Islamic Law's Influence in America a Growing Concern

All forms of Extremism should be condemned.

Originally posted by Majorion

With respect EU,

Where is the evidence for these claims about Muhammad?

Verses of the Q'uran, as well as other texts.

It is the truth. Mohammed was a pillager of caravans, and if you ask any Muslim they will tell you that it was because of the times.

reply to post by TheDustman


No need to apologize. My mistake if I was not clear in my posts

Originally posted by Majorion
With respect EU,

Where is the evidence for these claims about Muhammad?


[edit on 30/3/09 by Majorion]

If you want examples, here is one.

O Prophet! Lo! We have made lawful unto thee thy wives unto whom thou hast paid their dowries, and those whom thy right hand possesseth of those whom Allah hath given thee as spoils of war, and a believing woman if she give herself unto the Prophet and the Prophet desire to ask her in marriage - a privilege for thee only, not for the rest of believers.

www.sacred-texts.com...

What do you think it means that it is lawful to take wives, and other spoils of war?

Muhammed made a law that Muslims could only marry 4 women, yet he married 15, and most of them were captives from pillaging caravans.

He also took one which was very young Aisha, she was either 6 or 7 years old when she was married to Muhammed, and consumated their marriage when she was 9 years old. Mohammed was very old by then, 60-70 years old if I remember correctly.



[edit on 30-3-2009 by ElectricUniverse]

Should we be concerned with the growth rate of Islam:

* According to the "Pew Forum on Religion & Public Life"[4] “

Islam is already the fastest-growing religion in Europe. Driven by immigration and high birthrates, the number of Muslims on the continent has tripled in the last 30 years. Most demographers forecast a similar or even higher rate of growth in the coming decades. ”

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
pillaging of caravans, taking women as slaves, or resort to beheading those that would not accept Islam, Muhammed did all those things and worse

Till now, you haven't provided evidence for any of the above claims.

Originally posted by Majorion
Where is the evidence for these claims about Muhammad?

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
If you want examples, here is one.

"O Prophet! Lo! We have made lawful unto thee thy wives unto whom thou hast paid their dowries, and those whom thy right hand possesseth of those whom Allah hath given thee as spoils of war, and a believing woman if she give herself unto the Prophet and the Prophet desire to ask her in marriage - a privilege for thee only, not for the rest of believers."

I have checked out this verse (number 50) on that website, and I have also checked out the verse in it's original language (I can speak and read Arabic fluently).

The verse in Arabic differs somewhat than the translation.

The translation is usually a matter of interpretation, based on what the translator/author believes.

But either way, that verse does not prove nor serve as evidence for any of your original claims.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
What do you think it means that it is lawful to take wives, and other spoils of war?

Muhammed made a law that Muslims could only marry 4 women, yet he married 15, and most of them were captives from pillaging caravans.

He also took one which was very young Aisha, she was either 6 or 7 years old when she was married to Muhammed, and consumated their marriage when she was 9 years old. Mohammed was very old by then, 60-70 years old if I remember correctly.

Just like the translator, you have accepted the interpretation based on highly inaccurate texts known as 'Hadith', which is supposed to be 'hear-say' of what the Prophet said and did.

The belief in Hadith/Sunna is almost always incorporated into the translation and interpretation of the Quran.

Which deems the interpretation and historical context as false.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
Verses of the Q'uran, as well as other texts.

It is the truth. Mohammed was a pillager of caravans, and if you ask any Muslim they will tell you that it was because of the times.

Verses of the Quran? No. Other texts like Hadith? Yes.

Even if I were to ask a Muslim if Muhammed was a pillager of caravans, whether the answer from a Muslim is yes or no; does not establish something as a fact.

Nor the truth.

You may ask any Christian walking down the street something about historical context, but he will believe whatever it is he grew up being told. Correct?

This does not establish something as a historical fact.

This does not verify the claim you have made about Muhammed being a pillager of caravans.

Hmmmm, this is interesting. Isn't Shariah Law supposed to be one of those things that indicate how Britain is going down the pan, and how 'Brits' are spineless for not standing up to Muslims and how it's an indication as how 'Brits' are being 'overtaken' by Muslims and how this could never happen in God-fearing, gun-worshipping America.

I hope the American posters who've rolled out this line previous are enjoying their hypocrisy and waffles this morning.

Speaking from the Muslim State that is the UK, I can only pass on my condolences and state that the US now like th UK is screwed, Luckily this is all planned by the NWO, they are rubbing us up against each other in the hope that one day a race war will spark. Which I think is likely within the next decade or so.

reply to post by Majorion


A video for you to watch with information provided by islamic scholars, Mohammad for a murdering pedophile, who killed up to 1000 people by his own hands, his armies probably slaughter tens of thousands.

Great guy to base a "Religion of peace" on

Islam : What the west needs to know

Google Video Link

[edit on 30/3/2009 by spitefulgod]

Originally posted by Flighty
I can see why SHARIAH LAW would be very appealing to governments.
Especially ones with dictatorial tendencies.
I can't see Americans going for this.
Muslims might have to wait a few more decades to get their numbers up before this would even have a chance of getting off the ground IMO.

perhaps the liberal cretins should be concerned with "ISLAMIC WARMING" than "GLOBAL WARMING" then

Originally posted by Merriman Weir
Hmmmm, this is interesting. Isn't Shariah Law supposed to be one of those things that indicate how Britain is going down the pan, and how 'Brits' are spineless for not standing up to Muslims and how it's an indication as how 'Brits' are being 'overtaken' by Muslims and how this could never happen in God-fearing, gun-worshipping America.

I hope the American posters who've rolled out this line previous are enjoying their hypocrisy and waffles this morning.

I wouldn't be "triumphal" about that, at least they can legally arm themselves, what can I do, raid the tool box?

Originally posted by spitefulgod
A video for you to watch with information provided by islamic scholars

I have a slow connection, so my apologies for not being able to watch the doc.

But I just wanna say this..

The key here: "information provided by islamic scholars"

For the record, I have already condemned so called 'clerics', preachers, translators, and alleged 'scholars' of Islam in this thread.

Since you have obviously watched this video before, would you be so kind as to reference me to the basis of whatever allegations are made against Muhammad, Islam, or otherwise? What is the actual information provided? And from which source?

there is no such thing as a "true" Muslim or "correct" Muslim (anymore than there is a "true" CHristian)- some interpret Islam as a religion of peace, some interpret it more violently- hence, when some world leader like Obama or Brown talk about Muslims who commit violent acts not being "true" Muslims, Im thinking, how the hell would you know, they have read their Qu'ran and studied Islamic teaching more than you have!

Originally posted by blueorder
Im thinking, how the hell would you know, they have read their Qu'ran and studied Islamic teaching more than you have!

Not necessarily blueorder.

Many of these extremists are illiterate.

Do you really believe that anyone who reads the Quran (in full or otherwise) will turn into an extremist?

Have you ever read the Quran yourself?

And I'm not speaking about Oxford Universities latest translation for example.

Originally posted by blueorder
I wouldn't be "triumphal" about that, at least they can legally arm themselves, what can I do, raid the tool box?

It's not a case of being 'triumphal', it's more a case of pointing out this (rapidly eroding) myth that America is somehow impervious to the issues that are facing Britain and the 'it'll never happen here as long as I've got my rifle' mentality.

Well, America has got rifles, and yet the same kind of stories are now appearing in America. So what happened?

Also, reading the gun threads I'm not sure as to how long these guns are going to be of any supposed help anyway. If it's not 'Obama's gonna take our guns', then it's 'the government are buying up all the stocks of ammunition'.

Even then, aren't the bullets reserved for Shariah-loving Muslims, they're also going to have to deal with food thieves for a WTHSHTF scenario. Or perhaps the race war that was allegedly being orchestrated off the back of Obama's inauguration? Or maybe it's the war with Mexicans that's meant to be simmering on the border? Perhaps the Chinese that are meant to be buying up America left, right and centre. Don't forget what the arms are therefore in the first place, they're going to need guns and bullets for when the rogue government comes knocking.

After all that, Americans will be having to raid their tool boxes too, so you're in a no better or worse position.

[edit on 30-3-2009 by Merriman Weir]

SIGH... Orthodox Jews follow Jewish religious laws here in America... just as Muslims do Islamic law... but that does not suppliment state and federal law.

As for the renaming labor day... that had nothing to do with Islamic law. Plus it was an internal [as in one factory] company matter.

[edit on 30-3-2009 by grover]

Originally posted by Majorion
Not necessarily blueorder.

but in most cases, most definitely yes, as "literate" as Brown may be, I rather doubt he has immersed himself in Islamic teaching.

Take the home grown UK bombers, none of them are illiterate, and in fact, the Glasgow bomber was a doctor

Do you really believe that anyone who reads the Quran (in full or otherwise) will turn into an extremist?

I dont think I have stated that?

Have you ever read the Quran yourself?

No

And I'm not speaking about Oxford Universities latest translation for example.

No, what I am saying is that others who have read the Qu'Ran (and rather more than Brown) can use it to justifty their actions- who am I to say they are not a "true" Muslim- they are just Muslims, neither more "true" or less "true" than the next

Originally posted by Merriman Weir
It's not a case of being 'triumphal', it's more a case of pointing out this (rapidly eroding) myth that America is somehow impervious to the issues that are facing Britain and the 'it'll never happen here as long as I've got my rifle' mentality.

The evils of political correctness, multi culturualism and mass immigration unfortunately apply to America as well

Well, America has got rifles, and yet the same kind of stories are now appearing in America. So what happened?

Mass immigration and multi culturalism (though not as pronounced as we experience in the UK, as there tends to be a more strident AMERICANNESS applied than the equivalent Britishness here)

As far as I know the US gun laws do not permit you to murder Muslims- what it does do though, is give you and advantage should the situation, deteriorate, as it surely will

Even then, aren't the bullets reserved for Shariah-loving Muslims, they're also going to have to deal with food thieves for a WTHSHTF scenario. Or perhaps the race war that was allegedly being orchestrated off the back of Obama's inauguration? Or maybe it's the war with Mexicans that's meant to be simmering on the border? Perhaps the Chinese that are meant to be buying up America left, right and centre. Don't forget what the arms are therefore in the first place, they're going to need guns and bullets for when the rogue government comes knocking.

After all that, Americans will be having to raid their tool boxes too, so you're in a no better or worse position.

[edit on 30-3-2009 by Merriman Weir]

They are in a better position, Id rather attack someone with a gun than a ratchet

Originally posted by blueorder
as "literate" as Brown may be, I rather doubt he has immersed himself in Islamic teaching.

I rather doubt that as well. But define Islamic teaching...

There is a huge and immensely significant difference, between reading the Quran and/or "Islamic teaching".

The problem lies with the clerics and so called 'scholars', whom heavily incorporate the fabricated and inaccurate texts known as 'Hadith' or 'Sunna' into the context and interpretation of the Quran.

These fabrications have been devised by those who wish to rule and govern in a specific fashion. Namely in the Middle East.

Those in the Middle East are suffering and being oppressed because of this Sharia Law manipulation and form of control.

The Hadith and Sunna has twisted the religion into something evil.

By your own admission, you have not read the Quran. And certainly have not read it in it's original language.

Well I have, and read it in-full.

What I discovered, was far from what these clerics would have you believe.

[edit on 30/3/09 by Majorion]