David Blaine and a fabulous lesson on the truthfulness of ‘news.’

a reply to: jappee

Maybe you're right and it's all just a trick. But I don't understand the trick then.

As far as I understood, it was all set up in a way to not kill him but is still a bullet into a cup which was made to catch it. If it's an illusion then I guess I don't get it then. I don't see where the trick is exactly.

But I could be wrong. Sometimes I don't understand the point behind his tricks after all.

I thought they packed the bullet with less fire power and stuff so it could be done. But maybe I'm wrong. I guess I just don't get what the trick is then.

a reply to: MotherMayEye

He studiously plans and tests his tricks. Keep in mind that he used a .22 rifle. There are all sorts of stock .22 bullets. I'll wager that the type he probably used was one that has NO powder propelling it, merely the explosive force of the standard primer which provides a light "bang" sound. While my box is clearly labeled "Long Rifle" that is a mischaracterization of the actual cartridge. The casing is of that length, but the bullet is quite small, 20 grams versus a ordinary LR bullet weight of 36 or 40 grains. In my estimation, having fired several of those bullet, they would pack about the punch of a low-power, consumer pellet rifle.

His "sunglasses," if of a shooter's type, would stop the bullet from damaging his eyes. There would be no threat of death with such a bullet.

I'm not claiming that this was his rig, but a explanation of how he could have rigged it.

The guy has guts, I'll say that for him.

a reply to: Hazardous1408

He doesn't need to concoct a story to sell out shows

His entire career is based around concocting a story to sell out shows..

There's nothing wrong with that by the way.

a reply to: MotherMayEye

Oh, so the trick can never change. Once it's been done it can never ever change ever-ever to generate interest. It can never 'go awry' to make him more marketable. /sarc

I said nothing of the sort. Surely you understand the difference between something that has occurred, for whatever reason, and something that has been completely fabricated.

And if you think the 'left' hasn't been trolled by fake news...you are wrong. Obama and Factcheck trolled the Left: Link Believe it or not.

Oh for God's sake. That's looney Birther garbage.

originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: MotherMayEye

You're wrong actually. It happened just like he said it did. You can watch it as there is a video documentary about it. On his team is a guy who makes the mouthpiece for him. It's a custom fit mouthpiece that is supposed to stop the bullet. It's a real bullet too btw.

However, on one performance the mouthpiece shattered as it stopped the bullet sending fragments to the back of his throat. This was always a possibility and one of the reasons why so many people close to him don't like that he does it, but he does it anyway.

It normally doesn't shatter like that but this time it did.

Rather than just guess about what you think happened you should just watch the whole video about it.

Ah. Must totes be real. Another story fed to the public, by Blaine, built up to this exact moment and makes the danger of this 'trick' seem even more credible.

No good magician could possibly figure out a plan to make their greatest 'trick' ever seem more credible, eh?

a reply to: introvert

Hyperbole. No recognition of actual evidence nor refutation. I am used to that when I present that particular evidence.

originally posted by: Chadwickus
a reply to: Hazardous1408

He doesn't need to concoct a story to sell out shows

His entire career is based around concocting a story to sell out shows..

There's nothing wrong with that by the way.

I so agree with this. I am cool with the publicity stunt because he professes to be a trickster. He's not pretending to be anything other than what he is and that means he can fool us.

I like how he threw this fake news in our face.

originally posted by: MotherMayEye
a reply to: introvert

Hyperbole. No recognition of actual evidence nor refutation. I am used to that when I present that particular evidence.

Why would I? It's not the topic of the OP and it is not an example of fake news being fabricated. Neither is this story about Blaine.

You are trying to push a conspiracy theory about a birth certificate as proof of Leftist fake news, so it's no surprise that you believe an article about an illusionist is "fake news".

a reply to: introvert

I gave you an example of something that you said you had never seen and provided evidence you did not address nor dispute...

...even if you disagree that the term 'fake news' ever applies to the 'Left' getting trolled, that's an example of fake news being promoted as truthful news by a supposed trusted media watchdog.

a reply to: MotherMayEye

I gave you an example of something that you said you had never seen and provided evidence you did not address nor dispute...

You gave me a link to an ATS thread about a conspiracy regarding a "fake document". You did not give me an example of completely fabricated news stories meant to troll the Left.

...even if you disagree that the term 'fake news' ever applies to the 'Left' getting trolled, that's an example of fake news being sold as truthful news by a supposed media watchdog.

It's not fake news. Did Factcheck concoct the entire BC story for whatever purpose?

No, they did not. It is a real issue.

Even if they are incorrect in their assessment of the validity of the BC, it's still not "fake news".

The lesson here is that yes, it's self promoting, but it's an event that actually happened, it's NOT fake news.

originally posted by: babybunnies
The lesson here is that yes, it's self promoting, but it's an event that actually happened, it's NOT fake news.

If had been reported as a publicity stunt then I would agree. It wasn't though. It was fake news. Seriously, the term is so nebulous, agree to disagree on the finer points of what is 'fake news.'

There seems to be a general mis understanding, especially on the right wings, as to what constitutes "fake news".

Fake news is reporting a fake story about events or actions that never happened. Usually, fake news promotes a fake discussion about the subject of the fake news.

Fake news is often linked to real news making it all the more difficult to understand. Fake news is also often presented as opinion on news shows and talk shows therefore muddling the issue. In general, people CANNOT tell the difference between opinion and actual news.

Some of the most believable fake news uses a real news story in the basis of the fake news. One of the most successful fake news stories of the modern era is the whole "Hillary is responsible for Benghazi" mess that has been perpetrated over the last few years. This was done, not as a statement of fact (which is different from the truth) but rather as an ongoing effort to discredit HIllary Clinton. After all, the GOP have known since 2008 that she was going to be the candidate in 2016, so they've had that long to set her up in the minds of Americans.

Thanks to modern day beliefs, opinion shows and websites such as Rush Limbaugh, Alex Jones, Sean Hannity, Bill O'Reilly, Huffington Post website (almost all of it) are now believed as regular news outlets, often to the determent of actual news outlets.

Most of these people spout their own opinion about stories which is then taken as fact and magnified, and gets blown up into major fake news stories about major items, often linked to actual news to give them added credibility.

It's time that opinion shows were removed from news networks. It's time that the news networks went back to reporting NEWS and not trying to pass off opinion about news events as actual news stories.

I heard there was a call for a new regulation agency - it might actually be a good idea.

originally posted by: introvert
Even if they are incorrect in their assessment of the validity of the BC, it's still not "fake news".

Again, agree to disagree on what this brand new term, 'fake news,' means exactly. It constitutes 'fake news' in the way I understand the term.

originally posted by: babybunnies
There seems to be a general mis understanding, especially on the right wings, as to what constitutes "fake news".

Fake news is reporting a fake story about events or actions that never happened. Usually, fake news promotes a fake discussion about the subject of the fake news.

I am not right wing, but I would say reporting on a near-death experience that never happened constitutes 'fake news.'

Did the DM probe Blaine on whether it was a fake event? No. They simply reported the alleged near-death experience as if it was fact. They repeated fake news and never bothered to challenge it, at all.

I thank you for telling me exactly what you think is 'fake news,' but I do sense that it is a very flexible term to define for partisans.

originally posted by: MotherMayEye

originally posted by: introvert
Even if they are incorrect in their assessment of the validity of the BC, it's still not "fake news".

Again, agree to disagree on what this brand new term, 'fake news,' means exactly. It constitutes 'fake news' in the way I understand the term.

No. I don't think we can agree to disagree on something like this.

We know the definition of 'fake' and the definition of 'news'.

Ever since it was discovered that people on the other side of the globe were profiting from creating websites that produced fake Right Wing news, the term "fake news" has become a term used as a defense mechanism, probably out of embarrassment, that encompasses news that may be factually incorrect, biased or out-of-context. Some are using the term for sources just because they disagree with them.

You don't get to do that here. You cannot change the definitions to fit your political agenda or as a tactic of discourse/debate.

originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: MotherMayEye

originally posted by: introvert
Even if they are incorrect in their assessment of the validity of the BC, it's still not "fake news".

Again, agree to disagree on what this brand new term, 'fake news,' means exactly. It constitutes 'fake news' in the way I understand the term.

No. I don't think we can agree to disagree on something like this.

We know the definition of 'fake' and the definition of 'news'.

Ever since it was discovered that people on the other side of the globe were profiting from creating websites that produced fake Right Wing news, the term "fake news" has become a term used as a defense mechanism, probably out of embarrassment, that encompasses news that may be factually incorrect, biased or out-of-context. Some are using the term for sources just because they disagree with them.

You don't get to do that here. You cannot change the definitions to fit your political agenda or as a tactic of discourse/debate.

I have no political agenda. 'Fake' means 'not real' and 'news' means 'something that is reported by a purported news source as news.'

I am 'allowed' to use those definitions. You aren't the decider. The term 'fake news' is completely machinated and open to interpretation.

I'll agree to disagree with you and you can just stew if that's how you want it.

originally posted by: mOjOm
a reply to: MotherMayEye

You're wrong actually. It happened just like he said it did. You can watch it as there is a video documentary about it. On his team is a guy who makes the mouthpiece for him. It's a custom fit mouthpiece that is supposed to stop the bullet. It's a real bullet too btw.

However, on one performance the mouthpiece shattered as it stopped the bullet sending fragments to the back of his throat. This was always a possibility and one of the reasons why so many people close to him don't like that he does it, but he does it anyway.

It normally doesn't shatter like that but this time it did.

Rather than just guess about what you think happened you should just watch the whole video about it.

Videos lie. And Magicians lie to your face whenever they perform. It's the nature of their art.

I have build props and sets for Magicians, have worked with them as they taught students. I have worked with "up and coming magicians" and consulted with them on technical issues from lighting to effects, to scenery. I have even built a few of their tricks. For the record, I've never helped originate a trick.

Magicians refer to themselves as illusionists for a reason. They are never in the danger you perceive.
I've never worked on this particular gag, but I can say:
The gun doesn't fire a bullet.
A mouthpiece wouldn't stop a bullet. (nor would the cup)

Stop and think about the situation as a whole. At Blaine's level he is not putting his life on the line by doing a trick.

.

.

.

Or do you think things like sawing someone in half is real?


ETA I can also tell you how they do most of the stuff at Disney theme parks. I just wouldn't want to ruin the Magic.

a reply to: randomtangentsrme

I know magic isn't real. But I didn't think this was supposed to be an illusion to start with. I thought the point of it was that it was all set up so that it would work as long as he didn't get off target. As in the bullet was specially packed and the cup and all that was made to withstand the impact.

I didn't think it was supposed to be an illusion but more of a stunt. But I could be wrong. Although I don't see what the trick would be in that case. Why go through all the extra work of having a steel cup and mouthpiece and stuff. If it's an illusion then catch it in your teeth or something like that.

But like I said, I don't always understand the point of some of his stuff anyway. I don't see this as a trick. I see it more of a stunt like getting shot out of a cannon or something.

a reply to: MotherMayEye

As far as fake news goes it's not a left or right issue. False news is just false news and it can fool whoever reads it. Nobody on the left or right matters. Some news with a certain agenda will fool one side or the other or both. But in either case it's bad reporting or just plain lying.

I don't think this would count though since it's entertainment media about a magician. I'm not sure how news worthy it really is for starters. Plus if it is fake, they may have been genuinely fooled themselves, who knows. I mean what makes you think they knew it was fake even if it is fake???