Otto von Bismarck about Russia and Ukraine

Hello ATS!

“Iron Chancellor” Otto von Bismarck ruled Germany at a time when almost every leader of the country was a historical figure, smart, decisive, and firmly defending the interests of his country. Unfortunately, there are no such leaders in the West now. There is only a gray mass of clowns and puppets who voice the agenda sent to them by the structures of Soros and Schwab.

Bismarck understood Russia well. He didn't love her, but he respected her. Otto von Bismarck understood perfectly well that Europe would never be able to directly destroy Russia. And he bequeathed to his descendants to abandon attempts at open war with Russia. “Russia is dangerous because of the meagerness of its needs,” he said. “Never touch the Russians.” Therefore, his warnings are especially relevant now.

So, Otto von Bismarck wrote:

“Even the most successful outcome of the war will never lead to the collapse of Russia, which rests on millions of Russian believers of the Greek confession.
These latter, even if they are separated as a result of international treaties, will reconnect with each other as quickly as separated droplets of mercury find their way to each other.”

“Don’t expect that once you take advantage of Russia’s weakness, you will receive dividends forever. The Russians always come for their money. And when they come, don’t rely on the Jesuit agreements you signed that supposedly exonerate you. They are not worth the paper they are written on. Therefore, you should either play fairly with the Russians, or not play at all."

“The Russians cannot be defeated, this indestructible state of the Russian nation is strong with its climate, its spaces and its unpretentiousness, as well as their awareness of the need to constantly protect their borders.”

The only way to weaken Russia, according to Bismarck, is to divide the people, to set one part of it against another. For this purpose, waves of Ukrainization have been going on for more than a hundred years. Even before 1917 - on the territory of Austrian-occupied Galicia. The next wave is the Nazi occupation in 1941-1943. Then - Khrushchev’s ingratiation to Ukraine, the transfer of Crimea, the release of nationalists from prison. And here it is 1991. Is the goal almost achieved? Ukrainization has flourished in full bloom and is actively financed by Western funds, hiding behind the “struggle for democracy.”

“The power of Russia can only be undermined by the separation of Ukraine from it... it is necessary not only to tear off, but also to contrast Ukraine with Russia. To do this, you just need to find and raise traitors among the elite and with their help change the self-awareness of one part of the great people to such an extent that he will hate everything Russian, hate his family, without realizing it.
Everything else is a matter of time."

This is exactly what happens.

Thank you.

a reply to: RussianTroll

Yada yada yada.

I don't think Otto von Bismarck knew much about this century.

As to what happens.

That would be Putin's piss-poor invasion farce being held in place by a bunch of farmers with NATO toys for over 2 years now.

And as always freedom to Ukraine and down with the Russian invaders.

a reply to: RussianTroll

I agree there has always been that leave Russia alone as no one in history has ever captured it.
However saying just the west are puppets I don’t agree with.
All leaders are puppets to the powers at the top and each one has their role to play. That’s why we need to stop the , my country is better and be better people to one another no matter the place of birth

a reply to: G1111B1234

That’s why we need to stop the , my country is better and be better people to one another no matter the place of birth

In a perfect world G1111B1234 you would be completely correct, and not that i don't share the same sentiment.

But in this one, it is probably best not to hold one's breath waiting for that to happen.

Russia needs to leave Ukraine alone because they do not want them there.

Hence the reason Putin's "special military operation" aka all-out land grab in an attempt to return the Russian Federation to something reminiscent of the former USSR failed on day 3.

originally posted by: RussianTroll
The only way to weaken Russia, according to Bismarck, is to divide the people, to set one part of it against another.

Felix Kersten was told by two different guys who were familiar with Russia, "Russia can only be conquered by the Russians themselves, not by people from beyond her frontiers." And: "Russia can never be overcome by a foreign power, for Russians can only be conquered by Russians."

Incidentally, this is the advice Hitler kept turning down because he believed Bismarck didn't intend for his policy to last for all time. And because he was unwilling to compromise his principles and set aside his ideology for the sake of peace.

Walter Schellenberg, Quisling (who knew Russian mentality better than both Goebbels and Himmler), and others who were familiar with Russia warned Hitler not to subjugate Russians, but advised promoting Slavic nationalisms and playing them off against each other, which turned out to be the correct strategy as Stalin demonstrated.

Stalin was "systematically promoting the national consciousness of its ethnic minorities and establishing for them many institutional forms typical for nation-states." (source: communist historian Domenico Losurdo)

originally posted by: RussianTroll
For this purpose, waves of Ukrainization have been going on for more than a hundred years... Is the goal almost achieved? Ukrainization has flourished in full bloom and is actively financed by Western funds, hiding behind the “struggle for democracy.”

This is objectively correct, although it's missing an important piece of the puzzle: the pilot Hans Baur claimed that Hitler had sent away a delegation of Carpathian Ukrainians when they pleaded with him to incorporate their country into his Reich.

Not even Hitler wanted to associate with extremists like Bandera. Also, he had obligations to Hungary at that time. It's certain that Hitler had always intended to attack Soviet Russia, contrary to Baur's naive belief.

a reply to: RussianTroll

I see you're posting out right lies again RT. This was pure Russian propaganda created in and by Russians.
This myth checker was created with the help of the 'Bismark foundation'....
mythdetector.ge...

The quote by Otto von Bismarck, published by Iveri Merkviladze and Viktor Ermolaev, is fabricated. In fact, there is no official source confirming that the German Reich Chancellor expressed an opinion of identical or similar content. The fabricated quote has been circulating in Russian and Georgian Kremlin sources since 2013.

In 2014, the German Deutsche Welle contacted the German Bismarck Foundation to verify the aforementioned quote. According to Ulf Morgenstern, a researcher and scientist at the foundation, Bismarck never said such a thing. According to the scholar, there is no evidence to support a similar view expressed by the Chancellor, as comments on this content are not sought in the recordings of his speeches, letters or memoirs. Moreover, according to Morgenstern, Bismarck’s memoirs mention the prediction of one of the German publications on the “division of Russia”, which Bismarck did not agree with.

So if you didn't want Russia to be weakened you shouldn't have supported the war against Ukraine. Now you have to lie in the bed you made.

a reply to: RussianTroll

You won't respond to me because you know what I've posted is correct, even the German Bismarck Foundation calls it out right lies. You do the same in any thread when you're proven wrong. You stop responding to the person and claim bulling.

Posting out right lies to push an agenda is weak.

originally posted by: G1111B1234
I agree there has always been that leave Russia alone as no one in history has ever captured it.

This message was recently conveyed to me:

Europe still hasn't understood, just leave the Russians alone and they'll just live peacefully not bothering anyone. But no... the idiocy of the last 300 years by Europe has taught them nothing. All with hope that U.S would assist them against Russia if it comes to it. Meanwhile Trump said "if it comes to it you are on your own".

originally posted by: G1111B1234
All leaders are puppets to the powers at the top and each one has their role to play.

This is true, insofar as they are ordinary bourgeois politicians lacking ambition. Others, like Putin, although they still confine themselves to what is realizable, also have ways and means to convey how they really think through proxies. It turns out that Prigozhin had been saying whatever Putin was unable to say out loud.

originally posted by: G1111B1234
That’s why we need to stop the , my country is better and be better people to one another no matter the place of birth

This is an attainable prospect, eliminating nationalism is possible by eliminating feelings of fear and suspicion.

Jacque Fresco said, "We are all victims of culture. All people are brought up by cultures and every culture says 'You live in the greatest country in the world', 'I'm American and proud of it', 'I'm Canadian and I'm proud. All these mythological structures is what gets us into trouble; the artificiality of our values that get us into trouble."

The founder of Illuminati, Weishaupt, once wrote, “All moral infirmities come from underestimating or overestimating one's own worth.”
_____

a reply to: andy06shake

With people like you, it certainly cannot be done!

But as a matter of fact this is an orderly universe, where even suns and planets obey unshakeable laws, man is the only creature who lives outside of its rhythm. SInce human societies feel artificial, he projects this artificiality onto the universe.

Elder Anthony the Russian wrote:

To make it easier for you to understand the following, let me begin by saying a few words about the creation of the Universe. The Lord created all living things in line with a very specific system, where the actions of even the minutest fragment of the Universe impact the life of the entire Universe.
Actions of the unreasonable beasts cannot cause harm to the Universe. They are limited by their instincts and self-regulating attributes of Nature itself in the manner of brakes. But with Man... not only actions, but the very thoughts of Man impact the surrounding medium, the environment, all the Universe.

a reply to: GogolJoker

Europe doesn’t understand because it’s part of the plan. They’re all friends in this.
Religion I’m sorry is another divide and one can argue that their religion is better etc .
There are laws to this universe and we don’t understand hardly any of them because of religions and stupids wars that don’t need to be fought.

Ah yes, Otto von Bismarck. The callous, manipulative diplomatic thug who launched a war against a weak neighbouring country (Denmark) in order to seize a couple of provinces. I can understand why Putin might hero-worship him.

a reply to: DISRAELI2

The hatred of the British towards Bismarck is clear to everyone, for the reason lies on the surface.

Did Putin personally tell you that he worships Bismarck?

originally posted by: RussianTroll
a reply to: DISRAELI2

The hatred of the British towards Bismarck is clear to everyone, for the reason lies on the surface.

Did Putin personally tell you that he worships Bismarck?

Well seeing as you can't seem to quote Bismark and would rather post Russian made up quotes, us Brits' are OK then...

a reply to: GogolJoker

With people like you, it certainly cannot be done!

Yeah, that's not a slippery slope whatsoever.

Not quite sure what celestial mechanics or your claim man lives outside of nature's natural rhythm has to do with the thread.

Man is a product of evolution, and we live in the realm of nature, where we are constantly surrounded by it and interact with it every day, so there is that.

a reply to: DISRAELI2

The man bearing your namesake would've disapproved of your judgment.

"For Disraeli, as for Bismarck, international politics was about power; appeals to morality were sentimental hot air."

"Whatever effect Gladstone’s impassioned appeal had produced seemed to be dissipated by the spectacle of the Russian armies bearing down on Constantinople, and the threat to what was then supposed to be a British vital interest. Moral consciousness does not thrive in war fever:"

The fact is, Bismarck was a prudent, far-sighted leader, who in his ruthlessness, waged quickly decisive, humane wars. Above all, he knew when to stop, unlike Hitler. Bismarck had secured his aims of unifying Germany and turned his attention towards administrating peace. "Diplomatic thug" doesn't suit him, is an oxymoron, and it'd be better to say one is unfit as a diplomat rather than discrediting a worthy vocation.

It was thanks to Bismarck's influence* that Stalin took up diplomacy, came to terms with FDR, and momentarily abandoned his criminal ways. And so the WW2 victory was achieved with Bismarck's help.

* "Among the books Stalin borrowed and failed to return to the Lenin Library was a Russian edition of the memoirs of Otto von Bismarck... Appealing to Stalin would have been Bismarck’s political realism, pragmatism and tactical flexibility." (source: Stalin's Library by Geoffrey Roberts)

"In this respect, too, Stalin acted in perfect accord with what had been once tsarist diplomacy. He established diplomatic relations with Yugoslavia in June 1940, assuring his support to the Serbian monarchy; in October and November he offered his support to the tsar of Bulgaria." (conservative historian John Lukacs)

a reply to: GogolJoker

Europe still hasn't understood, just leave the Russians alone and they'll just live peacefully not bothering anyone.

Except for any country that boarders Russia, Putin will just invade those ones.

a reply to: GogolJoker

Stalin's decisions in diplomacy were driven by his own political motivations and interests rather than any direct influence from historical figures like Bismarck.

And the Man's leadership was characterised by authoritarianism, repression, and the consolidation of power within the Soviet Union.

Rather than any abandonment of "criminal ways" as suggested in your statement.

a reply to: andy06shake

I agree , Russia should leave , and lead by example of how to treat others. Every leaders should as well but as you say sadly it’s not a perfect world.
I just hope in time people might start seeing that continuing down the same path each time hasn’t solved anything , only made things worse.
People need to let go of the past if they’re to move forward .

[accidental bump]

originally posted by: G1111B1234
a reply to: andy06shake


People need to let go of the past if they’re to move forward .

People and nations that do not know and do not want to know their past have no future.