Religion, the biggest con of all

Where do I start with a concept that is so antiquated that it bares no relevence in todays society?

Religion is the disease that plagues this planet, full of corrupt individuals who
are only interest is to manipulate and squeeze money out of the poor saps who lap it up and think they're going to be saved.

They declare that we are the sole occupiers of this universe, and be blinkered to the possibility of other life in the cosmos. They have constantly tried to hamper the advance of science, whilst at the same time have used and gained from the use of new technology.

No one is allowed into their inner circle and their many secrets(why won't the
vatican let people into their vaults, even historians?)

There have been many wars in the name of religion. We have terrorists trying to kill us in honour of their god. To fight, kill, and die for a cause that you don't know for sure if its real or not is quite frankly absurd and certainly
bordering on a short cut to thinking.

It was created to keep the peasants in check and stop them from going insane from the thought that there might not be an afterlife.

For the amount of horror that happens on this planet, god just can't exist.

There is actually an entire thread about the Vatican library here somewhere. A lot of good information on it. It might suit you well to do a search for it.

Are you following me around speakeroftruth?

Thanks

Originally posted by thesneakiod
Religion is the disease that plagues this planet, full of corrupt individuals who
are only interest is to manipulate and squeeze money out of the poor saps who lap it up and think they're going to be saved.

I tend to agree with the first part of your statement; that religion is the disease. However it is not the true disease or perhaps I should say the only disease.

The basic ailment of mankind is partisan anything. Self-oriented anything. And even on a group level, we still find a 'self' (entity/identity) that is self-oriented and exclusive of any who won't change their minds to conform.

No one is allowed into their inner circle and their many secrets(why won't the vatican let people into their vaults, even historians?)

They do let scholars/historians in. But the texts are ancient and most are in archaic languages that many of the most learned linguists can not decipher. And the material which they are made of is fragile and old. They truly are protecting them...for what I don't know. Time goes on and the languages grow more obscure and the pages continue to crumble. Those books are dead but God is alive and so are we.

There have been many wars in the name of religion. We have terrorists trying to kill us in honour of their god. To fight, kill, and die for a cause that you don't know for sure if its real or not is quite frankly absurd and certainly bordering on a short cut to thinking.

No doubt. But there are just as many wars fought on things that don't fight back (drugs, etc) and terrorism (fighting terror with terror? won't work!) and the traditional reason was not God but land. Kingdoms and power. It is men that fight and they hide behind creeds and patriotism to excuse themselves.

It was created to keep the peasants in check and stop them from going insane from the thought that there might not be an afterlife.

I think that religion is more fundamentally a natural result of man's inability to understand God. It is expected and was created when man began to have a moment or two of rest between killing food and surviving the wild. That is why astrology is as old as it is and even in the oldest digs, archaeologists find effigies and other evidence of religious activity.

For the amount of horror that happens on this planet, god just can't exist.

Man does! And man causes the horror, not God. God is not a tyrant nor is He cruel. God is wise and knows that the best lesson is learned the hard way. The hardest times the world has known were during the first half of the 20th century. Until then, global terror was not possible...but wars and oppression and all cruelties still took place EVERY DAY in every local community of every sort. But when we began to become one global village we didn't overcome our small minds - our minds must grow as the world becomes small. A small world is only managed correctly with a broad view and an open mind - not one that seeks to divide and make smaller and smaller parts.

Religion (especially nominal organized christianity) campaigns heartily against a 'one world government' and a 'one world religion.' But truly - what other solution is there for war and for our miserable lives spent fearing death? What freedom is there aside from universal freedom and equal rights on all levels? What peace is there that isn't good?

If Jesus, himself, said he came to spread the sword...and the so-called antichrist is coming to bring peace...then maybe the masses need to rethink their values and step apart on their own and SEE the history of the last 7000 years for the chaotic ungodly events that mar the achievements that we should be building a future upon - for all the children on every shore! Sea to shining sea! 7 seas and 7 lands and one species of Man and one creator of ALL.

God DOES exist - I don't expect to persuade you, only testify to my own persuasion in that regard. That is probably the only thing I truly KNOW. And I am almost as sure of one other thing: God doesn't play favorites nor does He pick and choose countries, religions or families.

Those individuals that He plucks (elects) out of the crowd are proven by their unwillingness to divide and spread hate or favoritism. They feed the poor and help all who need help - they might have their own personal religion or they may not appear religious at all! Regardless they keep that part of their life to themselves - they don't evangelize but rather labor and serve. They care about the people in need without trying to gain for self.

You can be sure that such are in God's hands and are doing His will not man's. We kill a lot of them - yesterday was the birthday of just such a one. MLK Jr was truly sent - truly a saint - a prophet who spoke of peace and love beyond man's ability to accept. And He literally turned the other cheek once when a kid threw a rock in a parade and hit him in the face! He didn't do a thing! That is something I admire more than I can say!

Sorry queenannie but rhetoric dogma means nothing to me, you speak as if
you live in the middle ages. Spouting your love of god to an atheist is hardly
an argument for your belief, not that you would need any.

Religion traps people in two ways. You are either born into it, inherited from your parents if you will, then told repeatedly that you would go to hell for this or that, instilling a fear in you (like some strict schoolteacher) instead of a love for
something thats supposed to project it not punish you for it.

Or you turn to god because of some massive event in your life(usually bad).



[edit on 16-1-2007 by thesneakiod]

Originally posted by thesneakiod
Sorry queenannie but rhetoric dogma means nothing to me, you speak as if
you live in the middle ages.

Well, not any more! Perhaps those days left the biggest impression upon my soul - who knows? I said nothing about dogma at all. Rhetoric, maybe, depending on you define the word. I've noticed that it varies.

Spouting your love of god to an atheist is hardly
an argument for your belief, not that you would need any.

Who said I was presenting an argument for my belief? I just posted my views in answer to yours. I spoke more about the love of people for people and the hate, too. That is something objective and tangible that an atheist can relate to as well as a theist or a humanist.

Religion traps people in two ways. You are either born into it, inherited from your parents if you will, then told repeatedly that you would go to hell for this or that, instilling a fear in you (like some strict schoolteacher) instead of a love for something thats supposed to project it not punish you for it.

Or you turn to god because of some massive event in your life(usually bad).

That is three ways. None apply to me - especially since I have never been religious. Trapped, maybe (quite possibly) but now I am freed from any old traps and recognize many and avoid them. I speak only for right now, though - that's all I can say for sure. I am free this moment.

Have you been trapped? If so, how did it occur and what set you free? Are you truly free? Even if never trapped, are you truly free? And how do you know?

Those individuals that He plucks (elects) out of the crowd are proven by their unwillingness to divide and spread hate or favoritism. They feed the poor and help all who need help - they might have their own personal religion or they may not appear religious at all! Regardless they keep that part of their life to themselves - they don't evangelize but rather labor and serve. They care about the people in need without trying to gain for self.

You can be sure that such are in God's hands and are doing His will not man's. We kill a lot of them - yesterday was the birthday of just such a one. MLK Jr was truly sent - truly a saint - a prophet who spoke of peace and love beyond man's ability to accept. And He literally turned the other cheek once when a kid threw a rock in a parade and hit him in the face! He didn't do a thing! That is something I admire more than I can say!

i couldnt agree with you more here. Its not the church, the mosque, the priest, the imam nor anyting else that will lead you to God but the deeds of a man will - the deeds of LOVE.

You admire MLK Jr. for what he has done and I admire you for your warm/loving comments. You are a light worker in my eyes... and there is not many people that feel the way you and i do.

But its never to late.... here is a story that happened to me yesterday:

While driving back home from work yesterday i got held up on a traffic light on a exit ramp that usually takes its time. On the corner stood a homeless person holding a piece of cartboard asking for money for food... so i reached in my glove box and pulled some money and called him over... gave him the money and told him to stay warm for it was really cold that day. As soon as I donated... other people started calling him over and donating money to him. Nothing special right.... but the wierd thing was... we were standing on the light for a good minute n a half before I first called him over. Nobody even made an attempt to call him and donate before me (and i m not trying to make myslef look good, just citing my story)... it was like a chain reaction of empathy that took place.
I swear I was really touched by what happened and just goes to show that there really is hope for as long as we follow our heart.

queenannie.. you go my man.... i really appreciate the wisdom in your posts.
Thanks and love all

YAY some one else has realised that religeon is a con.
There is only another 99.99999% of people on the planet to realise this then there will be no wars, YAY peace on earth.

Originally posted by SKUNK
YAY some one else has realised that religeon is a con.
There is only another 99.99999% of people on the planet to realise this then there will be no wars, YAY peace on earth.

Without a belief in god many people will act according to thier base human animal instincts

NO heaven, No hell then what do you need to be good for ?

In the animal kingdom it's survival of the fittist, smartest so why show mercy, charity or love to someone you don't know ?

The above = mare wars = no peace on earth and pehapes an even quiker armaggedon.

Originally posted by reaper2
Without a belief in god many people will act according to thier base human animal instincts

NO heaven, No hell then what do you need to be good for ?

In the animal kingdom it's survival of the fittist, smartest so why show mercy, charity or love to someone you don't know ?

The above = mare wars = no peace on earth and pehapes an even quiker armaggedon.

Therein is the heart of the conspiracy, and a lot could be said concerning it.

But suffice it to say, you are right.
We humans kill each other way to easily with religion...God help us if (with the current level of maturity) there was no belief...people would kill each other at site.

Sad, but very true. People havent grown up.

Peace

dAlen

thats very clever I believe that theory may be correct. seriously people could have started cults and gotten many peoplet to believe that there the son, father, mom, pet, roommate,ect. of some divine being and then received enormous power from the followers but I guess I fell victum to this because I am religous

urThe dead sea scrolls are an eye witness account of a miracle man named Jeshua.The scrolls have been proven to be around the times of Herod.These scrolls have not been touched by the romans, the jewish believers or the early church.they were untouched for 1,940 years when the people of Masada put them in a cave.so there is proof that a man named Jesus (JESHUA) lived in that time. I just laugh at all you Christian bashers who look stupid when you get your info from people like Dan Brown or the ACLU. Leonardo Da Venci's (not sure of spelling) painting of The Last Supper was wrong in about every way.For people who think he had inside knowledge of a marriage between Jesus and Mary, he sure got a lot of Jewish customs wrong. As a Jewish believer myself, i know he got some things wrong. like, 1. sitting at the table with shoes, a big no-no at the time. 2. Jesus sitting in the middle of the table, instead of at the begining, like a master of ceremonies would have. 3. the table being straight instead of a U shaped table. 4. they would not be sitting on chairs, they would be sitting on the floor with legs crossed or leaning on their sides on some pillows. As for Easter and Christmas being pagan, i think we have the Catholic church to thank for that. some of the early Christians were Romans, they wanted to believe in Jesus,but wanted to worship their pagan gods too.God knows my heart,so when i celebrate Easter or Christmas,he knows my true intentions. I surely wish that you athiest would attack Darwin instead of GOD for a failed religion you call Evolution.I can prove to me, in my heart that GOD exist. but you can't prove to yourself that Evolution is real. i can ask you a some simple questions that you,Darwin or the bigshot ACLU lawyers from the famous Scoope's trial couldn't even answer.For all of you believers on this web-site go to www.creationevidence.com or www.answersingenisis.com you will be stunned.and if you have Dish Network, go to the Angel Network Channel and watch The Creation Network program. IT IS AWESOME!I can't believe that evolution is still being forced onto our kids in school.I'm not saying that the bible should be taught,i would not want some non-believer to teach my child about GOD.Darwin said "we would be tripping over missing links,because there would be so many". Still no proof. Evolution is a theory, not a fact!

Originally posted by evolutionisahoax
I surely wish that you athiest would attack Darwin instead of GOD for a failed religion you call Evolution.I can prove to me, in my heart that GOD exist. but you can't prove to yourself that Evolution is real. i can ask you a some simple questions that you,Darwin or the bigshot ACLU lawyers from the famous Scoope's trial couldn't even answer.For all of you believers on this web-site go to www.creationevidence.com or www.answersingenisis.com you will be stunned.GOD.Darwin said "we would be tripping over missing links,because there would be so many". Still no proof. Evolution is a theory, not a fact!

ATS has a forum just for you. Origins & Creationsim, we could do with a bit of life in there....

Well, according to Christian, Islamic etc fundamentalists most of humanity is in or is heading to hell.

But it isn't religion that's beheading people, destroying buildings, oppresing women etc. It's the fanatics, extremists, funadmentalists that are doing so. The psychotic obssesives that pervert the words of the Bible, Koran etc to their own ends. And what about the good ideas that most religions promote such as peace and charity?

Personally I think that those that use religion as an excuse for raping, killing etc are only hiding their own sociopathic tendencies.

Why is it usually assumed that all religions are the same?

Not all religions claim that humans are the sole occupiers of the universe.
Not all religions harbour secrets. Some religions embrace science. Not all religions teach salvation.

How many threads can we possibly start with the same old tired assumptions? How long should we beat this dead horse?

You are certainly entitled to your opinions on religion, but don't we already have a great number of active threads about this? Is it really denying ignorance to lump all religions into the same heap?

Originally posted by Chaoticar
Well, according to Christian, Islamic etc fundamentalists most of humanity is in or is heading to hell.

Some people's faith seems to be based upon idealisms that resemble:

"it is fun to dam men and add (+) them all to their lists"

fun dam men add (+) al lists.

fun dam men + al lists = fundamen+alists

Fundamentalists

Just som random thoughts....



[edit on 23-1-2007 by Esoteric Teacher]

Mankind is touched entirely too much by the need for self deception or deception of others. We all seek to fabricate a reality built upon our own experiences, the place which we call home in our existence.

Brother against brother spits fire at each other. The one claims that his relationship with god is the culprit, always acting in a certain way to please god... while the other disdains such favor in the eyes of the divine. Rebuking his maker, he lashes out at his brother... knowing his anger comes only from the self, he turns away from his maker. It then becomes the brothers fault, for being so self righteous or for angering the other so much.

Cain and Abel is a fine example of Atheism and Religion. Only, in the modern sense, Religion also points a bony finger and screams its rhetoric at the top of its lungs...

But this is all false. A stone cannot move itself to kill, nor can a pail fill itself at will. They are but things, made to mean and use as they are. Religion and Atheism are the same wholly and completely; they are things, to use as they are.

Some supplant their own wills and responsibilities for the sake of their beliefs. Atheists and Religious people alike.

Do you blame religion for the horrors and sadness in the world? You would be wrong... it is altogether the fault of human kind.

Do you blame Atheism for being shortsighted, claiming that if everyone stopped believing we would all be animals? You would be wrong... for mankind holds responsibility over itself.

Man chooses what he is responsible for, and what he will abdicate to the veil of lies. It is far easier to trick yourself into accepting ideas that allow you less responsibility and weight on your shoulders than to accept ones actions as self motivated and self interested.

What must be asked is what is religion and atheism being used to cover up in a persons heart? Why do religious people behave as they do, for it is not their religion. It is their choices to behave as they do, and religion has no responsibility as it is an inanimate thing.

Likewise, it must be asked why atheists behave as they do towards religious people. It isn't the religion that is the reason, in the end it is because the atheists wish to treat others in such a fashion.

We make our choices, and every choice is our responsibility. Whether a mistake or a blessing, nothing at all can be blamed other than yourself for how you act or behave.

As a religious person, I must emphatically state that God wishes for all souls to take responsibility for themselves.

As a scientist, I feel that mankind's evolution demands quite heavily that we become more than mere animals... and that we act with self awareness and cast off the lies we hide behind to excuse our treatment of our brothers and sisters.

Very well said. We should have gotten rid of that curse the first time we were thinking naturalistically, it is old and out dated, and while it does a little good, the most of it is evil.

Religion (Mostly the most biggest mainstream Religions) has turned God into a burden rather then a blessing. Having you look externally to the heavens for some man in the sky with a rod, rather then looking inward for that universal truth inside all man. It has taken God out of man and put it into a church, temple etc...

man made religion is a farce that truly does not teach, nor reach for that matter, much of anything to the many who question and seek answers.....it's a potpourri of beliefs that when examined are more the same than different, yet we war over the differences which keeps learning or teaching, near the bottom of most churches priorities, or actions.