Trump says U.S. agency will begin removing millions of illegal immigrants

originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: carewemust

So you will be okay when they outlaw gun ownership right?
Jail everyone who wont comply.
To make the country safer you know????

PS this is sarcasm. I am not against gun ownership I am only trying to illustrate a point that the same view can go against something you think is necessary to your life.

Owning a gun is not breaking the law, illegally crossing the border is breaking the law.
Your comparison is not valid.

originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: carewemust

So you will be okay when they outlaw gun ownership right?
Jail everyone who wont comply.
To make the country safer you know????

PS this is sarcasm. I am not against gun ownership I am only trying to illustrate a point that the same view can go against something you think is necessary to your life.

Big strawman. When illegally immigrating into this country becomes a protected right under our Constitution, only THEN can you use that strawman. Until then, please refrain from these silly posts.

a reply to: UKTruth

Laws are created. Owning a gun could be a crime. Trump made owning a bump stock a crime for instance.

Coming illegally is dependent on the law. Was it asylum?

Its illegal to sell coc aine but that didnt stop the CIA from crashing a plane full of it in Mexico.

Problem is little more nuanced than most try and advocate

a reply to: luthier

The cartels are in Mexico, are you saying we should invade Mexico to try and handle them? That is up to the Mexican government to control, which they have told us they will. You should be thanking Trump.

a reply to: PurpleFox

The cartels are in both countries. El Chapo has American kids and so do many.

Do we invade Pakistan? I guess that is ok but a place killing Americans every day is not?
By the way Mexico obviously has no sovereignty in the drug lord areas...since they can not and do not control them at all.

a reply to: PurpleFox

He was talking about putting tariffs on Mexican imports as a punitive action for them not controlling migrants through their country to our border. How is that improving trade agreements?
He is a bully who thinks that's how he is going to get his way. Obviously he was put in his place by people who know better on that issue.

He made the border the biggest issue with his base in 2016 and here we are on the eve of a new election and he still has not dealt with the issue in any measurable way. He is losing his base and he is waving yet another carrot in front of their noses saying hey vote for me I will do this. A snazzy campaign slogan like "I'm gonna build a wall and get Mexico to pay for it" and even creating a chant to fortify the idea in peoples heads.
Lets see what kind of showmanship he can come up with this time to accomplish the same thing.
Like I said.... fool me once...

a reply to: tanstaafl

Just checking here.... You're not asking for congress to declare war on Mexico are you?

a reply to: Sillyolme

No, that was luthier suggesting we bomb Mexico.

TheRedneck

originally posted by: tanstaafl

originally posted by: luthier
It would be nice if someone would address the actual emergency in Mexico which is the cartels. The entire reason there are even refugees to begin with.

Trumps plan does next to nothing to combat the actual problem. Drugs and drug lords.

I agree. Trump can only do so much without Congress. Guess who is too busy crying about 'orange man bad' to even think about passing sensible immigration reform?

www.govtrack.us...

H.J.Res. 46: Relating to a national emergency declared by the President on February 15, 2019. Sponsor: Rep. Joaquin Castro [D-TX20] Introduced Feb 22, 2019 Vetoed & Override Failed in House Mar 26, 2019 Cosponsors 233 (232D,1R)

H.R. 1044: Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act of 2019 Sponsor: Rep. Zoe Lofgren [D-CA19] Introduced Feb 7, 2019 Cosponsors 306 (202D,104R) Prognosis 88%

H.R. 2820: Dream Act of 2019 Sponsor: Rep. Lucille Roybal-Allard [D-CA40] Introduced May 17, 2019 Ordered Reported May 22, 2019 Cosponsors 0 Prognosis 70%

H.R. 2821: American Promise Act of 2019 Sponsor: Rep. Nydia Velázquez [D-NY7] Introduced May 17, 2019 Ordered Reported May 22, 2019 Cosponsors 1 (1D) Prognosis 63%

H.R. 6: American Dream and Promise Act of 2019 Sponsor: Rep. Lucille Roybal-Allard [D-CA40] Introduced Mar 12, 2019 Passed House (Senate next) Jun 4, 2019 Cosponsors 232 (232D) Prognosi

Just a small handful of bills presented on immigtation. They are not doing nothing.

originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: tanstaafl

Just checking here.... You're not asking for congress to declare war on Mexico are you?

I am in a way. It is no different than what is done in Pakistan. Except cartels actually kill Americans.

Mexico is far more dangerous to America than any other nation. It isn't the migrants that are the problem. They are a symptom.

At the least the pressure should be on cartels not migrants. Putting sunscreen on your skin cancer isn't going to cure it.

a reply to: UKTruth

Its never going to happen so I would not worry about congress trying to stop him.
Its just another lol brick in the wall.
I wont aggravate people by posting a Pink Floyd video but the song will still worm its way into your head.

a reply to: TheRedneck

That is correct. Stop bombing Pakistan, Yemen, etc and focus on the cartels.

Who ISIS literally studied to be the way they are...

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: UKTruth

Laws are created. Owning a gun could be a crime. Trump made owning a bump stock a crime for instance.

.
That's right, laws are created and as of today it's not illegal to own a gun.

Coming illegally is dependent on the law. Was it asylum?

No, entering the country illegally is breaking the law.
Seeking asylum is not entering the country illegally.

Its illegal to sell coc aine but that didnt stop the CIA from crashing a plane full of it in Mexico.

What has that got to do with anything?

Problem is little more nuanced than most try and advocate

The problem is not nuanced at all. Millions of people have illegally entered the country.

a reply to: UKTruth

It could be. Thats the point.

Its not like the constitution is not subject to ammendments is it?

a reply to: Krakatoa

No not a strawman. A what if....
I chose a subject I knew CWM was close to to illustrate a point about locking up city officials not immigrants.

a reply to: UKTruth

A gun with a bump stock is in fact illegal. As are several types of guns in several states and cities as well as their accessories.


The problem is a bit nuanced when both parties have allowed illegals to work here for decades. As well as Americans funding the cartels who displace them.

originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: UKTruth

It could be. Thats the point.

Its not like the constitution is not subject to ammendments is it?

So, when there is an amendment let us know.
For now, let's live in the real world - one in which millions have broken the law by illegally entering the country....whilst millions of others haven't broken the law by owning a gun.

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: UKTruth

A gun with a bump stock is in fact illegal. As are several types of guns in several states and cities as well as their accessories.


The problem is a bit nuanced when both parties have allowed illegals to work here for decades. As well as Americans funding the cartels who displace them.

A gun with a grenade launcher is also illegal.
That doesn't make guns illegal.

Like I said, there is no nuance. It is not illegal to own a gun, it IS illegal to enter the country, you know, illegally.

a reply to: UKTruth

There is no constitutional guidance on who is allowed in the country.

The problem is very nuanced. We supply cartels with the means to destroy where these people live. The laws do not reflect the need for labor and willingness of many central Americans to learn the trades. Something Americans are not so keen on anymore. Even with high wages.

Also why make it illegal to work without handouts? Just create a visa program and weed out the bad workers and expedite the path for the good ones.

It's all rhetoric from both sides here.

originally posted by: Middleoftheroad
a reply to: luthier

Tribal ideology is why this is a black and white issue to partisans.

Says the guy advocating bombing Mexico.

As a lifelong tradesmen and father of three you are clueless as to the labor available to contractors. There are 300k openings per month with millions of illegals. The wage growth in the trades is substantial. But you have to be willing to do hard work and young people are not even for good money. Construction management is starting to average 100k. There is nobody willing to work anymore.

The problem is that construction businesses that were hiring legal citizens and paying fair labor wages were being undercut by construction companies hiring illegals. Then you have the issue of illegals not complaining about not being compensated for working overtime hours because they are here illegally. Top that off with crap laws against hiring illegals and there is your problem.

This is exactly right. Having been in construction my whole life, I’m surprised how many people don’t get this. It’s why I eventually had to shut down my company, I couldn’t compete in the long run and legally without hiring illegals and I refused to do that.

Construction wages have been stagnant for close to three decades now. I can hire guys right now, all day long, for the same or less wage that it cost me almost 30 yrs ago. Sure, some have seen better money pending geographic, but in general, especially states with a high number of illegals, the wages are crap when coupled with cost of living increases. Pay scales in the construction industry has not kept up with inflation rates, not even close. I’ve been in the business to long for anyone to try and tell me differently.