British Military Dressed As Police To Destroy Public Trust In Police

During the miners strike every police division of Greater Manchester Police (that's 14 divisions) sent an operational response unit of 12, some more. Multiply that by every force in the country it's a lot of men. we use to leave on a Sunday evening and be stood down depending on operational requirements later in the week.

As for the military I'm not sure what your trying to say or implicate? Most, in fact I would say a good 50% of officers serving in the police at that time were ex military anyway as I was.

What do you seem to think these so called military were up to? I mean are you trying to say they abducted union officials and interrogated them lol.

You seem to think that all these officers had a political agenda! Wrong it was a job and a good earner I built my conservatory on the strength of it.

If there as any military present it would more than likely be the ACC operating a field kitchen. I
stayed at Ripon Barrack on all my trips and were fed by the army so maybe they took their kitchens on the road lol.

a reply to: redchad

I mean are you trying to say they abducted union officials and interrogated them lol.

This bit seems too silly for ATS, otherwise thank you for the input.

a reply to: Kester

I have no doubt that Thatcher would have been prepared to use members of the Armed Forces in numerous ways during The Miners Strike, Battle of the Beanfield, Wapping etc.
Whether she did or not remains to be proven.

But surely there is enough suggestive evidence of the illegal deployment and activities of police officers at Orgreave that a full and public inquiry should be conducted immediately.

On a slightly different note, it comes as no surprise that we have testament that serving officers viewed the strike as nothing but a payday and delighted in the misery of others. We've always known that but to read it in such a blasé attitude, well......?
Should hang their head in shame!

a reply to: Freeborn two sides to every coin! The misery of others lol. You forgot to mention the poor miners that didn't strike who had to endure being attacked and treated like animals by their so called colleagues and the lorry/coach drivers who went to hospital having had scaffolding poles smashed through their windscreens but I suppose you think that was alright.

a reply to: Kester No please explain! What do you think the military could do that the police couldn't don't forget prior to the strike in the late seventies/eighties greater Manchester police were leading the way in infiltrating football hooligans operation Omega. The Police had effective intelligence gathering skills.

a reply to: redchad

two sides to every coin!

Indeed.
But you seem perfectly happy that you were used as a tool to further a political ideology rather than uphold the law as the police were / are supposed to do.
The police committed many, many crimes during The Miners Strike and other disputes during this period.
The primary concern of many police officers was dragging these disputes out as long as possible so that they could earn large amounts of money on overtime.
They showed zero compassion for their fellow countrymen and very little regard for the laws of this country.

The misery of others lol. You forgot to mention the poor miners that didn't strike who had to endure being attacked by and treated like animals by their so called colleagues but I suppose you think that was alright.

I've never said it was alright, please show me where I've ever said that.....are you trying to imply that to justify your own actions?

Thatcher's destruction of The Miners Union was a pursuit of a political ideology.
The police were willing participants in this action.

The simple FACT is that the police knowingly broke the law to enforce a political action against British people who were breaking no laws at the time.

No, I wasn't a miner.
Yes, I witnessed the police attitude first hand many times during this time period.

a reply to: Freeborn
Upholding the law:
I'm sure most officers there would consider the protection of people who wanted to work from violent thugs intent on doing them harm was upholding the law.

The police committed many crimes:
I'm sorry none of the officers I was with nor I committed any crime.

Dragging the dispute out as long as possible:
Do you seriously think a PC from GMP had any say on how long the dispute was to go on for or was able to extend it so I could order conservatory furniture.

Compassion for fellow country men:
Do you mean the ones that were throwing bricks and bottles at me. You seem to have missed the numerous times police officers and miners were stood around a hot brazier having the crack and passing around the packed lunches.

Willing participants:
Didn't have a choice I was on a rota so every 4 week I'd board a personnel carrier and head off to Ripon. As I said (which doesn't get reported) we had the crack with a lot of miners. Confrontations weren't as often as you'd think and would involve a small percentage of officers and miners present at the sharp end.

Broke the law:
I never broke any laws! I'd argue that the people launching bricks and bottles at us were breaking the law.

Me thinks you read to many tabloids

Yes I earned a good butty but I had to travel away from my family for the week endure the occasional pushing and shoving, verbally abused, showered with bottles, bricks and faeces. Can you tell me any other employees that would do this.

a reply to: redchad

Didn't have a choice . . .

You always have a choice. You chose to take the bankers fiat currency in exchange for creating multi-generational hatred and mistrust of police.

5. Orders and instructions I will, as a police officer, give and carry out lawful orders only, and will abide by Police Regulations

www.college.police.uk...

I don't consent to any 'order' given by any misinformed constable. That only leaves them violence or an explanation that garners my consent to their request. Violence is the language of fools, as we see fools are ridiculed to the grave. An explanation that sways me is possible, but much less likely to succeed if preceded by an attempt to give me an 'order'. I have signed no contract with anyone agreeing to follow 'orders'. Anyone under the illusion they have 'authority' to give me an 'order' is a deluded fantasist and will be treated as such.

You on the other hand may have been under the illusion you had no choice. You could only follow orders. That would be an exceedingly ignorant attitude. Has 'I was only following orders' been accepted in court as a valid excuse?

Some years ago a constable said, "We don't have a choice. We're just the government's foot-soldiers." I don't think the laughter has died down yet.

There is always a choice. Your choice, 'conservatory', is your contribution to this.

MORALE 72.0% of respondents from South Yorkshire Police told us that their morale is currently low.

www.polfed.org...

“Police morale has fallen. Of course it has. The police just feel under constant battering. It’s almost as if they feel they cannot get out from under these things. Officers feel these legacy issues – if I can call them that – are just continually dragging them down and they can’t escape it.”

www.channel4.com...

I would like everyone who sits in your conservatory to be aware I am doing everything possible to raise morale. They get the comfy seat, I get a task that has me sweating buckets.

a reply to: Kester
You really are out of touch or deluded! Out of interest have you ever met a police officer outside of his work environment, they are just normal people with families living in the community and recruited from the community in fact I'd go as far to say that the majority of the public have never had contact with a police officer other than as a victim. When I say I didn't have a choice that's because I Put my name forward as a volunteer and when the next weeks duties were published and I'm on the rosta then I had no choice I'm not going to let my colleagues down.
You seem to think the police service is some dark force hidden away in a fortress and when the government decides a switch is turned on and they are unleashed on the public. My opinion of the miners strike was that the miners weren't happy and withdrew their labour. Unfortunately some miners wanted to work but were intimidated and attacked to prevent them from doing so. Isn't it right that these workers should be allowed to work if it was their will. So who was going to protect them. The Police obviously.
Let me get this straight had I been asked to do anything illegal I would have refused and so would all if my colleagues. We have a right to voice an opinion although we can't strike. I've complained about police officers above my rank before if there out of order I'd be the first at the commanders door or the federation.

As for your original post and the military I've been onto a number of police and army forums and asked the question. And yes some soldiers were used this was on the occasions it got really hairy and the civilian coach drivers wouldn't risk driving through the mob fearing for their own safety. The RCT (Royal Corps of Transport) asked for volunteer drivers and the civvie drivers were replaced by RCT drivers, brave men I might add.

So when you go to bed tonight you can sleep safe because brave men and women are out and about serving and protecting.

By the way have you ever met an angry man?

a reply to: redchad

What do you think the military could do that the police couldn't . . .

Not be seen in police uniform after the event. That's the crux of the matter in my opinion. Shifting blame in a way that can now be used to emotionally sway public opinion.

a reply to: Kester

Just looking at your quoted section there - I did Drumcree several times. I was in military uniform, not police. I never encountered a single soldier in police uniform. The cops loved Drumcree because of the overtime and we're drawn in from all over the Province. Public order training is standard in Ulster policing.

Op BANNER was still on and there were plenty of us deployed openly in green kit, so what would be the point of putting military in police uniform?

a reply to: redchad

Sorry for the delay in replying, been busy with 'real life' issues.

It is generally accepted that police officers were used as agent provocateurs at Orgreave and other industrial disputes around this time.

It certainly wouldn't be unique.

Perhaps you would care to look into the actions of Mark Kennnedy and other 'undercover' police officers.
Now this is the definitive 'can of worms' - how far down the rabbit hole do you want to go?
en.wikipedia.org...(police_officer)
en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...

It is naïve to the extreme to believe that the police weren't used to infiltrate The Miners Union and at times stir up trouble.

I'm no idiot and I don't believe 'all coppers are bastards' - but I do believe that some police officers have been involved in illegal activities at various times over the years in order to help pursue a political agenda of the government of the day rather than simply uphold the law.

a reply to: Freeborn

When the cover includes relationships that result in children those children spend their lives trying to cope.

It doesn't end at the end of the operation. It doesn't even end at the grave.

The people who plan these spying operations are working in a limited time frame with even more limited intellectual abilities.

May the idiots rot in hell.