On Anarchy and the Establishment of Order - Establishing our Freedom in a World Gone Mad..

Greetings ATS,

I don't know about you, but I get the sense that the majority of ATS members are in a manner of speaking essentially LIBERTARIAN in their political thinking, and I concur broadly with the same in terms of my own politics.

One thing that I have learned, is that the philosophical dream of an idealised society would be purely anarchic in nature, a cooperative of mutual benefit through collective efforts & individual striving, between equal parties who are free from the burden of heavy taxation - collaborators who are able to perceive the public good & then to arrange a means of working towards that without impinging on personal liberty, rather than living in the condition of being ruled by oppressive State architecture & bureaucracy.

This is the ideal; however, I do not believe it is workable, except in small societies in which all are capable, strong men & women, able to strive individually & collectively as & when the circumstances call for it - for example building a public sewage disposal system, or with the establishment of a militia for mutual self-defence. The main problem we face in terms of striving towards an anarchic philosophical ideal, is that there are naturally a range of levels of intellect & capacity for goal driven activity - there's a bell curve distribution of capability in these areas, and unfortunately, some people would end up being incapable of truly striving individually, whether that comes from physical disability, poor mental health, or simple lack of intellect through natural causes. We would need to partly carry some members of society, and we would need permanent facilities for covering all bases - dotting the i's & crossing the t's.

I have come to believe that in order to create a just, tolerant & faithful society, we would need a libertarian outlook generally, which would be taught in schools & cooperative fellowship groups - and essentially, the main functions of establishing order & civility in the society would need a MINARCHIST approach to government - essential services such as defence, policing & public infrastructure would be run by a volunteer-led governing body which accepted a low single rate of taxation - with formalised appeals for individual donations when raising funds for public works. Welfare support would be operated by cooperatives which act as a form of insurance, again with a low standard rate for membership to assure participation when able to work & keep oneself prepared for the worst eventuality by membership of the mutual fund for welfare support, being provided to members who had participated for as long as they were capable of working. Should the worst happen, some injury or disease, then regular stipends would afford dignity to those unable to participate actively in society through no fault of their own, preventing poverty, ensuring that basic needs & simple comforts were provided, with support to retrain if possible for a less active role in society, yet still finding some way of helping out even though not capable of working in a full time, active role.

I'm aware that many true anarchists (such as James Corbett of the Corbett Report believe that a minarchist government is a copout - but I just don't see how order & public works could be actively maintained on a continuing basis without some minimal formal state architecture, at a very low (the lowest possible) scale of operations. I know that technically everything can be arranged by truly voluntary participation, true anarchic principles - but my feeling (which is also a Biblical perspective) is that there are simply too many 'bad people' in society to permit for the good folks to live out their simple, quiet lives without being harrassed - robbed, beaten, murdered, raped - by the bad seeds. Order must be maintained, and the public good must have permanent advocates sitting on a council of concerned - VOLUNTARY - leaders. There should be a rule which prevents active trading when in a council seat - a stipend would be paid, but trade would not be allowed until one has served their four year term. They then have the benefit of great experience to go on as private citizens & earn their wealth by drawing on that experience & the insight they gained when volunteering.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks,



FITO.

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment


You've more or less described the way the United States of America was intended to be structured and ran as the founding fathers envisioned it.
Government is a necessary evil and as such should exist only in absolutely the most neutered possible form and excessively heavy checks and balances in place. The purpose of government is to protect and bolster the rights of the people, as well as represent the people, and ANY action which goes against those ends should result in automatic expulsion from office any person involved with a lifelong ban on ever holding public office again. In addition to that, any public officer who commits an act in knowing and blatant violation of the constitution should be put to death publicly. Any attempt to deprive a citizen of their rights or freedom without due process should result in immediate public execution.
Order is best maintained by the people themselves, and it is best done by those people being extremely heavily armed.

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

Anarchy is wonderful in theory but it quickly devolves into survival of the fittest and I'd rather not be subject to a violent and stronger adversary abusing me for resources or labor.

We kind of already have civilized anarchy with the dominants overseeing the operation but there are always people who abuse their power and act in their own interests even if it violates the rules of written contract and code.

Law enforcement is a prime example.

Zero flags! It's a conspiracy...

originally posted by: FlyInTheOintment
Zero flags! It's a conspiracy...

Star and flag from me.

Not enough posts yet on my new handle or I would give ya one. (a flag)

Well written post and a discourse that is needed if we're going start to envisage a new societal structure.

I read 20 odd years ago - I think was 'Future Shock' by Alvin Toestler IIRC.

He described society fragmenting and chaos ensuing before it regrouped into like minded communities.

We see people of all different Faiths and Cultures living side by side without conflict.

People are generally good and caring - MSM and Big Gov cause all the friction.

We don't need governance from central location assuming were all the same. We need local governance particular
to the Culture / faith it governs. Globalization is not for the people.

Flag coming soon...

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

Still failing
a reply to: McTech2

a reply to: McTech2

Agreed - decentralised, local, direct democracy.

I'm firmly of the opinion that Biblical precedents laid down in the Old Testament provide the best model for justice within the community - no usury on loans, jubilee debt forgiveness & inheritance return, and a system of judges in conjunction with local councils in control of the affairs of the people, rather than a monarchical/presidential system. Decentralised, direct democracy. Local rule; intimate community governance, voluntary participation in politics with restrictions on financial trading when in office. Rotation of council members to prevent lifetime unelected regimes.

a reply to: FlyInTheOintment

Old Testament direct democracy. Not quite!

No monarchy = before King Saul. Puts us in the Moses to Samuel time period.

A time when first Moses made all the rules. People died massively when rebelling: Ground opening up and swallowing people, plagues, fire roaring out of tent to consume. Everyone told to pull their swords and kill whoever they could reach.

Joshua and Judges then wherein anarchy prevailed except when messianic characters like warlords rose one after another.

No peace. No security.

Spain '36-'39. The communists and the fascists stopped fighting each other and joined team to crush them. When those who need control so much, feel threatened enough to team up? The @'s must have been doing something right. A lot of things right actually. Gaston Leval wrote a pretty comprehensive book about the Spanish Revolution. Some stuff was pretty remarkable.

Syndicate, organize, and collaborate. Then granting Amnesty is the only key I can think of. We are smarter than we think, look, and behave..... maybe.