Turkey's President Erdogan vows to launch ground invasion of northern Syria

So how we do feel when Turkey a NATO member starts invading Northern Syria to eliminate the Kurds? or is this bluster from Erdogan.

From what I understand the Kurds were extremely useful allies in Iraq, and to a lesser extent Afghanistan. Are we gonna start funding the Kurds? or are we gonna back Turkey? or more likely are we just gonna close our eyes and pretend this is totally acceptable? Hell Erogdan is gonna say can I get billions from my NATO partners to subdue these nasty Kurds?

The Kurds have helped the US and in 2014 when their capital of Erbil was close to being overrun Obama sent in warplanes for support.

President Obama pledged to defend the Kurdish capital or Erbil. Wonder if Biden is as dedicated to helping the Kurds. Or will Turkey be appeased another way?

Am I wrong? Thoughts ATS...

PS.

Apologies for all the links and quotes from articles, but they do illustrate where my initial thoughts are on this.

www.abc.net.au...

Turkey's President Erdogan vows to launch a ground invasion of northern Syria

Turkey's President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has vowed to order a land invasion of northern Syria targeting Kurdish groups, amid years-long border violence and repeated Turkish incursions.

Key points:
Turkey has launched air strikes on suspected militant targets in northern Syria and Iraq in recent days
The strikes are in retaliation for a November 13 bombing in Istanbul that Ankara blames on Kurdish groups
Turkey has carried out a series of incursions into Syria since 2016
Turkey has launched a barrage of air strikes on suspected militant targets in northern Syria and Iraq in recent days, in retaliation for a deadly November 13 bombing in Istanbul that Ankara blames on the Kurdish groups.

The groups have denied involvement in the bombing and say Turkish strikes have killed civilians and threatened the fight against the Islamic State group.

Ankara's allies, particularly Russia, have attempted to avert a ground incursion. However, Mr Erdogan said on Wednesday in a speech to his ruling party's legislators that the air operations were "just the beginning".

time.com...

For a few hours, the city of Erbil was in a state of panic. Word came that Gwar, just 30 minutes from the Kurdish capital, had been taken by the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS), and Kurds and ex-pats alike were packing up, trying to book airline tickets or, in a worse case scenario, preparing to drive to Turkey. But then American war planes swooped in and began bombing and President Obama pledged to defend Erbil.

Kurds breathed a sigh of relief. “The most important development was the decision by the United States to save lives,” says Hoshyar Zebari, a former Iraqi foreign minister and a prominent Kurd. “U.S. help is deeply appreciated.” Dr. Fuad Hussein, chief of staff to Kurdish President Masoud Barzani, welcomed the UN resolution condemning ISIS, and praised coalition forces for their technical and humanitarian assistance. He noted that the U.S. had co-ordinated tactical efforts with Peshmerga forces, allowing the Kurdish fighters to prepare to go on the offensive. “We used to say Kurds don’t have any friends but the mountains. But that doesn’t ring true anymore,” he said.

That said, many Kurds still carry lingering worries that the U.S. will betray them once again. “There’s a history of contact and betrayal with the U.S. and the Kurds where the U.S. made contact and helped but never jumped in with both feet,” says Quil Lawrence, author of The Invisible Nation: How the Kurds’ Quest for Statehood Is Shaping Iraq and the Middle East, and a correspondent with NPR. “The Kurds have been very frustrated with a lot of the stages long the way,” he says. “But certainly these airstrikes would restore some of that trust. I feel like I’ve had many Kurds quote Churchill to me in the past week: ‘Americans can always be counted on to do the right thing… after they have exhausted all other possibilities.’”

Finally, it seems, the U.S. has exhausted all other possibilities in Iraq and all that’s left is to rely upon the Kurds. It’s only taken a century.

Nearly a hundred years ago, the Kurdish rebel leader Sheikh Mahmoud Barzanji carried around in his pocket a copy of Woodrow Wilson’s 14 Points, so inspired was he by American self-determination. And yet it would be the Americans who would help deny the Kurds the same right at nearly every turn. Two years after Wilson delivered that speech, the Allies agreed to an independent Kurdistan in the 1920 Treaty of Sevres. But by 1923, in the Treaty of Lausanne that recognized Kemal Attaturk’s Turkey, the international community abandoned the Kurds and the referendum promised in the Treaty of Sevres was never realized. Thus began the Kurdish struggle for independence.

After several thwarted attempts to break away from Iraq, the Kurds finally got their first indirect aid from the U.S. in the early 1970s, more thanks to the Shah of Iran than anything else. In 1972, Iraq aligned with the Soviet Union and the Shah pushed the U.S. to arm the Kurds by selling them Soviet weapons seized in Egypt. By 1974, the Kurds were in open rebellion led by Mullah Mustafa Barzani, of the same tribe Barzanji was from. But by 1975, Iran and Iraq made peace under the Algiers Accords. Iranian support for the Kurdish uprising abruptly came to a halt and the rebellion collapsed.

Barzani fled to Iran and then America, where he died in 1979, the same year of the Iranian Revolution, where yet again U.S. allegiances shifted. And, yet, again, the Kurds were the unwitting victim.

Then there is this?

Turkish air strikes in Syria threatened safety of U.S. personnel -Pentagon

news.yahoo.com...

11
Phil Stewart and Idrees Ali
Wed, November 23, 2022 at 4:35 PM·2 min read
By Phil Stewart and Idrees Ali

WASHINGTON (Reuters) -Turkish air strikes in northern Syria threatened the safety of U.S. military personnel and the escalating situation jeopardized years of progress against Islamic State militants, the Pentagon said on Wednesday.

The public comments represent the strongest condemnation by the United States of NATO-ally Turkey's air operations in recent days against a Kurdish militia in northern Syria to date.

"Recent air strikes in Syria directly threatened the safety of U.S. personnel who are working in Syria with local partners to defeat ISIS and maintain custody of more than ten thousand ISIS detainees," the Pentagon's spokesman, Air Force Brigadier General Pat Ryder, said in a statement.

Ryder said the escalating situation threatened the progress made in the fight against Islamic State militants in the region.

He added that the United States recognizes Turkey's "legitimate security concerns."

"Immediate de-escalation is necessary in order to maintain focus on the defeat-ISIS mission and ensure the safety and security of personnel on the ground committed to the defeat-ISIS mission," Ryder added.

The United States has roughly 900 soldiers in Syria,

After seeing what happened to the Afghan withdrawal any country's leader relying on the US for help or support would be a fool.

a reply to: putnam6

To be brutally honest, I care not for the Kurds or Syria. The Kurds were only advantageous as a proxy against Iran, which I see dwindling in importance.

Have at it Turkey, as long as you maintain your NATO commitments.

a reply to: putnam6

Turkey...Thanksgiving...Coincidence?

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: putnam6

Turkey...Thanksgiving...Coincidence?

A true american. Anything happening beyond 500 miles is not happening at all. Happy turkey day.

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

To be brutally honest, I care not for the Kurds or Syria. The Kurds were only advantageous as a proxy against Iran, which I see dwindling in importance.

Have at it Turkey, as long as you maintain your NATO commitments.

Yea this sounds great I'm sure there are absolutely no innocents killed in the 25-plus million Kurds in the region. Also sounds like there are different levels of empathy for civilians depending on the country and ethnicity.

Those same Kurds helped immensely with ISIS did they not?

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

To be brutally honest, I care not for the Kurds or Syria. The Kurds were only advantageous as a proxy against Iran, which I see dwindling in importance.

Have at it Turkey, as long as you maintain your NATO commitments.

Yea this sounds great I'm sure there are absolutely no innocents killed in the 25-plus million Kurds in the region. Also sounds like there are different levels of empathy for civilians depending on the country and ethnicity.

I dont care. Protect NATO nations and their population.

originally posted by: Overseeall

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

To be brutally honest, I care not for the Kurds or Syria. The Kurds were only advantageous as a proxy against Iran, which I see dwindling in importance.

Have at it Turkey, as long as you maintain your NATO commitments.

Yea this sounds great I'm sure there are absolutely no innocents killed in the 25-plus million Kurds in the region. Also sounds like there are different levels of empathy for civilians depending on the country and ethnicity.

I dont care. Protect NATO nations and their population.

What about all the Kurds who died fighting ISIS, you know so we didn't have even more Americans die fighting ISIS?

Kurds Now Our Best Ally Against ISIS in Syria

www.washingtoninstitute.org...

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: Overseeall

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

To be brutally honest, I care not for the Kurds or Syria. The Kurds were only advantageous as a proxy against Iran, which I see dwindling in importance.

Have at it Turkey, as long as you maintain your NATO commitments.

Yea this sounds great I'm sure there are absolutely no innocents killed in the 25-plus million Kurds in the region. Also sounds like there are different levels of empathy for civilians depending on the country and ethnicity.

I dont care. Protect NATO nations and their population.

What about all the Kurds who died fighting ISIS, you know so we didn't have even more Americans die fighting ISIS?

I dont care. Protect NATO nations and their populations. Can I be more clear?

One week of engagement of the full force of the US military exceeds 100x lifetimes of the Kurds. Harsh, but true.

originally posted by: Overseeall

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: Overseeall

originally posted by: putnam6

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

To be brutally honest, I care not for the Kurds or Syria. The Kurds were only advantageous as a proxy against Iran, which I see dwindling in importance.

Have at it Turkey, as long as you maintain your NATO commitments.

Yea this sounds great I'm sure there are absolutely no innocents killed in the 25-plus million Kurds in the region. Also sounds like there are different levels of empathy for civilians depending on the country and ethnicity.

I dont care. Protect NATO nations and their population.

What about all the Kurds who died fighting ISIS, you know so we didn't have even more Americans die fighting ISIS?

I dont care. Protect NATO nations and their populations. Can I be more clear?
One week of engagement of the full force of the US military exceeds 100x lifetims of the Kurds. Harsh, but true.

ivn.us...

The Kurdish forces fielded by the YPG remain at the vanguard of the anti-ISIS fight in Syria, so providing them with GPS technology, faster airstrike coordination, and other assistance would greatly further U.S. interests.

www.inquisitr.com...

American soldiers who fought alongside the Kurds in America's Middle Eastern military endeavors are slamming Donald Trump's decision to withdraw troops from northern Syria, leaving the American allies open to aggression from Turkey.

Reuters interviewed eight current and former soldiers who have gone into battle with Kurdish allies at their side, and they are unanimous in their opinion of Donald Trump's decision to withdraw from Syria: It's a betrayal.

One such former soldier, 66-year-old former Army Special Forces soldier Greg Walker, describes an incident during which a Kurdish soldier risked his life to save Walker. The two men were passing through a checkpoint in Iraq when three Iraqi soldiers pulled their guns on them. Walker returned to his vehicle, but on hearing the sounds of weapons being readied, his Kurdish bodyguard Azaz turned around and confronted the three Iraqis. Azaz told the "terrified" Iraqis to let them through or he would kill them all.

"This is the kind of ally and friend I want," said Walker of Azaz.

Walker says he is "furious" at Trump's abrupt decision to remove the approximately 1,000 U.S. troops from Syria, leaving them exposed to aggression from the Turks.

Another former soldier, Mark Giaconia, spoke similarly of the Kurds' valiance.

"I trusted them with my life. I fought with these guys and watched them die for us," he said.

Further, he said that the decision to withdraw from Syria "feels like a violation of trust."

a reply to: putnam6

Are you deaf?

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

Are you deaf?

Are you high?

Is it common for you to hear text?

Is russia in the room with you now?

a reply to: putnam6

Erdogan looking at Ukraine and seeing Zelensky having $$$M thrown at him? Seeking major investment in Turkish war machine? Wants international input in his genocidal hatred of Kurds? Feeling his mortality and implied failure to establish his version of the Kalifat?

Whatever is going on with this development, Erdogan thinks it's all about him.

a reply to: putnam6

Doesn't Erdogan Need Permission to Invade a Sovereign Nation such as Syria who is Also a Member of the U.N. from NATO First ? Would not that be Considered an Act of War by Turkey if Permission was not Given ?

originally posted by: JinMI

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

Are you deaf?

Are you high?

Is it common for you to hear text?

Is russia in the room with you now?

Sorry, I don’t speak Russian.

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

Are you deaf?

Why do you sound as cocksure and unhinged as Zelensky a few days ago, I'm just discussing this I haven't attacked you or called you names.

Again just because I think we have sent enough to Ukraine doesn't mean I'm pro-Russian



So there is no ambiguity here I backed these 3 guys every time they went to war, and lost some friends too. I'm pro-America first and foremost still am. I just like to know if it's a legit reason, therefore when the fricking military says we don't need to send these drones I have a tendency to listen to them

originally posted by: Overseeall

originally posted by: JinMI

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

Are you deaf?

Are you high?

Is it common for you to hear text?

Is russia in the room with you now?

Sorry, I don’t speak Russian.

Nor do I type in cyrillic.

originally posted by: JinMI

originally posted by: Overseeall

originally posted by: JinMI

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

Are you deaf?

Are you high?

Is it common for you to hear text?

Is russia in the room with you now?

Sorry, I don’t speak Russian.

Nor do I type in cyrillic.

But you respond with Russian propaganda. Ironic. Not many true patriots defending you here lol.

1: the kurds are some of the best people in that sandy Spit hole, we have screwed them from the word go and they keep helping people.

2: he wont go after the kurds in syria because half his country will immediately catch fire, the kurds in iraq and iran will start taking holiday in turkey as well.

3: he is just continuing to use them as fodder like the nazi's used the jews to distract the other groups in turkey that hate his guts.

4: the kurds are so close to kurdistan, iraq pretty much lets them do their thing, as long as they help syria they also get to do their own thing, they will come from every direction and use every dirty trick to wreck his playground at this point.

originally posted by: Overseeall

originally posted by: JinMI

originally posted by: Overseeall

originally posted by: JinMI

originally posted by: Overseeall
a reply to: putnam6

Are you deaf?

Are you high?

Is it common for you to hear text?

Is russia in the room with you now?

Sorry, I don’t speak Russian.

Nor do I type in cyrillic.

But you respond with Russian propaganda. Ironic. Not many true patriots defending you here lol.

What's a true patriot....in your estimation?

At what point in my postings do I require defending?

What part of asking if you hear text is russian propaganda?