Chemtrails Photo and Research Thread!!!!

Originally posted by rubbertramp
do you remember kuscinich's bill?

Well that bill was not written by Denis Kuscinich, it was written by UFO enthusiasts:

One of the more pervasive myths regarding “chemtrails” is that current presidential candidate Dennis Kuchinich tried to have them banned by an act of congress, but was pressured by the government to modify the act to remove the mention of “chemtrails”.
So what really happened? In a nutshell, Kucinich did not write the bill (or read it, until too late), the focus of the bill is nothing to do with chemtrails,

it was written by UFO enthusiasts trying to:
1.Nullify a vast conspiracy by the “military-industrial complex”
2.Allow the use of suppressed alien technology for free energy
3.Avoid accidentally shooting down (or scaring away) visiting aliens.

Including Carol Rosin:

Who wrote this? The original language for the bill was actually created by Alfred Webre and Carol Rosin. See, from Webre’s web site:
www.exopolitics.com...
With Dr. Carol S. Rosin and many others, [Webre] is a co-architect of the Space Preservation Act and the Space Preservation Treaty introduced to the U.S. Congress by Congressman Dennis Kucinich (D-Ohio) to ban space-based weapons.

According to Rosin herself:

From Carol Rosin
[email protected]
1-28-2
Perhaps I can help correct some fuzzy information that is being spread about H.R.3616, the Space Preservation Act of 2002, and Congressman Dennis Kucinich.
This bill will only ban space-based weapons and the use of weapons to destroy or damage objects in space that are in orbit. It is NOT a bill to ban chemtrails and/or psychotronics or mind control devises or any specific weapons listed in the category of definitions in the original bill.
I’m not sure where that rumor started, but in any case, those definitional were only listed on the original bill for definitional purposes…to exemplify what space-based weapons might be deployed in space if the space-based weapons bill isn’t passed. Frequently bills are revised, and things like definitions are removed. No big deal. The legislation is in no way compromised. This Congressman and his legislation maintain their integrity and commitment to ban space-based weapons. It was never a bill to ban chemtrails or mind control technologies.

Well I can tell Ms. Rosin exactly were these rumors started, and why they keep on going. They started on the Chemtrail Sites, and those guys refuse to remove debunked/incorrect information from their sites as it hurts their business.

Originally posted by Udontknowme
As per the OP's request, I will show one of my recent pictures, happening right above my head.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/5028de7d4c9a.jpg[/atsimg]

The plane out front, is pumping dry ice, or CO2 to supercool the atmosphere, while the back two AC pump out silver iodide to form ice crystals.

More likely the one in front is at a higher altitude were there is insufficient humidity to sustain a persistent contrail, the other two are lower in different atmospheric conditions.

reply to post by defcon5


Looks like they're all producing deadly dihydrogen monoxice crystals to me

btw Udontknowme: CO2 warms the atmosphere (it's why some claim that CO2 is responsible for global warming ) and why would anyone want to use silver iodide to make water crystals when water vapour - which all engines produce - works so much better


(Did you know that in theory your car can produce a persistent contrail?)

reply to post by defcon5


i'm just wondering, did you read the bill, or just someones opinion of the bill?

not to be an ass here, but i'm going to ask this question for the 4th time or so.
can anyone show me a picture of vapor trails that act like the ones we see today from the past?
the reason i keep asking this is,
1-there is something chemically altered about them, or
2-the atmosphere has changed so much in the last 20 or so years that persistent trails are now common place while non existent in the pat.

Originally posted by rubbertramp
i'm just wondering, did you read the bill, or just someones opinion of the bill?

I posted the comments of the person who WROTE the bill for you. I think she has a pretty good idea of what the bill is supposed to be about, you disagree?

Carol Rosin

She wrote that bill after Warner Von Braun asked her to help champion the banning of space based weaponry:

Rosin was the first woman to hold the position of Corporate Manager at Fairchild Industries from 1974 through 1977, where she met the late Wernher von Braun. When they first met in early 1974, Von Braun was dying of cancer. According to Rosin's accounts, Von Braun spent the last years of his life explaining to her his position that space-based weapons are dangerous, destabilizing, too costly, unnecessary, and unworkable, and explaining the available alternatives. He asked Dr. Rosin to be his spokesperson and to appear on occasions when he was too ill to speak. According to Rosin, he also asked her to take on the challenge of promoting the ban of space weapons by educating decision makers and the grassroots about transforming the military industrial complex into a peaceful space exploration industry.

So are you going to find a better person to explain that Chemtrails were only mentioned in the bill as a definition of a possible future space based weapon system, then the person who wrote it? She wrote the bill, then wrote an explanation of why Chemtrails were mentioned in that bill, but I guess that you know what she meant by including them more so then she did?

How much more “straight from the horses mouth” can you get it?
Talk about making up a delusion to fit your theory...

Originally posted by rubbertramp
not to be an ass here, but i'm going to ask this question for the 4th time or so.
can anyone show me a picture of vapor trails that act like the ones we see today from the past?

I did that already, but you seem to have ignored it for some reason:

Originally posted by defcon5
reply to post by rubbertramp

 

STS-30 May 4, 1989:



STS-27 December 2, 1988:


STS-9 November 28, 1983:

WWII:




I had a beatuiful one from the movie Patton (1970) but I took it down because of copywrite stuff. If you look at the movies “Back to the Future” (1985) there are a bunch in there. Also if you check out some of the old westerns they show up in them as well.

Can you see them this time?

reply to post by rubbertramp

can anyone show me a picture of vapor trails that act like the ones we see today from the past?

Here is something, it's from 1944!



Of course, the big piston engines and their hot exhaust was of different consistency...in a way, because of the propellors and the way that they mix the air behind, it is similar to the High-bypass turbofan engines that were coming into more and more use in the 1980s.

The High-bypass jet engine is really a large "propellor" out front, that is 'ducted' (surrounded by a shroud) and this is what provides the majority of thrust, today. (It's called the N1 fan.)

Your older turbo-jet engines, like the P/W JT-8D, used on the B707, B727 and early B737 (among others) made contrails, but they produced most of their thrust from the force of the exhaust gases...and those exhaust gases weren't surrounded by the other airflow, as in modern engines. (AND the old piston airplanes). This all means the formation of the contrails is different, and they have more time to persist. But, then, as toady, persistence depended on the environmental factors. PLUS there is a LOT MORE air traffic, today!!



I like the comment posted by "wineflyguy" on this video...here's his quote:

Chemtrails are the biggest internet hoax of all time. There's no such thing... It's funny to see people try and analyze "chemtrails" when they don't have a clue about airplanes, weather, ATC or aviation in general.

Couldn't have said it better myself!

(Actually I have, dozens of times, but not with that sort of clarity!!!)


Here is a series of videos, the first short one shows the very basic workings of an 'axial-flow' compressor jet engine (these are very similar to the APU used on modern jets today).

The longer video in the series shows a more compex engine, similar to the JT-8D design.



Here's a simplified High-bypass turbofan display:



[edit on 22 July 2009 by weedwhacker]

Hi, chemtrail fans.

Did we find the first chemtrail experiment, there?:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Blue skies.

reply to post by C-JEAN

Did we find the first chemtrail experiment, there?:

No.

All that needs to be said about that.

reply to post by C-JEAN


That is about something called “Star Jelly”, believe it or not. I have never heard of it before, but it has been around a lot longer then airplanes and contrails, so it cannot be related to it. It seems to be something more akin to Raining Frogs or Fish...

Star Jelly

There have been reports of pwdre sêr (Welsh for rot of the stars) for centuries. A long article in the paranormal magazine Fate declared Star Jelly to be of extraterrestrial origin, calling it "cellular organic matter" which exists as "prestellar molecular clouds" which float through space.[citation needed]
The Book of British Amphibians and Reptiles (page 138) author M Smith, explains that Star Jelly is most likely formed from the glands in the oviducts of frogs and toads. Birds and mammals will eat the animals but not the oviducts which, when they come into contact with moisture, swell and distort leaving a vast pile of jelly like substance sometimes also refered to a Otter Jelly.

Raining Animals
Raining animals is a relatively rare meteorological phenomenon, although occurrences have been reported from many countries throughout history. One hypothesis that has been furthered to explain this phenomenon is that strong winds travelling over water sometimes pick up creatures such as fish or frogs, and carry them for up to several miles. However, this primary aspect of the phenomenon has never been witnessed or scientifically tested.
The animals most likely to drop from the sky in a rainfall are fish and frogs, with birds coming third. Sometimes the animals survive the fall, especially fish, suggesting the animals are dropped shortly after extraction. Several witnesses of raining frogs describe the animals as startled, though healthy, and exhibiting relatively normal behavior shortly after the event. In some incidents, however, the animals are frozen to death or even completely encased in ice. There are examples where the product of the rain is not intact animals, but shredded body parts. Some cases occur just after storms having strong winds, especially during tornadoes.

The Jellyfish description certainly seems to fit the closest to what happened. My second guess would be crap from the Great Pacific Garbage Patch, considering that it occurred in Washington.

Great Pacific Garbage Patch
The Eastern Garbage Patch has one of the highest levels of plastic particulate suspended in the upper water column. As a result, it is one of several oceanic regions where researchers have studied the effects and impact of plastic photodegradation in the neustonic layer of water. Unlike debris which biodegrades, the photodegraded plastic disintegrates into ever smaller pieces while remaining a polymer. This process continues down to the molecular level.
As the plastic flotsam photodegrades into smaller and smaller pieces, it concentrates in the upper water column. As it disintegrates, the plastic ultimately becomes small enough to be ingested by aquatic organisms which reside near the ocean's surface. Plastic waste thus enters the food chain through its intense concentration in the neuston.

Either way its not related to contrails or “chemtrails” or this crap would be falling everywhere, which is not happening. Interesting video though.

Originally posted by rubbertramp

not to be an ass here, but i'm going to ask this question for the 4th time or so.
can anyone show me a picture of vapor trails that act like the ones we see today from the past?

I can even present a description of them

The spreading of jet contrails into extensive cirrus sheets is a familiar sight. Often, when persistent contrails exist from 25,000 to 40,000 ft, several long contrails increase in number and gradually merge into an almost solid interlaced sheet.

~ ~ ~

Contrail development and spreading begins in the morning hours with the start of heavy jet traffic and may extend from horizon to horizon as the air traffic peaks. Fig. 1 is a typical example of midmorning contrails that occured on 17 December 1969 northwest of Boulder. By midafternoon, sky conditions had developed into those shown in Fig. 2 an almost solid contrail sheet reported to average 500 m in depth.

Airborne Observations of Contrail Effects on the Thermal Radiation Budget
Peter M. Kuhn
Journal of the Atmospheric Sciences
Volume 27, Issue 6 (September 1970) pp. 937–942

the news article and reports about the gooey substance that rained down on that town in Washington State did make me stop and think. As has been said before, the military has been known to do some stupid things and then claim ignorance. So I thought there was a chance that some military entity spread some goo into the atmosphere to poison the town as a test. But then I see the report about the black blob floating in the arctic sea. And it hits me. the way it rains frogs and fish is the water spouts or tornadoes suck the things up into the air and then disperse them. then it rains and those things that got sucked up come down. So if a blob of goo was floating in the ocean and was sucked up by a water spout, it is entirely plausible that it could rain down goo in a coastal town. As far as what made those folks sick, I really don't know. but that is a hypothesis of the incident.

reply to post by network dude


Yes but with a giant black op's budget and the fact that the american government has no problem poising us through the water and food why not our air? It makes perfect sense. Drive down interstate 90 in new york state... only place these trails are, are in heavily populated areas... seems strange to me...

reply to post by iamjesusphish

only place these trails are, are in heavily populated areas... seems strange to me...

Did you bother to look at the amount of normal commercial air traffic in your area?

I linked it for you.
Here again:
flightaware.com...

reply to post by iamjesusphish

I get that the dark side of the government could be doing all kinds of crazy things to us without our knowledge. But Chemtrails don't make any sense. I am not a scientist, weatherman, cloud specialist, or even a real smart guy for that matter, but there are a bunch of ways they could poison you for a lot less money and do it a whole lot better. I can't understand why so many people won't take off the conspiracy glasses for two minutes to think about this logically. If "they" wanted to poison a group of people, or even have them come into contact with a chemical, they could put it in the water, put it on the local food (vegetables), have people on the street spray with a fake flower.(like the old gag flower with water)

Spraying at such altitudes would make whatever they sprayed dissipate and spread without knowing where it would come down at. I used to work on C-130s in the air force. I did the radios and radar. One of my systems was the DVS, or Doppler velocity sensor. It's job was to determine the wind drift and aircraft drift in order to drop troops in the right spot. Ask anyone here from the 82nd Airborne and see if they always landed on target. (hint, a lot of them went into the trees) they would be a little hot if they missed the DZ. My point is we didn't know where a person dropped from 8 thousand feet was going to land without a large margin of error. So now put that into perspective and think about a fine mist at 30,000 feet with a 200MPH jet stream that changes direction with thermal pockets of warm and cold air. And the kicker is that nobody knows where these pockets will turn up? thats why the weather man "predicts" the weather and doesn't just tell you what it will be. he is guessing. Would some general authorize the spraying of a small town in Colorado only to have the spray end up coming down in a town in Illinois where his sister and her kids live? I doubt it. Just think about Occam's Razor. the simplest explanation is most likely the correct one. Sorry to rant.

reply to post by weedwhacker


i'll check it out, youtube won't play it at the moment. i'm hoping it doesn't just show a regular contrail, and shows a persistent one, expanding, hanging etc...

i've watched hours of old film reels trying to prove myself wrong. nothing i've seen could be classified in nasa's sense of a persistent contrail.


[edit on 22-7-2009 by rubbertramp]

ok, i watched it, and it shows nothing behind the planes beyond just a short distance.
nasa has designated the long expanding ones 'persistant vapor trails', i have yet to see one pre 1990's.

[edit on 22-7-2009 by rubbertramp]

reply to post by rubbertramp


What about the ones from the 80's space shuttles where you can see them persisting and turning into clouds?

reply to post by weedwhacker


I know how much normal air traffic we have here... and I never see commercial jets emitting these trails... its always a military jet doing it. May have something to do with Niagara Falls base but who knows... When I was a little kid in the early 90's I remember blue skies... now they are all but gone...

[edit on 22-7-2009 by iamjesusphish]

reply to post by defcon5


don't think i've seen those. i'll do a search and see what i can come up with, unless you can do it quicker.

the reason i'm so persistent in this is because of an aged friend of mine. he was a ww2 vet, used to be in the airforce, about a year ago, we were camped in the arizona highcountry, when the trails were stretched from horizon to horizon. arizona summer, pre-monsoons, basically no humidity at groundlevel. anyhow, i pointed up and asked him what those were. he looked at me and said he had no idea. this coming from an airforce vet. he said he never really paid attention, but had not ever seen anythinglike it. to this day we cannot find evidence of this in the past.
he's passed on now, r.i.p., and i'd still like to figure out what is goin on.

thank a ww2 vet if you know any still alive, they are basically almost extinct.



[edit on 22-7-2009 by rubbertramp]

reply to post by rubbertramp

arizona summer, pre-monsoons, basically no humidity at groundlevel.

I used to live in Phoenix. And Las Vegas. I know of the Arizona monsoons...

Just because it's dry on the ground doesn't mean it is at altitude.

There is a lot of traffic over Arizona...and Las Vegas.


I just peeked at FlightTracker...there's the Continental from Houston to Tokyo, just passed over about 30 minutes ago...American LAX to Boston...United the other way, Denver to LAX....etc, etc. Las Vegas gets a lot of traffic, and many also overfly Arizona, just depends on city pair.