Who Has a Soul Around You

Billy Milligan comes to mind. Disincarnate souls finding a home in a new vessel all vying for control. Perhaps before birth perhaps after. Maybe not even real souls but different entities all together pretending to be human attaching to a real soul in hopes of material existence.

Quite a cool topic.

a reply to: olaru12

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: VulcanWerks

My personal journey on this front began a few years ago. It’s a journey that never ends. However, I’ve learned a number of things that your “average person” may not even entertain: - we live in a conscious-driven universe. - sentient life, in one form or fashion, shares this consciousness. - “humanity” is different than being physically human. - Your “gut feeling”, when that feeling gives a high conviction, is a connection to your consciousness. - One must work to master their fight or flight mechanism, emotional reactions, and objectively view themselves and humanity.

I love this and share this belief, especially the “humanity is different than being physically human” part!
I also believe that journey changes at different parts of your life.
Maybe as you get older, get quieter, the understanding/journey becomes almost complete.

The other thing I’ve pondered, is what if people that are closest to understand what you’ve described (and more)
Are “finished” with their earth lesson and that is why people die at different times…

Cheers, Jag!

I’ve considered that last component, too.

Personally, I don’t think that’s the case. I think part of the point of life is learning these lessons, and the other part is imparting those lessons on others.

Then again, I’m of the mind that you never “die”. Rather, your organic body does. The part that is “you” doesn’t. We are pure energy - just like everything else. If people knew that, we’d look at war/humanity/what constitutes humanity/etc. very differently - your organic body/thinking brain does not naturally understand it’s inhabited by “you”. Going a step further, “you”, including memory, is imprinted on the heart - not just the mind. It’s all energy, but, i digress…

Personality is a whole other thing, but we could start a completely different thread in that! 😎

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: Peeple

...
The Bible says only so many will go to heaven… Maybe it’s because there are only so many real souls?

In the Bible, “soul” is translated from the Hebrew neʹphesh and the Greek psy·kheʹ. Bible usage shows the soul to be a person or an animal or the life that a person or an animal enjoys. To many persons, however, “soul” means the immaterial or spirit part of a human being that survives the death of the physical body. Others understand it to be the principle of life. But these latter views are not Bible teachings.

The connotations that the English “soul” commonly carries in the minds of most persons are not in agreement with the meaning of the Hebrew and Greek words as used by the inspired Bible writers. This fact has steadily gained wider acknowledgment. Back in 1897, in the Journal of Biblical Literature (Vol. XVI, p. 30), Professor C. A. Briggs, as a result of detailed analysis of the use of neʹphesh, observed: “Soul in English usage at the present time conveys usually a very different meaning from נפש [neʹphesh] in Hebrew, and it is easy for the incautious reader to misinterpret.”

More recently, when The Jewish Publication Society of America issued a new translation of the Torah, or first five books of the Bible, the editor-in-chief, H. M. Orlinsky of Hebrew Union College, stated that the word “soul” had been virtually eliminated from this translation because, “the Hebrew word in question here is ‘Nefesh.’” He added: “Other translators have interpreted it to mean ‘soul,’ which is completely inaccurate. The Bible does not say we have a soul. ‘Nefesh’ is the person himself, his need for food, the very blood in his veins, his being.”​—The New York Times, October 12, 1962.

What is the origin of the teaching that the human soul is invisible and immortal?

The difficulty lies in the fact that the meanings popularly attached to the English word “soul” stem primarily, not from the Hebrew or Christian Greek Scriptures, but from ancient Greek philosophy, actually pagan religious thought. Greek philosopher Plato, for example, quotes Socrates as saying: “The soul, . . . if it departs pure, dragging with it nothing of the body, . . . goes away into that which is like itself, into the invisible, divine, immortal, and wise, and when it arrives there it is happy, freed from error and folly and fear . . . and all the other human ills, and . . . lives in truth through all after time with the gods.”​—Phaedo, 80, D, E; 81, A.

In direct contrast with the Greek teaching of the psy·kheʹ (soul) as being immaterial, intangible, invisible, and immortal, the Scriptures show that both psy·kheʹ and neʹphesh, as used with reference to earthly creatures, refer to that which is material, tangible, visible, and mortal.

The Roman Catholic translation, The New American Bible, in its “Glossary of Biblical Theology Terms” (pp. 27, 28), says: “In the New Testament, to ‘save one’s soul’ (Mk 8:35) does not mean to save some ‘spiritual’ part of man, as opposed to his ‘body’ (in the Platonic sense) but the whole person with emphasis on the fact that the person is living, desiring, loving and willing, etc., in addition to being concrete and physical.”​—Edition published by P. J. Kenedy & Sons, New York, 1970.

To deem another as being soulless one must first understand what a soul is. Then it becomes obvious that thinking of some living people as being without a soul makes no sense, cause we do not have souls, we are souls.

Neʹphesh evidently comes from a root meaning “breathe” and in a literal sense neʹphesh could be rendered as “a breather.” Koehler and Baumgartner’s Lexicon in Veteris Testamenti Libros (Leiden, 1958, p. 627) defines it as: “the breathing substance, making man a[nd] animal living beings Gn 1, 20, the soul (strictly distinct from the greek notion of soul) the seat of which is the blood Gn 9, 4f Lv 17, 11 Dt 12, 23: (249 X) . . . soul = living being, individual, person.”

Since the term neʹphesh refers to the creature itself, we should expect to find the normal physical functions or characteristics of fleshly creatures attributed to it. This is exactly the case. Neʹphesh (soul) is spoken of as eating flesh, fat, blood, or similar material things (Le 7:18, 20, 25, 27; 17:10, 12, 15; De 23:24); being hungry for or craving food and drink (De 12:15, 20, 21; Ps 107:9; Pr 19:15; 27:7; Isa 29:8; 32:6; Mic 7:1); being made fat (Pr 11:25); fasting (Ps 35:13); touching unclean things, such as a dead body (Le 5:2; 7:21; 17:15; 22:6; Nu 19:13); being ‘seized as a pledge’ or being ‘kidnapped’ (De 24:6, 7); doing work (Le 23:30); being refreshed by cold water when tired (Pr 25:25); being purchased (Le 22:11; Eze 27:13); being given as a vow offering (Le 27:2); being put in irons (Ps 105:18); being sleepless (Ps 119:28); and struggling for breath (Jer 15:9).

It may be noted that in many texts reference is made to “my soul,” “his [or her] soul,” “your soul,” and so forth. This is because neʹphesh and psy·kheʹ can mean one’s own self as a soul. The sense of the term can therefore often be expressed in English by use of personal pronouns. Thus Lexicon in Veteris Testamenti Libros (p. 627) shows that “my neʹphesh” means “I” (Ge 27:4, 25; Isa 1:14); “your [singular] neʹphesh” means “thou” or “you” (Ge 27:19, 31; Isa 43:4; 51:23); “his neʹphesh” means “he, himself” (Nu 30:2; Isa 53:10); “her neʹphesh” means “she, herself” (Nu 30:5-12), and so forth.

The Greek term psy·kheʹ is used similarly. Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (1981, Vol. 4, p. 54) says it may be used as “the equivalent of the personal pronoun, used for emphasis and effect:​—1st person, John 10:24 (‘us’); Heb. 10:38; cp. [compare] Gen. 12:13; Num. 23:10; Jud. 16:30; Ps. 120:2 (‘me’); 2nd person, 2 Cor. 12:15; Heb. 13:17,” and so forth.

One Myth Leads to Another

“LOOK out,” wrote the apostle Paul to Christians living in the latter half of the first century C.E. What was he warning against? “Perhaps there may be someone who will carry you off as his prey through the philosophy and empty deception according to the tradition of men.”​—Colossians 2:8.

Despite Paul’s warning, from the middle of the second century C.E., some Christians began using concepts borrowed from ancient philosophers in order to explain their beliefs. Why? They wanted to be accepted by the educated people of the Roman Empire and thus make more converts.

Justin Martyr, one of the most famous of these Christians, believed that God’s Spokesman had manifested himself to Greek philosophers long before the arrival of Jesus. According to Justin and like-minded teachers, the contribution of philosophy and mythology to Christianity made this form of religion truly universal.

Justin Martyr’s form of Christianity became very successful in gaining converts. However, the adoption of one myth led to the creation of others and produced what is now commonly believed to be Christian doctrine. To expose these myths, compare what the following reference works say with what the Bible actually teaches.

Myth 1: The Soul Is Immortal (One Myth Leads to Another)

originally posted by: olaru12

Who Has a Soul Around You

Do people with schizophrenia or multipersonality disorder have more than one soul or do they divide up the one they have into sections?

Ummm...the soul presented as sectional...but the body...divan...?

Couched in those terms...an intellect might tuffet out...and chair the seat of the soul...

Thus turning the table...?



YouSir

a reply to: VulcanWerks

I have a similar understanding. Yet I also believe that the universe is not a maze to escape. But in itself, a teacher, that allows us to experience all relative truths. A journey that only comes to an end when we start to see emptiness in all things. So even though our minds see's imperfections in hate, division, and tribalism. I suspect our other half see's all that as an expression of God. Seeing absolute perfection at work within all those imperfections. Thus I believe people should live life to the fullest until our better half rings the doorbell. Empowering our spirituality only when we are approaching the end of our journey.

originally posted by: Peeple
a reply to: VulcanWerks

I think trauma can also be seen as 'breaking down' a catalyst to 'break through', depends a little on what else is already there, personality is much more than 'learned' or copied behaviour.

I believe the same thing (faith?) about personality although I've got no way of articulating or proving what I think.

My mind keeps going back to the development of personality in a baby, it's why I asked earlier if personality is the soul. The science alludes to us being a 100% reactionary based entities, if that's the case the idea of a soul or even free will is just a myth and live as ideas of the mind.

Duality plays a strong role in the human mind when considering such things too. For some it's too simplistic to say it's all black and white when they can clearly see the scale of contrast within reality.

a reply to: dffrntkndfnml

Are we automated or do we have choice?

I suspect when someone takes pleasure in others suffering they're going through things many others do but have unique although predictable outcomes.

If stress induces emotions and emotions induce moods I'd say within that circle exists the potential for "good or bad" depending on the emotions and what we do with them. I'm thinking there's a scale based on internalising or expressing emotions.

Think 7 sins Vs 7 virtues for a black and white picture. An emotion like anger for instance is seen as bad wether we internalise or express it. The extremes of that scale is suicide or murder. I'd say the 'scales' can be applied to any emotion.

Understanding the human condition can be approached via many paths I reckon, they all build awareness. I like breaking things down, my emotional cycle idea is based on a simple concept of every action has a reaction, we're emotional machines that takes energy/stress in, reacts to it and then expresses.

Are we automated or do we have choice?

It's neither and both isn't it?
A scale based on awareness.

a reply to: RAY1990

I am having a difficult time wondering what part of my post you are referring to.

I believe that we feel sensory input, and that what we think about what we feel is the emotion. I believe in free will.

So for example if you experience touch, then what you think about that will determine if it is pain and pleasure or suffering for example. It's similar to the difference between sight and vision or hearing and listening or smell and taste.

I feel a bit reluctant to describe others as taking pleasure in others pain, because I believe that they can choose to change, learn and grow like anybody else, if that was you were referring to. They have a soul too in my opinion.

a reply to: RAY1990

Well we are in the area of belief, so I hope you don't mind taking my speculations as such:

...if personality is the soul. The science alludes to us being a 100% reactionary based entities, if that's the case the idea of a soul or even free will is just a myth and live as ideas of the mind.

I would say no. It's just really hard to use the 'free will', because a lot of the personality is based on what mixture of 'hardware' (genes and the part of learned stuff that fixes itself on those genes. There was a study somewhere I read that shows mice inherited the fear of their parents, on top of that I think the switches in our DNA is where the real magic happens) we got. And I think one could argue the type of reaction we have is largely based on that, but
Along with it comes something that enjoys more abstract approaches to view, interpret and influence our environment, that ponders concepts like these, life after death the possible future, the meaning of life, etc. which might one day just say: 'my instincts tell me to do xy but for a reason more spiritual than carnal I decide to do z instead'
Which is actually the soul speaking. Which is where free will takes place. Which is a much larger part of what made us so successful than our predator heritage, enabling us to do the craziest things: like altruism.
From a carnal standpoint insane and suicidal.
Spiritually the only thing that makes sense.

But that's all also by no means something that just is, instead it's a free decision one has to make at some point.
Some people just never realise they're not using their free will. But the soul is always there. It's the personality that is often fake and quite literally superficial, as in a very thin veil to cover the animal.
Which is the only duality that's important to us: soul vs animal

I think I know one person with a soul, but I dont know too many people. I think to have a soul, you need to acknowledge the existance of the soul, and its limitations; but I have forgotten more of the Kabbala than I probably ever knew.

a reply to: JAGStorm

my mother/grandmother etc where all Christian cunning folk (low magics) so I'm on the medieval transience side or memento mori side where there are 2 true points of equaility the first is in poverty the second is in death..

growing up i loved the poem Erthe oute of erthe or earth upon earth.. the last 3 stazas are in a medieval wall-painting in the Guild Chapel in Stratford-upon-Avon.

Alexander died, Alexander was buried, Alexander returneth into dust; the dust is earth; of earth we make loam; and why of that loam, whereto he was converted, might they not stop a beer-barrel?
Imperious Caesar, dead and turn'd to clay,
Might stop a hole to keep the wind away:
O, that that earth, which kept the world in awe,
Should patch a wall to expel the winter flaw!

In English earth has a few meanings the ground beneath our feet, the planet we live on and ourselves as humans, we are not of the earth but are the earth.. Mediaeval Baebes turned it into a wonderful song..



in that absolute equality we are all the planet and the planet is us so i can't see how anyone can be more or less than anyone else.

a reply to: JAGStorm

Follow one around that you think is soulless. Maybe they will change your mind, watch them sit down for a meal see what they like to eat, or watch them watch an animal with wonder.

I do that every now and then to keep these thoughts away, I think it’s unhealthy to think that people around me are soulless. They aren’t, they just don’t have anything in common sometimes.

a reply to: JAGStorm

Interesting thread JagStorm. My late mother took me to see a psychic woman around 40 years ago, and she said that I had a lot of spirits around me, protecting me. I assumed back then, it was probably grandparents that I had never met, since they passed before I was born.

Then my cousin told me that we are all one. I thought that was deep. So, I asked her “Do you mean that I am the only one that is real, and all of you are just here to entertain me? Poor You, everyone.

Still say the soul is just our electrical spark, and when the lights finally goes out, we all just revert back to our actual form…electricity.

a reply to: JAGStorm

You know, i was thinking just that. I work retail, mighty proud to say it. Teaches you horse sense and a keen eye. Any way, a little blank eyed roly poly cherub came up and wanted distilled water a half hour before closing. None on the shelves, its probably delivered and still sitting in the backroom waiting for the store to close so the pallet and others can be brought out and not take up floor space. So I got the guy working the dept. and we go back to look. The truck is there but not unloaded. All the way in the back we see a pallet of water cases. The guy jumps up and crawls all the way back and brings back three gallon jugs by hand and we take them out. There we're met by her Gampaw, a blank faced dead eyed old load with his wife that could be his sister. We gave him the three jugs and he said " I'll take four." I just said. "No, you'll take three. we are not crawling all the way back there over pallets in a truck again. There is infants distilled water in the infants dept. if you want more." and I walked away. Bad customer service? No, actually great customer service but Mr. dead eyes had no idea just what a pain he was. And he did have a blank soulless expression. They all did. They weren't evil, just clueless, obtuse, had no idea that interacting with people is a skillset.

a reply to: JAGStorm
NPC's are real, you encounter them everyday. With politicians, local law enforcement, military personnel, teachers, students potentially anyone who's consciousness does not come from beyond "this reality". How else do you explain Clown World 2023

Not sure sparkling eyes are an indicator of soul being present. Met too many people with sparkling eyes that could be described as 'dark souled', people who will swear lying oaths in church and encourage their children to do the same or people who easily and shamelessly self delude.

I've recently seen CT about how the controllers are looking for an easily ingested/injectable substance to kill what has been termed 'the god gene'. Personally, I wonder if this is already in play. Somebody mentioned floride and benzodiazipam. There is also crack. Never met an addict or an adult 'crack baby' that was not totally self-righteous and unconscienable.

People who have no concept of non material values, bread-heads, in my view lack soul.

As to those that enjoy inflicting pain, psychopathy reveals itself between ages 2 and 4. In the course of my work, I have encountered a number of such people (children and adolescents), male and female. All have dead eyes that only spark at the sight/sound of the suffering of others and who display delight only when involved in causing pain.

a reply to: teapot

As to those that enjoy inflicting pain, psychopathy reveals itself between ages 2 and 4. In the course of my work, I have encountered a number of such people (children and adolescents), male and female. All have dead eyes that only spark at the sight/sound of the suffering of others and who display delight only when involved in causing pain.

This child was 3-7 when I knew him...

A particular child I once knew. He was born into an upper middle class family.
Plenty of support, and no outward abuse that anyone would know of. Siblings were perfectly fine. A strong family unit.


That child ENJOYED hurting animals, ENJOYED collecting bones of dead animals. He once even tried to kill his sister at a very young age. His eyes were what I call soulless. Maybe some just called them disturbed.

We all have soul, but let me stop you there.

You got the concept of a soul wrong.
You probably think of the soul as a confined thing that has clear-cut borders that end where the body ends.

It's not like that. The soul is a much broader concept, and all soul originates from the same source, and span the whole world as a connected network of soul energy, and is most concentrated in bodies and trees and flowers and all living matter. But even what we perceive as dead matter have soul energy.

a reply to: JAGStorm

Your soul is the collection of your choices and experiences in this life. It becomes the adornment of your eternal spirit but stained with sin; It becomes your eternal hell with only oblivion to free you...striking you from the book of life...