So they have in the past assumed that you must be guilty without first looking for trojans, stealth ftp programs or other related apps. This is scary because just being publicly accused is enough for you to be convicted in the "peoples court". After which even if you are vindicated, your life is in ruins.

Of course this isn't how the system is supposed to work, but this IS how it works in the media. Even on ATS we see people being charged, and immediately convicted within this very forum for these kinds of crimes. There is no point in expressing disdain about it, because one just gets flamed. So I suggest good A/v and a hardware based firewall.

Thanks for reading.
..EX